dirty tanks?

[buzz]

OK, Bob...you bring this on yourself. You sit here ignoring the advise everyone is giving, and preach to everyone as if your methods are the gospel of reefkeeping.
Eating waste only creates more concentrated waste? UH....no...when you eat, do you excrete everything you eat? Or just the byproduct...same thing here. It becomes LESS concentrated, and less in qty.
How do you figure that the food the fish eats replaces trace elements in the water?
And again, your advice on water changes and your reason for it is off base.
<<sigh>>

 

[beaslbob]

Originally posted by Buzz
OK, Bob...you bring this on yourself. You sit here ignoring the advise everyone is giving, and preach to everyone as if your methods are the gospel of reefkeeping.
Just shareing my experiences. Don't mean to preach. Now lets take a look at what we agree on:
Eating waste only creates more concentrated waste? UH....no...when you eat, do you excrete everything you eat? Or just the byproduct...same thing here. It becomes LESS concentrated, and less in qty.
Totally agree. The resulting waste does become less in volume. As I said before more concentrated. And it became concentrated by a living breathing thing which used that waste to produce carbon dioxide, urea, and contribute to the bioload in addition to the less waste. Again the nitrogen cycle must operate and break all that down. I just prefer plant life to consume the ammonia nitrate to complete the cycle.
How do you figure that the food the fish eats replaces trace elements in the water?
The trace elements in the water are for the fish. Seems to me that iodine, calcuim, magnesium and other trace elements are in the food we feed the fish. The only question is whether or not those things increase of decrease in time.
And again, your advice on water changes and your reason for it is off base.
<<sigh>>
Thank you for your opinion. You welcome to disagree. What is you experiences with not doing water changes? Or are you doing them just because they seem correct?

 

[kinkfish]

I see what you are saying if you have a very well established tank
the need to do water changes is minimal,because youy have a living ecosystem.And their is something that will eat everything a living food chain . And in turn will give you water that never needs changed?

 

[reefnut]

What Bob is basically saying is he don't know nothing about a well established tank.

 

[kinkfish]

maybe bob thinks it if the fish want to have some fun pour some vodka and cranberry in the sump let them have a little party.

 

[kinkfish]

I do water changes because I want to get fresh water in the tank
and in my opionion the fish seem more active after I do so.

 

[reefnut]

Jackie, thanks for the suggestion. I didn't realize the Ignore Feature worked. Does the Buddy List do anything?

 

[reefnut]

Yea I got it working... now we'll see if I have any discipline lol.

 

[buzz]

Bob, this is where the problem lies. You seem to think that in order to advance in the hobby, you have to experience everything for yourself. That is not the case. I do not need to experience the effects of not doing water changes to know whether or not they are beneficial. I can feed off of the experiences of others. I can look at YOUR experiences and compare.
We are talking about apples and oranges here.
Yes, over time, on very established systems, the frequency of water changes can become less, and some even have the success of not doing any changes for years. However, those that successfully go with less changes dose more additives to maintain adequate levels in the water. If not, their systems suffer. I don't need to traumatize my fish to know this.

 

[birdy]

I didn't even know there was such thing as an ignore list. What a great thing. Well there's one for my ignore list.

 

[wrassecal]

Hey Buzz how bout a pic of your tank? And beaslbob how bout a pic of your sw tank? You know, so we can show a little bit about what you guys are talking about.....

 

[buzz]

My tank is currently in transition, as I am setting up my 100g right now and am in the process of moving things over to it from my 60g. However, that is set up with a sump, a skimmer, a fuge, a DSB, LR, plenty of light (MH and VHO), and regular water changes.
As soon as that is finished, I'd be happy to post pics (of course, cameraless boy here needs to borrow a digital camera... )
However, if a comparison is what you seek, in one of Bob's recent posts on his progress, he posted pics of his tank, and Beth posted pics of hers in comparison. If you search for that thread, you will see some major differences in tanks.
Some may have seen the post all ready...
And Deb, just to clarify, my concern here is the advice that is given to newbies in the hobby. I honestly do not have any personal issues with Bob. Not sure if you are familiar with the history here, but for any that aren't, do a search on Bob's posts.
I actually had what I considered to be a pleasant conversation in a post with Bob not too long ago. But now I am seriously thinking he is simply out to create problems.
EDIT - just bumped that post for your viewing pleasure...

 

[buzz]

Best I can do right now is post an older pic of my 29g...again, these are old pics. Things look better now.

 

[buzz]

and another...

 

[buzz]

and one more, of my anemone....

 

[wrassecal]

Oh, I'm familiar Buzz that's why I made the suggestion. So that anyone reading the advice on this post would have some visual comparison to help them decide. I did forget about the post in the photo section though. Geez, since Beth got that new camera she's getting some amazing shots. Her tank is awesome. Even after a year of listening and heeding her advice, I was blown away by her tank. And dangit she mastered her new camera already and I still haven't mastered mine

 

[buzz]

Gotcha! I just wanted to make sure, because I don't want my posts to come across badly either...

 

[overanalyzer]

beaslbob - you must be extremely happy - afterall ignorance is bliss.

 

[wrassecal]

Well in cases like this a picture says a thousand words. Can't wait to see the new tank when it's up and running. Thanks to Ryan I think all of us who didn't already have good digi's ended up getting them at Christmas.
I do a 10% water change about once a month to six weeks. For reasons listed above and for replacement of essential elements.

 

[thomas712]

Well just got done reading all of this, and I have promised to be good (for a while). so I'm going to leave it alone.
Overanalyzer
Buzz
Jackie1
Reefnut
Wrassecal
Bob