Day 13: Missing a clown...

meowzer

Moderator
Originally Posted by 2Quills
http:///forum/post/3284518
No one is saying he is Meowzer. I don't think he is a cerial fish murdere or anything. Just having a discussion whether the lil guys feel pain or not. Comon sense of keeping fish for years and observing they're behavior leads me to believe they do.
LOL......I know you weren't......I was actually talking to Flower
I should have said that.....
I also believe they feel pain, and I don't need any scientist to tell me that.....I watch them...and have had fish also for many many years too ;)
 

flower

Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by meowzer
http:///forum/post/3284521
LOL......I know you weren't......I was actually talking to Flower
I should have said that.....
I also believe they feel pain, and I don't need any scientist to tell me that.....I watch them...and have had fish also for many many years too ;)

I edited my post so there won't be any harsh words I have to take back. I feel that dark cloud looming ...LOL.
 

flower

Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by meowzer
http:///forum/post/3284530
You're so funny....LOL.....

I have a such sharp tongue...On Sabbath when the virtues woman was read..When my husband got to the part where only kindness could be found on my lips...the whole family held back a chuckle.
 

meowzer

Moderator
Originally Posted by Flower
http:///forum/post/3284535

I have a such sharp tongue...On Sabbath when the virtues woman was read..When my husband got to the part where only kindness could be found on my lips...the whole family held back a chuckle.
HAHA...I hope you never get mad at me ;)
I type nicer then I think
 
J

jstdv8

Guest
I'll tell you what. you hook a king salmon in the upper lip and he will go absolutley crazy, completely different from being hooked anywhere else on the face or body for that matter.
Has to be a pain reflex
 

dutchswan

Member
Originally Posted by Jstdv8
http:///forum/post/3284668
I'll tell you what. you hook a king salmon in the upper lip and he will go absolutley crazy, completely different from being hooked anywhere else on the face or body for that matter.
Has to be a pain reflex
Read the links below and you will see why it is not pain.
 

meowzer

Moderator
Originally Posted by bigdookie
http:///forum/post/3284685
why would it be too early to add the fish if the levels are all good?
You need to make sure the tank is stable....the parameters need to stay good, then you should start with a small clean up crew while you continue to test
 

kclester

Active Member
if fish dont have a nervous system then when a diver

[hr]
a fish how come they instantly start shakeing like they are in shock.......they HAVE to have a nervous system and feel so type of pain
 

dutchswan

Member
Originally Posted by kclester
http:///forum/post/3284737
if fish dont have a nervous system then when a diver

[hr]
a fish how come they instantly start shakeing like they are in shock.......they HAVE to have a nervous system and feel so type of pain
The have a nevervous system, just an under-developed one. And, it requires a sophisticated enough brain to receive pain messages. What you are observing is called reflex. For instance; when you burn your hand on the stove, your hand jerks back away from the heat source. Your hand is not jerking back because your brain is telling it to do so, it is what is known as an autonomic reflex. The receptors sense something is wrong, and tell the hand to move away from the stove. This happens independent of your brain. Once this is done, the pain receptors on the burned portion of your hand send a message to your brain saying "hey...by the way, don't touch that hot thing again...oh and; here is some pain as a reminder." Pain is your body's way of telling you that something is wrong. A fish has the autonomic reflex, but lacks the capacity to understand what has happened.
 

xcali1985

Active Member
I find it all interesting, no one knows for sure. Every living thing has a nervous system however, its the way the brain communicates through the body. Out side of single celled organisms.
Do I believe fish feel pain, IMHO, no. One of the reasons I BELIEVE this to be true is...well ill use the hook example. If you remove the hook and place the fish in a reservoir to monitor it will most likely revert back to its normal routine. Ive caught fish before and after removing and placing in a bucket it calmly swam around the bucket. If a dentist drills an exposed area of your mouth you don't walk away as soon as the drill is removed.
I like dutch believe that all animals have reflexes that are both behavioral and defensive in nature that are triggered by natural triggers through evolution. His explanation of the burn was exactly how it was explained to me when I was in biology. The reaction is a reflex, the pain is a reminder not to do whatever it was again.
Anyways, its my little opinion probably not even worth the metal that 2 cents would be printed on, but Ive seen fish lose eyes, ive seen goldfish feed as food lose chunks out of there bodies and still swim around calmly. The eventually die due to the injuries, but if it was in pain I would think it would park a seat at the bottom of the tank and stay there.
I'll give NEMO a call and see what he has to say and update.
 
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