HELP my brittle star is falling apart

[sadlit'lfish]

I just found my brittle star, in the front of my tank, and he never comes out with the lights on. And he's comming apart. Small chunks are falling off his arms, and I can see faint white band on all his arms. I've had him a couple of months now around 3 I think, and he seemed alright up intill now. My levels all look good
(ph@8.0, ammonia@ 0, nitrite@ 0, nitrate@0 but was around 10.0 just before last water change two days ago)
Anybody got any idea's?

 

[skooby]

I have brittle stars, and I have learned they are very sensitive to fluctuations in parameters. Nitrates being that high would have stressed it. They tend to loose there arms when stressed. It is possible to grow them back.Keep parameters good, and I keep my ph~8.2-8.4. Good Luck

 

[sadlit'lfish]

As far as testing my levels go, all I have for kits is a wardley master pro. it just lets me check for the four I said above. It uses a color chart for values, and sometimes I'm not really sure what I'm getting. Maybe I get temporary color-blindness. Is this one any good or is there better ways of testing( that don't cut into my retirement)?
How would I go about raising my ph?

 

[skooby]

That is a good test kit. To raise your Ph SLOWLY get Ph increaser. Then you probably want to use a ph buffer weekly to stablize your ph. I test my PH,Nitrates,Amonia, Calcium, Salinity,Phosphates. Your ph isnt too bad, but I have learned inverts are sensitive and like it about 8.2-8.4.

 

[nicenakago]

Water change 2 days ago?
Was the salt mixed real good? any change in salinity when you did the change? They are sensitive to that.
I hate watching those things die. It's like they have ebola for 3 days. I still have nightmares about it.... yuck.

 

[sadlit'lfish]

Now that would explain alot, if my ph has been off for a while now then. I dug out the notes I took back when I cycled for the first time, and lookie ph(=) 8.2-8.4 . don't know why I got 8. stuckin my head. I'm sooo bad at keep number in my head, better start tracking this thing on paper again.
Thanx..Only been doing this since Oct. 01 , and only after my wife begged me to. Now I'm the one who spend all my time on it. Now I only wish I would have done some homework on it first. The people at LFC sold me abunch of junk I would have never got.
It is so nice to hear advice from people don't want to sell me something..

 

[sadlit'lfish]

Salt was fine, right at 1.023...or so my gravity test.

 

[ophiura]

If the arms and body are falling apart, and it is out in th open, it is not going to survive, IMO.
What do you feed it?
I don't think either your pH or your nitrates are causing this. I think that there was a fluctuation when you did the water change.
Although you may wish to check on your pH at different times of the day- first thing in the morning, then right after lights out.
How big of a water change was it? What was the temp of the tank and the temp of the water?
What type of fish do you have? How about crabs, etc?
Do you have a picture to gauge just how far he has deteriorated? Is it just the arms, or part of the body too? Healthy, non shocked brittlestars can regrow arms. I think that this animal is shocked.
If you feel the need to, there are three ways to destroy a brittlestar:
1) you can put it in a bag with a little water and freeze it.
2) you can do a reverse acclimation by putting the animal in a container with a bit of tank water, and slowly add freshwater as if doing an acclimation. The animal should stop responding after some time.
3) take 2 tablespoons of epsom salt and place in the corner of a shallow container with a bit of tank water. Every 5 minutes, gently tilt to mix in some salt. The animal should stop responding after a time, and you can then add some freshwater to insure the animal is dead.

 

[sadlit'lfish]

Feed it? I though it was just clean-up. Is there something(s) I can feed it what and how.
I was thinking of checking ph 3 times on fri. 7am-12pm-7pm.
I have a 55gal, and I use two 6gal buckets (one to mix, and one to pull) for water change. But the last time I change it I let it get abit low and need to top of about 1gal. then change 6gal. total
the water I topped of with was room temp. would that have done it? The temp. on in the tank moved maybe 1/2 a degree from 80f
As far as fish and inverts go-
bi-color angle
wrasse(lfs said it was a 6-line, but I think it's a neon
humbug dascyllus(one grump fish, he only chases fish)
2 yellowtail blue damselfish(they tend to team up on humbug)
scooter blennie(had him 4-5mo. looks fine so far)
3 camelback shrimp
2 snails
some(10) blue leg hermits & misc. hermits
and
serpent star(had him at least a year ago, and he's got big, body went from the size of a nickle to a quater.
Wish I had a dig-cam, but no, no pic....he hasn't completely lost any arms yet just small chunck about 1cm keep comming off .Just look for him and he's in a tight shelf on my LR I saw some arm movement. oh and he has very few feet left, just around the mouth, I think. wish I had a dig-cam.
In the mean time Im going to have lfs check my water jic.
thanx ophiura

 

[buzz]

It may be too late to feed it at this point, but try anything...squid, silverside, scallop, shrimp...

