DIY sump questions

noobzilla

Member
I've got a couple spare tanks sitting around and have been thinking of converting one of them into a sump/ref, and I've got a few questions... The main one being, what should I do to achieve something that will work well, and not cost me my first born child? I've been looking at them at the LFS and $300 is the starting price, but I'm sure I could build one for half that, if not less.
I'm currently running a 55g with a canister filter off behind it, can I still use the same pump in the filter, and just use it empty as a pump (rather then keeping filter media in the trays)? I've got a spare 10 or 20 gallon tank, I'm guessing the 20g would be the way to go, so long as it fits under my main tank. Any pics or idea's would be greatly appreciated! I'm not wanting to go to crazy with it, to try and keep it simple and effective, In case I leave and someone else needs to care for it for awhile. I'll most likely be converting the 10g into a QT while I have extra time on my hands.
 
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smallreef

Guest
Just need to put a few baffles in it to slow the flow and trap the detritus .... there are alot of pictures in the forums of home made sumps.. and yes the 20g would be the best... one of the biggest uses of a sump is for mechanical and biological filtration.. it also gives you the added water volume for stability...
With a sump I ususally like to have 2 or 3 chambers.. the first chamber where you would have the water coming in fromt he tank above into a filter sock or something else to catch the gunk... the second chamber for a skimmer and the 3rd for the return pump...
I dont know about the pump for your canister filter.... it may not be strong enough to pump back up depending on the head...
 

beaslbob

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noobzilla http:///t/393002/diy-sump-questions#post_3493362
I've got a couple spare tanks sitting around and have been thinking of converting one of them into a sump/ref, and I've got a few questions... The main one being, what should I do to achieve something that will work well, and not cost me my first born child? I've been looking at them at the LFS and $300 is the starting price, but I'm sure I could build one for half that, if not less.
I'm currently running a 55g with a canister filter off behind it, can I still use the same pump in the filter, and just use it empty as a pump (rather then keeping filter media in the trays)? I've got a spare 10 or 20 gallon tank, I'm guessing the 20g would be the way to go, so long as it fits under my main tank. Any pics or idea's would be greatly appreciated! I'm not wanting to go to crazy with it, to try and keep it simple and effective, In case I leave and someone else needs to care for it for awhile. I'll most likely be converting the 10g into a QT while I have extra time on my hands.
First of all you might consider a diy pvc overflow.
see: https://forums.saltwaterfish.com/t/370270/the-beaslbob-trap-s
I highly recommend you set up a test system using plastic storage containers in your garage and insure you don't have floods during:
power out
power return
over flow blockage/failure.
I do recommend you have seperate containers for the refugium and sump.
I found that playing around with a test setup was much more educational then reading posts and other research.
Still just my .02
 

red tiger

Member
There are 101 ways to build sumps. Some can be very extravagant and elaborate and other might be a bit fugly but functional.
I have used a 20 long in the past, and used no baffles, placed my skimmer in it, heater, reactors, and media sock while using a Laguna Max Flo pump as a return. I had to need of a bubble trap since there was no micro bubbles created.
Then I added a 5 gallon tank, made a fuge out of it having a 4" sand bed, cheatomorpha and some rubble, The 5g tank was drilled with a 3/4" bulk head, and it sat higher then my sump so gravity did it's job and the water overflowed down into my sump return area.
You got to find what works for you and your set up.
 

noobzilla

Member
With all the reading I've been doing about people having small floods, I defiantly plan on garage testing it first! lol I was actually looking at the page you linked yesterday and planned on running to home depot for some PVC Beaslbob. As far as setting up separate sump/ref, I really don't have the room, unless I empty and move things.
I can fit a 20g off to the side, but really don't have room for another, above it. I've been looking at lots of different designs, but they all have internal pumps, I haven't found anything external yet.
What are reactors? are you talking the upright rocket ship looking things that I see in some pics? Is a media sock similar to a thick nylon stocking that goes on the end of the pipe? Would that be similar to what my first tray is in my canister? (Just kind of a rough sponge that allows water to go, but traps the big stuff) I saw the Fluval canister on clearance and it moved more water then what I was needing, so I grabbed it, rather then researching and thinking about things. I think its a 405 maybe? After seeing what a pain in the arse it was to clean without making a huge mess I'm thinking I may have chosen the wrong way to go.
Thanks for the useful info so far! :)
 

beaslbob

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noobzilla http:///t/393002/diy-sump-questions#post_3493397
With all the reading I've been doing about people having small floods, I defiantly plan on garage testing it first! lol I was actually looking at the page you linked yesterday and planned on running to home depot for some PVC Beaslbob. As far as setting up separate sump/ref, I really don't have the room, unless I empty and move things.
...
I could fit a plastic container for the refugium on one side of my stand and a smaller container on the left side. the seperate container can work even at the same height. By using a small container as the sump, the larger refugium will run at a constant level so more water is in the refugium section. The water levels will vary more in the smaller sump which will allow for easier adjustments.
When you get to home depot you can use reducing bushings to build bulkheads to go through the container walls. The pump can them be external to the sump and in line using that.
It will take IME surprising large diameter pvc between the refug and sump. like 2" or so.
My home depot also had pvc bulk hear fittings in the apliance department. For trays that went under washers. People bought the treys but did not want the bulkheads. So they just gave me some. But that said they are only 1" diameter.
Let us know what you come up with. It is fun and rewarding getting these things working.
I put on a demonstration at a club meeting 4 years ago. One guy stated these look like they were designed by some 1/2 drunk engineer. I corrected him by pointing out I was totally drunk. LOL
my .02
 

