Do I have enough lights

Do I have enough lights in my reaf tank for corals and Anemones?
Tank size:
48" x 15" x 18"
Lights:
2x65w 6,700k/10,000k; 2x65w 420nm/460nm
How much light is the ideal?
 
Originally Posted by reefkprZ
for just about any softies, and lps corals yes. no to anemones, clams, or most SPS.
I have a Hatian Pink Tip and a BTA in there for about a month now and they seem to be doing fine. My clams all have died off thou. How much lights do you think I need? I would like to stay with the PC for now. Can I replace the Bulbs to a higher wattage?
Thanks
 

miaheatlvr

Active Member
Defiantely not enough lighting,, especially for the BTA, How can you up the wattage? are your ballasts able to incorporate higher wattage?
 

butters

Member
he has enough light for a BTA, BTA's are not high light anemone's like everyone thinks they are.
i have a GBTA in a 55 with the same lighting.
he would look perfect if he didnt get swept up by my skimmer pump.
im not shure if this is allowed, but i think it is cuz its not a compeditors site right?
here is a great BTA site
http://www.karensroseanemones.com/
pink tip haitans are the same....
 

perfectdark

Active Member
butters said:
he has enough light for a BTA, BTA's are not high light anemone's like everyone thinks they are.QUOTE]
I agree, you have sufficient lighting for a BTA.. I have one in a 29 cube with 72 total watts and it stands 20" high. There are times when it doesnt want the light even in that tank.
 

dawman

Active Member
You can keep your BTA with that light fixture as I have for years with a similar light .
 

reefkprz

Active Member
you know I hear that all the time and eventually the anemone ends up splitting a bunch (for some reason people think thats a good sign and its not) and eventually dying. usually a couple years is tops, these animals can live for over a hundred years. I have heard people say 7 years as the record of what I have heard, when I start hearing of people keeping BTA's under compacs for 75+ years then I'll start believing it, untill then I am going to reccomend agaqinst housing anemones without better lighting.
7 years out of a hundred, not what I would consider a success.
 

perfectdark

Active Member
IMO Unless you can definitivly tell that the anenome died do to poor lighting and not from something else, how can you conclude that its death was because of inadequate lights. I mean other than the obvious bleeching. IMO 2 and or 7 years is long enough to equate its demise to just about anything.. even captivitiy for that matter. In the ocean these animals can move anywhere they want to get to or away from anything. They are bound by nothing and being that we know so little about them alot of information we get is based on people experiences to say that ultimatly its death was met because after 7 years it didnt have sufficient lighting IMO I think is a bit unfair. Point the reason toward factual evidence and I wont disagree.
Just a question have you ever heard of anyone keeping BTA under MH's for 75+ years.. or anything longer than 7 years? Im curious as this maybe something that needs further explanation than just what someone has heard.
 

reefkprz

Active Member
Recently, Joyce Wilkerson took a survey on captive anemone life span. Only 5 percent of hobbyists with 2-5 years of experience had been able to keep anemones alive for more than two years, and only 1 out of 32 anemones lived for more than 5 years. The anemones simply aren't surviving.
this may indeed have to do with more than just inadequate lighting, in fact I almost gaurantee it does. BUT why add insult to injury by compounding the ways to fail with these delicate creatures. Research shows, (google anemone lighting or something) that especially Condylactyilus anemones need HIGH lighting. you provide your Opinion with no "research" to back it up yet when I provide mine, you say I need to back it up with research. If you do your own research you will find all the same info I have and eventually come to the same conclusion, that overall faliur increases the lower the lighting used. poor water quality has a better chance of killing an anemone thats under barely sufficient light, lack of diet has a better chance of ki8lling an anemone under insufficient light as it cant compensate for food with photosynthesis as it would be able to if it had Great lighting. Its not really a hard concept to grasp. There are TONS of research papers, and HIghly expirienced aquariests wo all for some reason after MANY years in the hobby generally say the same thing as I do, the better the lighting the better chance of your anemone living longer.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
quoted from
Keeping Anemones By Rob Toonen. Posted to Reefkeepers emailing list, Monday 16th to 1999
First, although the anemones that host clownfishes typically harbor photosynthetic algal symbionts (zooxanthellae, zoochlorellae, etc.), and algal production in intense light appears to be the major source of energy for anemones, all anemones require some animal prey for long-term survival. The shape and behavior of tropical host anemones both serve to increase the amount of area available for "harvesting" sunlight, and with few exceptions, intense lighting (typical of coral reef tanks) is required for anemones gain sufficient energy for survival.
Secondly, and perhaps most discouraging is that these animals are essentially immortal in nature. They certainly appear capable of living several hundred years (yes, you read that right -- hundreds!), and do not seem to age in the way with which we are accustomed, but rather live on until disease, a predator or some natural disaster kills them. Despite their natural longevity, the life span of the vast majority of captive anemones is less than a two years. A recent survey of reefkeepers conducted by Joyce Wilkerson found that among a couple hundred respondents only 5% of hobbyists with *2-5 years* of reefkeeping experience had managed to keep their anemone alive for 2 years or more (this survey was specific to the clownfish/anemone host species Entacmaea, Heteractis, Stiochodactyla, Macrodactyla & Cryptodendrum). That's not very encouraging is it? To make it worse, among hobbyists with less than 2 years of experience, nearly half of the anemones purchased were dead within 3 months -- overall only 1 in 13 anemones survived for 3 years or more and only 1 in 32 anemones survived for 5 or more years in captivity (which by most accounts is considered success in this hobby). Even if we consider 5 years to be a ripe old age for these animals in an aquarium (this is roughly the equivalent of considering rearing a human to 1 year as being a "success"), only 3% of anemones purchased ever make it to this age (and if you read Shane's article entitled Dawn of the Dead, you should begin to realize that only a small percentage of "difficult animals" even survive long enough to make it home into an aquarium). This survey included many highly experienced and profession reef keepers. If I remember correctly, Alf Nielson topped this list of experienced aquarists with 32 years of reef tank experience, and the other respondents included many of the people who write the aquarium texts that we all refer to when faced with some difficulty in our own aquarium. Let me reiterate this despite the general expertise of the people who participated in the survey, only 5% of people can keep an anemone alive for more that 2 years! That is pretty abysmal for an animal with a natural life span of hundreds of years; *especially* given that, according to Daphne Fautin (co-author of the popular book Anemone Fishes and their Host Sea Anemones), removal of these anemones and their clownfishes is causing serious changes in the natural communities that she studies (and I heard rumors that she has recently become an active advocate of trying to outlaw the collection and importation of anemones). In their book, Fautin and Allen mention that some populations they once studied in the Philippines have become extinct as a result of collection and the habitat destruction associated with dynamite/cyanide fishing.
 

