cycling question?

[longislandmike]

Hi, I have a 140 that I am now cycling. I used RO/DI water and added about 60lbs of live rock and 4 inches of sand (half live) The tank has been running for about a 1 1/2 months. The temp has been on the low side 65-70. I really wasn't thinking of the tank. I have been concentrating on my 92 corner. I figured the tank was on hold (not cycling) just circulating to keep the water moving. Anyway, I added about 15 small fish from a LFS. I am not sure what they are, they look like guppies. I told them my situation and they said my tank should be almost cycled? They told me it would be best to use these fish to cycle rather then using a piece of shrimp. I knew my tank cant be cycled, but decided to take the fish and add them anyway to cycle the tank. It has been about 2 weeks now and all my levels are good? No cycle? Could the tank be cycled?
Thank you all,
LI MIKE

 

[bang guy]

It's most likely cycled. Keep in mind that it's not stable yet so go very slow.
I'm disappointed in your LFS telling you to just dump a bunch of fish in there though. That was very poor advice in my opinion.

 

[shrub125]

I have a question too, what level will the ammonia and nitrite usually spike at? Or is it different in every aquarium?

 

[longislandmike]

Originally Posted by Bang Guy
http:///forum/post/3200281
It's most likely cycled. Keep in mind that it's not stable yet so go very slow.
I'm disappointed in your LFS telling you to just dump a bunch of fish in there though. That was very poor advice in my opinion.
Hi, Thank you for you fast response and help on this. To be honest, I never did a shrimp cycle, I always did a fish cycle. I was always told there is nothing like a fish cycle and it is the best way. After reading here, I realized it wasn't the best way (not for the fish anyway) After I spoke the my LFS that is usually very good and very helpful, I decided to go with the fish again. He did tell me that the fish will be fine and nothing will happen to them (due to my tank already being cycled) I figured I would put them in till I move the tank to my main room. I will be sure to take it slow on this, and leave them in for another moth or so.
Thank you again, I will be sure to keep you posted
Li Mike

 

[btldreef]

All the LFS's in our area suggest to cycle with fish unfortunately.
Mike, did the fish survive? The tank probably is cycled, my tank cycled at a lower temperature like yours, it will still cycle, your rocks just won't have as much coraline.
If it's not cycled to your liking or you want more established water, put the water change water from your corner tank into that one and if that's not enough, PM me, I'll give you my water change water as well. It'll help you build up the beneficial bacteria in the tank.

 

[longislandmike]

Originally Posted by BTLDreef
http:///forum/post/3200296
All the LFS's in our area suggest to cycle with fish unfortunately.
Mike, did the fish survive? The tank probably is cycled, my tank cycled at a lower temperature like yours, it will still cycle, your rocks just won't have as much coraline.
If it's not cycled to your liking or you want more established water, put the water change water from your corner tank into that one and if that's not enough, PM me, I'll give you my water change water as well. It'll help you build up the beneficial bacteria in the tank.
Hi BTLDreef,
Yeah, I never heard of a shrimp cycle till I found this site. I was always told fish is the only way

Thank you very much for your advice and offering to help me with the water, you guys are awesome

I was going to drop you a PM on this but figured you would most likely read the post anyway

Thank you again,
Li Mike

 

[btldreef]

Originally Posted by longislandmike
http:///forum/post/3200303
Hi BTLDreef,
Yeah, I never heard of a shrimp cycle till I found this site. I was always told fish is the only way

Thank you very much for your advice and offering to help me with the water, you guys are awesome

I was going to drop you a PM on this but figured you would most likely read the post anyway

Thank you again,
Li Mike

Of course I'd find it!

I actually had never heard of the shrimp thing until this site either, everyone around us uses small "disposable" fish. I was taught to cycle with damsels, who knew

We're doing a water change later today or tomorrow, do you want me to save the water? It'll be like 15 gallons or so.

 

[longislandmike]

O-yeah, the fish are doing fine. There was a feeder shrimp in there aswell. I didn't notice him when I put the fish in

he is also doing well

 

[longislandmike]

Originally Posted by BTLDreef
http:///forum/post/3200307
Of course I'd find it!

I actually had never heard of the shrimp thing until this site either, everyone around us uses small "disposable" fish. I was taught to cycle with damsels, who knew

We're doing a water change later today or tomorrow, do you want me to save the water? It'll be like 15 gallons or so.
Hi Guys,
No, Thats OK

Thank you very much though. It is a very nice and thoughtful thing to offer. I know it is a pain in the butt to do a water change and even more of a pain to bucket it up and drop it off to another tank. I really do appreciate it.
Thank you both again
LI Mike

 

[btldreef]

Originally Posted by longislandmike
http:///forum/post/3200373
Hi Guys,
No, Thats OK

Thank you very much though. It is a very nice and thoughtful thing to offer. I know it is a pain in the butt to do a water change and even more of a pain to bucket it up and drop it off to another tank. I really do appreciate it.
Thank you both again
LI Mike
Not a big deal at all. We've done it before, you only live one town over and we have tops for our buckets. It's really up to you.

 

[emilaya101]

The rock and sand cycled the tank for you when you weren't paying attention the first two weeks cause you thought it wouldn't. I'm sure there was a small spike, but I'd go ahead ad go all out

 

[srfisher17]

Originally Posted by BTLDreef
http:///forum/post/3200307
Of course I'd find it!