noobzilla

Member
Update: I was at my LFS yesterday and ended up grabbing a 20g long off them dirt cheap, then only problem is, it has a hole drilled in the bottom. I picked up a pump that's rated for 620 GPH, I'm wondering if I can put the pump in the main tank, then have the sump above it a bit and try to gravity feed it down through the hole in the new sump tank, back into the main? I also have a 10g set aside for a refugium, I'm just going to have to build a custom stand to fit everything where it needs to go.
One other question I have is, has anyone tried using flex hose as apposed to PVC? I'm thinking with something flexible it would eliminate most of elbows and get most flow out of the pump.
I'm thinking of running across the street to Home Depot in a couple hours and hope to be getting the baffles and piping I'll need to get started on this.
 
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smallreef

Guest
Yep.. LOVE flex hose... just make sure and get the braided kind... and clamps.. use the stainless ones out of the water and the annoying plastic ones underwater ...
I have braided hose from my pump up to the top of my tank then a barbed fitting to some locline pieces into the tank..
 

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by smallreef http:///t/393002/diy-sump-questions#post_3494514
Yep.. LOVE flex hose... just make sure and get the braided kind... and clamps.. use the stainless ones out of the water and the annoying plastic ones underwater ...
I have braided hose from my pump up to the top of my tank then a barbed fitting to some locline pieces into the tank..
+100%
I have always used the braided flex hose, it's easy and cheap to replace instead of trying to clean it with a snake brush. The biggest plus is that because it's clear you can watch the flow of water.
 

acrylic51

Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flower http:///t/393002/diy-sump-questions#post_3494545
+100%
I have always used the braided flex hose, it's easy and cheap to replace instead of trying to clean it with a snake brush. The biggest plus is that because it's clear you can watch the flow of water.
Also the biggest down fall of clear PVC.....Also super easy to pin with a hose clamp when tightening and then creating micro bubble issues.....
 

noobzilla

Member
So in other words, use cation with the flexible stuff? I got all my baffles cut last night, then went to silicone the first one in and realized one very important detail when using a caulking gun... Don't forget to put a nail in before you squeeze. I've got to go pick up a new tube, so I can try this again.
 

2quills

Well-Known Member
Spa Flex is flexible pvc tubing that can be used like and glued up with standard (sch 40) pvc fittings. Did I mention that it's flexible?
The caulking gun thing is part of the joy of doing things for yourself.
 

noobzilla

Member
I have everything built and sealed now, but run into the problem not wanting to fork out $100+ for an overflow box. After spending most of the afternoon and many walks to Home Depot I built myself a PVC overflow, just to find out there's not enough room for 3/4 PVC and my lights. I'm currently using a canister with a decent flow rate and wonder if anyone has tried just using the canister with no trays or anything in it to pull the water into the sump tank?
If I try this should I position the intake from the DT high or low? Due to the location of the sump I don't have a lot of gravity to pull the water into the sump.
Here's a pic of why PVC really won't work for me.

I've been looking into making an acrylic one, however, I had a hard enough time with cutting and glueing for the sump. I really don't think I have the know how or space to try and heat and bend. Plus I'm sick of measuring, re-measuring, cutting, then something not coming out square.
 

acrylic51

Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noobzilla http:///t/393002/diy-sump-questions#post_3496365
I have everything built and sealed now, but run into the problem not wanting to fork out $100+ for an overflow box. After spending most of the afternoon and many walks to Home Depot I built myself a PVC overflow, just to find out there's not enough room for 3/4 PVC and my lights. I'm currently using a canister with a decent flow rate and wonder if anyone has tried just using the canister with no trays or anything in it to pull the water into the sump tank?
If I try this should I position the intake from the DT high or low? Due to the location of the sump I don't have a lot of gravity to pull the water into the sump.
Here's a pic of why PVC really won't work for me.

I've been looking into making an acrylic one, however, I had a hard enough time with cutting and glueing for the sump. I really don't think I have the know how or space to try and heat and bend. Plus I'm sick of measuring, re-measuring, cutting, then something not coming out square.
I think your making the project harder than it needs to be.....For the overflow box or anything of that nature no need at all for heating and bending.....All your talking about is making to rectangular boxes.....What tools are you using to cut your acrylic with......
 

noobzilla

Member
A sharp knife for the big cuts and a dremel for the baffle cuts. I was looking at some hang on tank fish boxes that I was thinking of drilling out and trying to put some piping through.
 

acrylic51

Active Member
Do you have a table saw or router.......I'm also curious where your purchasing your acrylic from as well.....
 

noobzilla

Member
I used to have both, however over the years a lot of my power tools have grown legs and walked away, so I stopped buying power tools and stay old school. People don't walk off with manual tools near as quickly. I have a Home Depot across the street that I get the acrylic from.
 

acrylic51

Active Member
Check your local Yellow pages and look for a plastics/acrylic supplier.....They should be able to fill all your needs....The stuff at HomeDepot and Lowes is iffy stuff IMHO.....
 

noobzilla

Member
The return pump I bought went on sale, so I picked a second one up, things seem to be working now after lots of tweeking on a c-clamp, unfortunately I had to move a powerhead and made a huge mess of things in my main tank. I'll try to post some pics when things clear up again.
 
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