Flame Angel Died!

marvelfan

marvelfan

Member
Well its a sad day =(
My beautiful Flame Angel was found dead on the bottom of the QT. I've had her for about 5 days.
I'm trying to figure out what happened,but I think it will remain a mystery or maybe she just wasn't meant to make it.
I immediately ran my water tests:
Salinity 1.024
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 0
pH 8.2
Temp 78.7
No explaination. My first loss =(
Gonna wait for a couple weeks before trying to QT a new fish. Going out of town the next 2 weekends and don't want to leave anything to chance.
 
marvelfan

marvelfan

Member
I filed my claim this morning. I got it from SWF.com. I hear they are pretty good about this sort of thing. Its disappointing and I"m pretty bummed, but these things can happen. I was reading online that there are a lot of uncontrollable, undetectable things that can occur with these fish. It doesn't deter me from trying again. Once I'm back in 2 weeks I'll place another order. Just bummed about the loss of such a beautiful fish =(
 
sweatervest13

sweatervest13

Active Member
Sorry man, that sucks. I have tried two flame angels with out any luck. Very good looking fish but tricky. SWF is very good with their guarantee. They will take care of it.
Good luck with what ever you order next.
 
marvelfan

marvelfan

Member
Thanks. I don't know if Flame Angel was the best choice for my second fish. My DT is thriving and I'm really happy. My LPS, Clowns and Inverts seems super happy and active.
I'll give it another shot. I really want to do either a coral beauty or flame angel for my tank. Do you think Coral Beauties are any less fickle?
 
btldreef

btldreef

Moderator
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarvelFan http:///t/391471/flame-angel-died#post_3471810
Thanks. I don't know if Flame Angel was the best choice for my second fish. My DT is thriving and I'm really happy. My LPS, Clowns and Inverts seems super happy and active.
I'll give it another shot. I really want to do either a coral beauty or flame angel for my tank. Do you think Coral Beauties are any less fickle?
Flames need established tanks and can be very finicky, depending on where and how they were collected. Some are found/collected in deeper waters and don't do as well when transferred to our "shallow" display tanks.
I've kept both flames and Coral Beauties, and personally, I think Coral Beauties are MUCH easier. That being said, both really need established tanks with good rock work to graze from.
Just curious, I know your flame was in QT, were you just observing it, or running hypo or copper?
 
marvelfan

marvelfan

Member
observing. I tried to match my DT properties. I just wanted to make sure she was good to go before exposing her to my DT (and vise versa). Very tempting to put them right in DT, but I'm not sure it would have made a difference. I tested parameters at least once, sometimes twice a day while observing. I was very nervous about sudden changes to the tank. So I'm reluctant to blame the death on my husbandry. I really did watch this little guy close. Sat there and watched him for 5-15 min several times a day. Seemed fine last night when I went to bed. 6 hours later a totally different story =(
I've tested my water parameters 3 times in the last 5 hours and I can't find anything wrong, so I just don't know what to say. Hardest part is not knowing why.
I'm going to give it a couple weeks and I'll try a coral beauty I think. I'm really intent on having one dwarf angel in my tank sooner or later.
EDIT ** and there were no parasites or anything growing on her either. Looked clean. I even looked at the gills to see if there was anything inflamed or red. Seemed normal. I just don't know!
 
btldreef

btldreef

Moderator
Well, your DT is still fairly new, right?
What other fish do you want to keep? I'd try them before going with another dwarf angel of any variety. Not so much because of husbandry skills, but dwarf angels are natural grazers, they need established live rock. They won't do well in tanks that are under 6 months old, especially if you get one that doesn't want to accept algae sheets.
 