reefkprz

Active Member
honestly I can dig up far more, but its a waste of time IMO my opinion stands firm at 260w of PC is not sufficient for the long term health of anemone, believe whatever you like, I'll continue to advocate better lighting, because this is my opinion from my own research/expirience/reading of other peoples research and expiriences, as well as the many studies that have been done on these creatures.
I'm not going to try and convince you of anything except to do some more research and dig around a bit both on the net and in books, I feel If you find the information on your own from many sources you will be more inclined to form your own opinion free of the bias that the information is provided from someone whom you currently disagree with.
 

perfectdark

Active Member
Please dont misinturpret my intentions here. I am in no way trying to provide an argument to the contrary. All I am doing is asking for factual scenario's, being on this message board for as little time as I have, its discouraging as to how little information is truley fact. And what you are told by someone either on this board or else where LFS perhaps is more of their opinion or what they have experienced rather than what is actually true.
I thank your for the information you provided and I plan to continue learning all I can regarding this hobby. But weeding through all the information and finding fact from opinion is not easy...
 

reefkprz

Active Member
Originally Posted by PerfectDark
But weeding through all the information and finding fact from opinion is not easy...
your not kidding. Thats one reason I encourage people to do their own research no matter what any one person says including myself. it often is hard when 230people have the same misconseption, there are a lot of "myth" versus actual fact in this hobby. and a lot of people choose the answers they want to hear over the ones they dont, then they recite the information like its gospel. its very tough to sort through I agree.
 

dawman

Active Member
"when I start hearing of people keeping BTA's under compacs for 75+ years then I'll start believing it, untill then I am going to reccomend agaqinst housing anemones without better lighting."
Their is record of anyone keeping an anemone for 75 years in captivity . Rod has kept some for many years and I believe the longest in captivity is 20 years at the Shed Aquarium .
I am assuming you are just posting by info you dug up and not on experience .
There was research posted by Butters and that is a good site for a lot of info . But I`m sure you didn`t read it much if at all since it disagrees with your opinion .
"7 years out of a hundred, not what I would consider a success."
Another fact you twist around . 7 years in captivity is pretty good . Your 100 years is a guestimate that nems have a lifespan in the ocean , not in our tiny tanks . Comparing let`s say a 300 gallon tank to the ocean is just stupidity .
 

reefkprz

Active Member
Originally Posted by Dawman
"when I start hearing of people keeping BTA's under compacs for 75+ years then I'll start believing it, untill then I am going to reccomend agaqinst housing anemones without better lighting."
Their is record of anyone keeping an anemone for 75 years in captivity . Rod has kept some for many years and I believe the longest in captivity is 20 years at the Shed Aquarium .
I am assuming you are just posting by info you dug up and not on experience .
There was research posted by Butters and that is a good site for a lot of info . But I`m sure you didn`t read it much if at all since it disagrees with your opinion .
actually would love to read it, especially if it disagrees with my opinion. do you have a few key words so I could maybe google it?
as for the record beign 75years under what type of lighting?
 

reefkprz

Active Member
as as far as expirience goes I have kept a rock anemone for 4+ years now, I had condylactilus for about a year, but it wasnt doing the greatest under my 500+ watts of PC lighting, so I sold it.
 

dawman

Active Member
Originally Posted by reefkprZ
actually would love to read it, especially if it disagrees with my opinion. do you have a few key words so I could maybe google it?
as for the record beign 75years under what type of lighting?

Natural sunlight in the ocean , not is someones tank .
 

reefkprz

Active Member
Originally Posted by Dawman
"7 years out of a hundred, not what I would consider a success."
Another fact you twist around . 7 years in captivity is pretty good . Your 100 years is a guestimate that nems have a lifespan in the ocean , not in our tiny tanks . Comparing let`s say a 300 gallon tank to the ocean is just stupidity .
so you consider the rare 7year, death in infancy a sucess? comparing the ocean to our tanks being stupid? well thanks for the blatant insult, if we can succesfully keep a fish it natural life span why not try to do the same for anemones? I guess I'
ll just keep being STUPID and try to prolong their lives even longer than death in infancy. you go ahead and be smart and not bother to try for better.
 
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