Hello!

[blooddogg757]

Hello everyone! I am reletively new to owning a saltwater tank and would like to share my journey with you all. First off, I was born in Norfolk, VA and raised in Virginia Beach, VA so I have been around the ocean and her fruits all my life. I now live in western NC and my wife and I have decided to start a saltwater aquarium!
We set up our 55g saltwater tank around December 2010 with 60lbs. of live sand, 30lbs. of live rock and the salt + water of course. We added the filter and bubbles at that time but didn't add a heater until we bought our first fish, which were damsels. We added the fish to the tank around February, after ( I'm just guessing ) the tank had fully cycled. Since that time we have added almost too much stuff to name at an incredibly rapid pace according to our friends.
Which draws me to my first question. Is there an average wait time between periods of when I should introduce the different creatures? Aside from the obvious reasons of high levels of nitrates and ph and stuff. I'm more concerned with stress levels and comfort. The main reason for this question is I added a Dwarf Lionfish to the tank yesterday and he swam around, hunted my shrimp, and established his territory with the clowns and cardinals, and now he is sleeping upside down under a rock ( no, he is not dead, he has came out a time or two to hunt my shrimp this morning ). Is this normal? I took pictures of it as well.
Also, my buddy gave me two frag pieces of Candy Cane coral and I would like to know what new growth looks like. One of the pieces he gave us has about 11 polyps on it but I think two are dead. I buried that piece in the center of a live rock with sand. I noticed a couple days ago there are brown sprigs or worms maybe even sticking out of this piece in three different areas. I have been watching them and they seem to be getting longer maybe...is this new growth or some sort of disease. I took pictures of this as well. The second piece he gave us was real small with only three polyps on it and I stuck it in the crevice of a different piece of live rock with out sand and have not noticed these brown things on it. Both pieces flower out really well at night and extend thier tentacles and eat, so I would assume they are healthy.
Any thoughts or consideration in these matters would be greatly appreciated! I look forward to sharing my aquazoo with you all!

 

[mkroher]

those brown things look like tube snails
the lion will want a cave to hide in, so make him one.

 

[blooddogg757]

I will certainly get another piece of live rock today and build the Lionfish a cave, and if those brown things are tube snails should I knock them off? Or should we wait a bit longer and see what happens?

 

[mkroher]

If they are tube snails, they just poke their head out eating nutrients that comes across its way. I have a bunch that are attached to my hammer coral.
I enjoy them.. it gives my tank variety.
Quote:
Originally Posted by blooddogg757 http:///forum/thread/384465/hello#post_3367945
I will certainly get another piece of live rock today and build the Lionfish a cave, and if those brown things are tube snails should I knock them off? Or should we wait a bit longer and see what happens?

 

[blooddogg757]

The Lionfish cave
The lion sleeping in his new cave

 

[nycbob]

lionfish hanging upside down is normal. what kind of lighting do u hv? proper lighting and flow is needed to keep corals. i suggest u read up more on saltwater fish keeping. otherwise u r just throwing money away.

 

[blooddogg757]

Well nycbob, thanks for the overall hatefull tone of your post. I read, research and conversate with other saltwater hobbyists everyday to further educate myself in keeping a thriving underwater community. But to answer your question, we are using a 48" 10k coralife t5 bulb and a blue bulb housed together ( I just looked at it and it was not marked ) for the 50/50 effect.

 

[smartorl]

I don't see any hateful tone to Nycob's post at all. Just a bit of concern, which I have as well that you have alot of research to do! This isn't a bad thing, everyone starts somewhere.
The Lion will end up eating your shrimp, actually, the lion will eat anything he can fit into his mouth and try to eat things that won't fit.
Cranberry and Saxman are the resident lion and scorp experts so they can help you with behaviour and feeding questions for the lion.
The thing that concerned me in your first post was that you think your tank was cycled?
If you want to succeed in this hobby, you need to take some time and read about how the cycle works and also be very familiar with test kits and learn to closely monitor your water for any signs of trouble. Having a lion, a predator fish, you bioload is larger.
I know you are excited about the hobby but this is a hobby of patience. You can rush things and have things work out......for a while. But think of it as building a house on an unstable foundation. It will stand for a while, could be a long while, but wind coming from the right direction will collapse it. The same thing about building a stable ecosystem. You need a stable foundation, then build upon that. If your system isn't stable and you keep adding, at some point in time, some small trigger could crash your tank.
Please tell us more about your system itself. What type of filtration and what maintenence schedule are you on?
Adding fish is usually one every few weeks for a newer system. Like I said before, slowly building a stable ecosystem.