lcaldwell85

lcaldwell85

Member
I think the coral beauty is really a toss up. My girl still won't take prepared Nori. Infact the only thing I've found I can get her to eat on a regular basis is garlic prepared flakes. (But that's what the fish store had her on) I've tried formula one, garlic soaked nori sheets, she turns up her nose at everything but the garlic prepared flake food, so even though I know it's not the greatest thing to feed her with I give it to her in small pinches two times a day. When I first started I researched the coral beauty (before I found this forum) and the majority rule was that this was a "Hardy once acclimated, beginner level angel". I may have simply lucked up, but after cycling I added a pair of clowns, three green chromis (one remaining as they turned on one another), and a couple of weeks later my first big salt water edition was the coral beauty. I honestly have found her to be a simple, hardy edition. She's plump and beautiful despite the upfront lack of beneficial algaes in the tank to graze on, and has always proved to be the center of attention. I'm not advising anyone to add a CB in a newly established tank, simply stating under the right conditions, or luck dependent, it doesn't mean a death sentence. I would caution however, my CB (as she was one of the first editions) is EXTREMELY territorial. If you place her in the tank you probably want to do it last, or as close to it as possible. Otherwise she'll think the entire thing is her playground, and more likely than not attack new editions.
 
marvelfan

marvelfan

Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by BTLDreef http:///t/391471/flame-angel-died#post_3471854
Well, your DT is still fairly new, right?
What other fish do you want to keep? I'd try them before going with another dwarf angel of any variety. Not so much because of husbandry skills, but dwarf angels are natural grazers, they need established live rock. They won't do well in tanks that are under 6 months old, especially if you get one that doesn't want to accept algae sheets.
My DT can be considered new. I'm into it for about 3 months now with live stock I believe.
My plan was to do 2 clowns, a dwarf Angel, a sixline wrasse and a mandarin dragonet.
The dragonet was going to be the last edition because I wanted to keep it in QT and try to train it to eat mysis (If i can't find one that already does at a LFS). I expect this to be a task in its self. Also I know that Mandarins need established tanks as well.
I think for a 30 gallon that line up would be my maximum.
Do you think the wrasse should be my next addition?
If you have any recommendation on fish I'm willing to look into them as well. I know fish choices are based on personal preferences, but as long as its reef safe I'm interested.
Tomorrow I'm meeting a local woman who is selling some coral frags. Yellow polyps, white star polyps, and a bunch of different Zoo's (armor of gods, bam bams, watermelons, joker) .. I may be adding some coral frags tomorrow night.
Is there any issue with adding different types of Zoo's at the same time. i know the release a toxin, but is that something I need to worry about as far my live stock is concerned?
Thanks for all the great input. Really appreciate the invaluable info!!!!
 
njbillyv

njbillyv

Member
Flame Angels are hit or miss. I've been told and read that the way they're captured using cyinide (in some regions) is the problem. Great looking fish but I don't keep them anymore. I kinda figure if people stopped buying them maybe they wouldn't have to harvest so many and this practice would not be necessary.
 
btldreef

btldreef

Moderator
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarvelFan http:///t/391471/flame-angel-died#post_3471865
My DT can be considered new. I'm into it for about 3 months now with live stock I believe. Many will say that a tank less than a year old is still "new." It has to do with the live rock in your case for the dwarf angel. 3 month old live rock is probably not going to support a healthy dwarf unless it was fully cured and out of a very established tank ahead of time.
My plan was to do 2 clowns, a dwarf Angel, a sixline wrasse and a mandarin dragonet. Not bad. I hate sixlines. Every one of them I've tried has always been a nightmare and attacked anything and everything in my tank. They're hit or miss, either people love them or hate them.
The dragonet was going to be the last edition because I wanted to keep it in QT and try to train it to eat mysis (If i can't find one that already does at a LFS). I expect this to be a task in its self. Also I know that Mandarins need established tanks as well. You're still going to want a pod population as well. Many of the "frozen food trained" mandarins aren't thriving long term. Really research this before you decide on one for your size tank.
I think for a 30 gallon that line up would be my maximum. It's a good stock list. You could get away with one or two more small fish such as a goby, blenny, etc.
Do you think the wrasse should be my next addition? Don't add the wrasse until you're finished. This will cut down on their aggression. I would actually put it in AFTER the mandarin. Mine killed my mandarin.
If you have any recommendation on fish I'm willing to look into them as well. I know fish choices are based on personal preferences, but as long as its reef safe I'm interested. Not all of these will work together of course, but here's some of my personal preferences: Yellow Assessor Basslet, Orange Lined Cardinals, Swales Swissguard Basslet, Bicolor Blenny, Tailspot Blenny, Pink tail goby, Assorted flasher and fairy wrasses, Greenbanded goby, Firefish, Royal Gramma
Tomorrow I'm meeting a local woman who is selling some coral frags. Yellow polyps, white star polyps, and a bunch of different Zoo's (armor of gods, bam bams, watermelons, joker) .. I may be adding some coral frags tomorrow night.