I actually had never heard of the shrimp thing until this site either, everyone around us uses small "disposable" fish. I was taught to cycle with damsels, who knew

We're doing a water change later today or tomorrow, do you want me to save the water? It'll be like 15 gallons or so.
Ammonia is ammonia. I doesn't matter where it comes from:dead shrimp, fish waste, or even a bottle.

 

[btldreef]

Originally Posted by srfisher17
http:///forum/post/3200390
Ammonia is ammonia. I doesn't matter where it comes from:dead shrimp, fish waste, or even a bottle.
Oh, I know that now, didn't realize it for a long time though. Every LFS in our area uses damsels for cycling. I had never heard of the whole "shrimp" method before this site and just never thought about it. I've never actually fully cycled a tank though. When I started, I used water from other peoples tanks, live and and cured rocks, waited two days and put in damsels, none of them died and then a week later added clownfish, etc. I've done this in three tanks and never had an issue.
So for me, water from other peoples tanks does help build up the beneficial bacteria and helps to speed up the process. On a local forum that I belong to, people beg for water change water out of peoples tanks when they're starting up a new tank. I give my "waste" water away all the time.

 

[bang guy]

That's interesting but old tank water really isn't useful for helping a cycle.
I'm not a huge fan of the shrimp method either but it's lightyears better than tormenting a live fish. Measured doses of ammonia is the most accurate way if you test often but just plain old fish food will work nearly as well. A lot of hobbiest make the mistake of trying to get a really high ammonia level and impair their live rock in the process. The best plan is to maintain a trace ammonia level until the bacteria can easily process a steady amount of ammonia and then continue feeding the bacteria until the populations stabilize.

 

[btldreef]

Originally Posted by Bang Guy
http:///forum/post/3200445
That's interesting but old tank water really isn't useful for helping a cycle.
I'm not a huge fan of the shrimp method either but it's lightyears better than tormenting a live fish. Measured doses of ammonia is the most accurate way if you test often but just plain old fish food will work nearly as well. A lot of hobbiest make the mistake of trying to get a really high ammonia level and impair their live rock in the process. The best plan is to maintain a trace ammonia level until the bacteria can easily process a steady amount of ammonia and then continue feeding the bacteria until the populations stabilize.
Yes, I'm not a fan of torturing fish either, I just never knew of any other method until recently. I never even thought to just add ammonia in small amounts, but it absolutely makes sense (although I think I'd still be scared to actually do it).
The used water is more for the beneficial bacteria than for help cycling. It's worked well for me in the past. I'm still not preaching that this is the best method, especially for a new hobbyist, but if you've had a few tanks and are starting another, it's a pretty effective method and greatly speeds up the time.

 

[srfisher17]

Originally Posted by BTLDreef
http:///forum/post/3200448
Yes, I'm not a fan of torturing fish either, I just never knew of any other method until recently. I never even thought to just add ammonia in small amounts, but it absolutely makes sense (although I think I'd still be scared to actually do it).
The used water is more for the beneficial bacteria than for help cycling. It's worked well for me in the past. I'm still not preaching that this is the best method, especially for a new hobbyist, but if you've had a few tanks and are starting another, it's a pretty effective method and greatly speeds up the time.
There is hardly any bacteria in the water. Bacteria colonizes in the LR, substrate, even the filter media--not in the water column.

 

[btldreef]

Originally Posted by srfisher17
http:///forum/post/3200491
There is hardly any bacteria in the water. Bacteria colonizes in the LR, substrate, even the filter media--not in the water column.

I don't know. But using tank water from other tanks has always worked for me and many that are in my local reef club as well.

 

[bang guy]

Originally Posted by BTLDreef
http:///forum/post/3200493
%

% I don't know. But using tank water from other tanks has always worked for me and many that are in my local reef club as well.
If there is no other source of bacteria (sand, rock, filter pad, etc.) then there actually is some bacteria in the water, just not very much. A thimbleful of sand probably has more bacteria in it than an entire tank full of water.
I wouldn't discourage you from continuing with something that works for you though. It's certainly not going to cause any harm.
I also am too leery of using straight ammonia. I tend to just use fish food to maintain an ammonia level between 0.25ppm and 0.5ppm. I've cycled dozens of tanks and that has never failed to give me a good result.

 

[longislandmike]

Hi, Thank you all for your input on this. I have always used tank water when I could, if I had the chance. I tried to used it because one of my LFS tried selling me cycled water one time. It was bottled up (not there water) I am not sure what company it was, but it was very expensive. I figured it would be like adding live rock or live sand?
I am new to this site, and I have learned so much from you all.
Thank you again
LI Mike

 

[btldreef]

Originally Posted by Bang Guy
http:///forum/post/3200511
If there is no other source of bacteria (sand, rock, filter pad, etc.) then there actually is some bacteria in the water, just not very much. A thimbleful of sand probably has more bacteria in it than an entire tank full of water.
I wouldn't discourage you from continuing with something that works for you though. It's certainly not going to cause any harm.
I also am too leery of using straight ammonia. I tend to just use fish food to maintain an ammonia level between 0.25ppm and 0.5ppm. I've cycled dozens of tanks and that has never failed to give me a good result.
Adding fish food also works well. A thing a also learned from this site.