 

[ophiura]

Yeah, I agree with Buzz and see if it responds at all to food. They should be kept fed...typically we don't overfeed enough to get all of the clean up crew (the sizeable guys at least) quite enough food to sustain them.
I am still thinking it is some sort of shock response though. However, if you have two brittles, I bet one can beat the other one out of any food available as well. Mine do not play well together, for sure.
At this point, keep tank params as steady as possible, make sure nothing is picking at him, and see if it will eat anything.
If it is back to hiding, that is a good sign.
I had a brittle lose 4 arms completely and mysteriously. Never figured out why. It has grown them all back (though last week had a big hole in the disk, which has also closed up). There is always hope so long as they don't just sit out in the open.

 

[sadlit'lfish]

Just got off work and he's gone into hidding again. Before I left he had moved some more, and his disc/body was pulseing. I'll check on bolth stars in the morning before the lights go on. so how much and how often should I feed a star? or the rest of the crew? Am I right to assume that I'll need to remove anything they don't finish off? Can I throw a tiger shrimp (alla cocktail) and let them go at it. Or should it be placed near them? maybe theres a book out there that goes through some of the basic, of care on common inverts.

 

[ophiura]

No, I prefer that the brittlestars be fed directly. I am not so concerned about things like hermits which will also eat off the LR. Small (eg salad) shrimp, krill, a bit of silverside, small piece of squid...I actually like shrimp pellets a lot. Something meaty can be fed using a wooden skewer, and waving it in the area of the arms. This should elicit some response- they should grab it. Pellets can be fed using forceps, or by hand if you aren't worried about that. Usually try a couple of times a week...and yes, remove what is not eaten. That is one of the reasons I stopped feeding larger food- too risky in my nano. They would just let big hunks go.

 

[wrassecal]

I'm sorry you are having this problem. I just lost my brittle star a few days ago. It is awful watching them go through the deteriation that they do. I hope yours makes it.

 

[sadlit'lfish]

He's back out again and minssing one whole arm. Tried to give him a small piece of shrimp....just moved away from it. Also saw my serpent star, my god hes big. he wanted nothing to do with the shrimp, but all three camelback came out and attacked it....5 min later and I can't even find it........eat their own kind...soile and green......

 

[sadlit'lfish]

I just tried something new today. Took some of that tiger shrimp and blendered it up w/some tank water and dumped it in and man EVERYTHING came out to eat even the brittle, left an awful mess though kind-of like feeding my late puffer . So I think I'll only do this every third or fouth day. Hope this is good sign.

 

[ophiura]

So you did see him come out in response to that? And was it missing any more parts of its body/arms since you last saw it?

 

[sadlit'lfish]

No he was already out. but he did grab a couple of small pieces as they floated by. heres a picture of him sorry it's not very clear.

 

[sadlit'lfish]

here it is

 

[hairtrigger]

I am at work, so I couldnt read the entire post. This may have been covered, but i will offer the info anyway. While my reef was really new, I was experimenting and trying different chemicals. Anyway, I lost two brittle stars the same way as you. They came out from the rocks, and at times, stayed in the open. During this period, they slowly started falling apart, or deteriorating like wrasse said. It was horrible, chunks of their arms coming off, and it looked like their center disc was tearing apart. Once this started happening, they died. However, after busting my butt to figure out why, I learned they are extremely sensitive to water parameter changes. I know this has been mentioned, however I am getting more specific. They can be acclimated to withstand the different PH changes in an LFS tank and yours. But, when the PH changes in either direction too rapidly, it often causes this deterioration. Basically, if your PH fluctuated rapidly in either direction, your brittles probably stressed and started deteriorating. You can try, but I doubt you can save them after this. I have three in my tank now. They have been doing great for about three weeks. But, my water has remained at the exact PH during that time. My other ones, I only had for about a week or two. Good luck.