Is there any issue with adding different types of Zoo's at the same time. i know the release a toxin, but is that something I need to worry about as far my live stock is concerned? You can add multiple corals at once without an issue. I would check them out first and be on the look out for any pests before adding them to the tank.
Thanks for all the great input. Really appreciate the invaluable info!!!!
 
marvelfan

marvelfan

Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by BTLDreef http:///t/391471/flame-angel-died#post_3471882
My DT can be considered new. I'm into it for about 3 months now with live stock I believe. Many will say that a tank less than a year old is still "new." It has to do with the live rock in your case for the dwarf angel. 3 month old live rock is probably not going to support a healthy dwarf unless it was fully cured and out of a very established tank ahead of time. I actually got all my live rock out a fully established tank.. it was running for over a year.
My plan was to do 2 clowns, a dwarf Angel, a sixline wrasse and a mandarin dragonet. Not bad. I hate sixlines. Every one of them I've tried has always been a nightmare and attacked anything and everything in my tank. They're hit or miss, either people love them or hate them. Didn't know they were had aggressive tendencies. I'll have to do some research and maybe rethink my choice.
The dragonet was going to be the last edition because I wanted to keep it in QT and try to train it to eat mysis (If i can't find one that already does at a LFS). I expect this to be a task in its self. Also I know that Mandarins need established tanks as well. You're still going to want a pod population as well. Many of the "frozen food trained" mandarins aren't thriving long term. Really research this before you decide on one for your size tank. I'll do some more research. I do have a refugium, so it may be an option to keep some pods thriving in there too feed, and supplement where needed.
I think for a 30 gallon that line up would be my maximum. It's a good stock list. You could get away with one or two more small fish such as a goby, blenny, etc. I thought about his and it may be an option to go with some other smaller hardier fish first to add with my clowns. Seems my other preferences are a bit more complicated.
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Do you think the wrasse should be my next addition? Don't add the wrasse until you're finished. This will cut down on their aggression. I would actually put it in AFTER the mandarin. Mine killed my mandarin. I'm sorry to hear that! If I do stick with a wrasse and mandarin I'll keep this in mind.
If you have any recommendation on fish I'm willing to look into them as well. I know fish choices are based on personal preferences, but as long as its reef safe I'm interested. Not all of these will work together of course, but here's some of my personal preferences: Yellow Assessor Basslet, Orange Lined Cardinals, Swales Swissguard Basslet, Bicolor Blenny, Tailspot Blenny, Pink tail goby, Assorted flasher and fairy wrasses, Greenbanded goby, Firefish, Royal Gramma. I"ll take a look. Thanks for the list.
Tomorrow I'm meeting a local woman who is selling some coral frags. Yellow polyps, white star polyps, and a bunch of different Zoo's (armor of gods, bam bams, watermelons, joker) .. I may be adding some coral frags tomorrow night.

Is there any issue with adding different types of Zoo's at the same time. i know the release a toxin, but is that something I need to worry about as far my live stock is concerned? You can add multiple corals at once without an issue. I would check them out first and be on the look out for any pests before adding them to the tank. I'll be carefull. I'm hoping to find some nice zoa's! I'll post pics if I get some. Thanks again for the great info!
Thanks for all the great input. Really appreciate the invaluable info!!!!
 
tangs rule

tangs rule

Active Member
Flames are just really tough to qtine IME......I'm 0 for 3 in 10 years - and have NO plans to attempt another..... If I remember right - at least 2 of my failures showed NO signs of impendeng doom before it was on its side.. coral beatuies are a little easier but still challenging to get thru qtine. I'm at least 1 for 2 there - and he's been in the DT for a year now. sorry for the loss - it's always tough
 
marvelfan

marvelfan

Member
Lil possum looks like a possible one.. Thanks. I'm going to do a lot of reading about each type of fish before thing another one.
 
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