 

[smartorl]

Sorry, it won't allow me to edit, I misspelled Nycbob's name accidently. Oops!

 

[blooddogg757]

Well, we are using the kind of filter that hangs over the back, absolutely nothing fancy or extravegant. My motto is keep it simple, especially when simple works. I have a buddy that goes by what everyone tells him and his tank is not healthy, anything he puts in there dies. And he has spent about 5x the amount of money as I have on lights, sumps, bubble curtains, two powerheads, about 10 different kinds of ph balancer, water treatment chems, special diet foods for his different corals and fish. He throws money away.
I did mention in my first post I had just guessed the tank was cycled after a month. I had a friend of mine that has a different test kit, what I mean is his kit tests for different things than the one I have does, come test the alkiline, ionic calcium, iodine, water hardiness and a slew of other parameters I can't recall off the top of my head, before I added the first living creature to the tank. Since then I use my kit, which tests for ammonia, nitrate, nitrite, and ph every three or four days. The only variable in there is nitrate, which went up when I added the lionfish, and has since returned to normal. Normal being between 0 and 5.0
I bought the Lionfish under the pretext that he may or may not eat my clowns and cardinals, even some small invertabrates. Not to say I hope he does eat any of my fish, but it won't be a surprise if it happens. But I do feed him small, live feeder shrimp because I understand he is a predator and this was something I really wanted. Also, he is a dwarf lionfish and cannot grow to be any larger than the other two species of fish in the tank, albeit he may grow quicker. Then he may try to eat the other fish.
The point of the OP was to try to find out why my water doesn't evaporate and if this is/could be problematic at some point. I am here to ask questions and learn what I can from other hobbyists that aren't trying to sell me something. Salesmen tend to tell me what I need to here to make the sale, not neccasarily telling the whole story of the piece. Example, I added two fiji tree corals to the tank. My local fish store guy tells me they are compatible with the rest of my corals, that I have bought every single one of from him, only to come home and read a little to find out they are aggresive corals. And I was wondering why it was leaning towards the candy cane coral...
If it helps to know, we also keep a 10g hospital tank going in case we need to quarentine any fish or corals from disease or aggresiveness. Which so far, we have not had any issues with. Although the only thing I check for in that tank is salt level, because there isn't anything living in it. But it is heated and has sand, a bubble stone and filter going. I am by no means an expert. I can only give testimony to how I am raising my aquazoo, and report back. I do consider and value all of your opinions. I live in small town USA and you guys are my source of outside info. Here I have three friends with saltwater tanks and two of those guys have dealt with crash after crash with thier tanks. My brother and I keep real close setups and he cannot keep coral alive at all in his tank. You'll notice from the pictures of his tank all the coral skeletons in the bottom of his tank. I am simply trying to get the drop on the issues and not have to deal with it. Ever. I have heard of people keeping tanks for decades without problems. I want that to be my story.
Overall, I am not that intersted in fish as much as I am the corals. My favorite creatures under the sea are Cnidarians, specificly the anemones, the only scientific creatures on earth that can potentialy live forever. We don't plan on putting any more fish in the tank and have even considered moving the clowns and cardinals to a seperate tank if the lionfish were to become aggresive towards them. I respect the hobby, the animals and other hobbyists. Forgive me for being rude, thank you for your consideration in these matters.

 

[smartorl]

Ok, here's a starting point. Your T-5 fixture is a 2 bulb? That over a 55 gallon will not really produce enough light keep many corals, especially if you are more interested in corals like the lps and sps. Halides would be the best if your intention is to raise corals and house an anemone.
One word of caution about anemones, as you are interested in them, is that they require a stable, established system. I wouldn't personally recommend them to anyone with a tank younger than one year although some say six months. Although many do use T-5's, I prefer halides with anemones as from my experience, they tend to thrive better.
First, the bubble wands, stones, etc, toss them. They are not used in saltwater and are counterproductive. Powerheads are needed to create currents in your tank to prevent dead spots, this will be especially important with the hang on back filters. I would recommend strongly getting two, one for each end of the tank to circulate the water better. You will have to take a look at your rockwork and determine how many powerheads are needed as it varies alot depending on the aquascape.
How many gallons are your HOB's rated for?
I'm not trying to be mean but it sounds like the advice you have gotten thus far maybe hasn't been the best. Take some time and read the stickys at the top of the forums. Those are invaluable.

 

[gemmy]

I have some words of wisdom that comes from my personal experience with a 55 reef tank. Be very mindful of your aquascape and the location of your powerheads. A 55 is a pain to aquascape and you must have the powerheads strategically placed to alleviate dead spots and to help prevent the buildup of detritus.

 

[smartorl]

It's funny isn't it, my 55 was also a pain. It was given to me, I waited until ***** had the $1 per gallon sale and upgraded it really quickly.

 

[gemmy]

Quote:
Originally Posted by smartorl http:///forum/thread/384465/hello#post_3368877
It's funny isn't it, my 55 was also a pain. It was given to me, I waited until ***** had the $1 per gallon sale and upgraded it really quickly.
Its the stupid 13" width. I went with a 55 since it was the largest tank my apartment complex would allow.

 

[nikesb]

i absolutely hated my 55 too. so ridiculous to scape

 

[blooddogg757]

HOB...? Hang on the back filter? It is a

Whisper Power Filter 60 (30-60 Gal) . s
should I add another one to the other side of the tank? Or go bigger? Or is that one fine, as it has worked great these past few months.
I just picked up a Koralia movement and circulation pump with a flow rate of 750gph. Why should I replace the bubble stone with this? I have noticed that people use these in bigger tanks but have not seen one in a tank as small as mine, only bubbles and actually I'm the only one using a bubble stone, my buddy uses 2 18inch bubble curtains so they go across the whole backside of the tank. That and I don't have a lot of rocks in the tank yet.

 

[nikesb]

cause flow and surface agitation will do much more than a bubble stone for oxygen exchange. the only time i will use a bubble stone is when my power goes out to help aerate the tank

 

[smartorl]

Ok, rocks are very important. These provide biological filtration in addition to the mechanical filtration that your HOB provides. It is the biological filter, the live rock and the live sand that will sustain your tank for the long haul. Without this, your system will never really become stable.
It is normal to have at LEAST one pound per gallon.
I am not sure where your friend got the idea to add bubble curtains but they are completely inneffective in saltwater. The same with airstones.
This information was provided by Lion_crazz:
"The negatives of an air stone/bubbler are:
-air can get lodged in a fishes gills
-air stones do not give you gallon per hour turns - like powerheads do
-can cause bubble algae (air bubbles all over your live rock - not the bubble algae emerald crabs eat)
-can cause stress to the fish (popeye)
-cause salt creep which in turn causes irregular salinity/SG
-when bubbles pop the water can get on your lights causing the life off your lights to decline rapidly,
Some periodic air bubbles are not harmful, but constant ones are."
Air stones, bubble wands, bubble curtains are a no-no. They provide nothing beneficial and are actually counterproductive. Better to toss them or use them in your freshwater tank.
You need to focus on powerheads for your flow. They similate the currents in the ocean, and keep detrius suspended so that your filter can filter it out. Without these, you will end up with buildup of scrap food and detrius that will raise your nitrates. The 750 is designed for small reefs. I'm sorry to say but you will not be able to effectively cover your entire tank with just one. It's a start but you will need to position it, see where you have dead areas and either try to readjust or add additional ones. I think you will need a bare minimum of two. I have six in my 75 gallon.
As far as the filter, bigger is better. I would recommend getting one the same size or larger in addition to the one you have. Any less and it's going to be ineffective.
This is an expensive hobby and while it may seem ok to cut corners and save money, you will pay for it several times over in crashes and losses. Not being critical, just practical.
Have you given any thought to a skimmer? This would very beneficial to your system, especially since you are running the HOB's and don't have a sump.

 

[smartorl]

Not intending to be mean but I think you need to disregard your friends advice and he seems to be a bit misinformed.

 

[sweatervest13]

Quote:
Originally Posted by blooddogg757 http:///forum/thread/384465/hello#post_3369024
HOB...? Hang on the back filter? It is a

Whisper Power Filter 60 (30-60 Gal) . s
should I add another one to the other side of the tank? Or go bigger? Or is that one fine, as it has worked great these past few months.
I just picked up a Koralia movement and circulation pump with a flow rate of 750gph. Why should I replace the bubble stone with this? I have noticed that people use these in bigger tanks but have not seen one in a tank as small as mine, only bubbles and actually I'm the only one using a bubble stone, my buddy uses 2 18inch bubble curtains so they go across the whole backside of the tank. That and I don't have a lot of rocks in the tank yet.
I have 2 Koralia's and a Maxi-Jet in my 29 gal... And I am still fighting dead spots.
Like you said you buddies have trouble keeping tanks stable, so... You are lucky that you have Smartori and NikeSB giving you advice. They are good!! They will give you nothing but good advice (expensive but good). I think that you are doing the right thing asking for advice, that is the first step to success. Have fun and good luck!!!