Hyposalinity make ich worse, fish is now bloated

[addiction]

I am quaranting two new fish in a 20 gal QT tank. One is a coral beauty angel and the other is a flamehawk fish. I bought them to add to my reef at some point, but wanted to QT them first. I have done lots and lots of reading on this web site and others, and it seems QT is the way to go.
The fish have been in the tank for seven days. The QT tank has been up and running with two mollies for a little over one month. I used water from my main tank to set this QT tank up. Current water readings are normal as I tested them tonight and two days ago as well. Temp is a consistent 77 degrees.
However, four days ago I moved a couple of rocks around so the flamehawk would have a place to perch away from the coral beauty's rocks. Well, this moving of the rocks must have stressed the coral beauty, because by the end of the night, he was showing signs of ich. As the week progressed, I slowly lowered my specific gravity down to begin hyposalinity. Each day I lowered it a bit from its original reading of 1.019. Tonight I made the final lowering 1.013 to hair under 1.010.
Well, the ich looks worse now than it did six hours ago and the flame hawk is getting those nasty white dots as well. The dots are small, like the tip of pinhead. From what I have read, I am very confident they have ich.
What concerns me the most is that my coral beauty is not eating at all tonight, but is beginning to appear bloated. Both pectoral fins strange too. Other than be covered with ich, the point where the pectoral fins attach to the body looks extremely red. Unless this is the normal coloration of coral beauty, I think something else is going wrong with this fish. It just does not seem like it should be that red in color.
What should I do? Wait it out for the hyposalinity to do its job? I am very concerned about the coral beauty. The
flamehawk is still eating well, but I fear he will soon progress to a point where he won't eat either (Yesterday the coral beauty was eating, today he is not and looks bloated).
Please help, I will do anything. I don't want to see the fish die. I am very discouraged because I thought I was doing the right thing by QT the fish.
Thanks in advance.

 

[beth]

Hyposalinity will not work until you have it down to 1.009...1.010 will not do. Also, hyposalinity and copper as well, will not work until the ick is in the free-swimming stage. Ick will not become free-swiming at this point [since you can still see them on your fishes' bodies].
Drop the SG down to 1.009. In the meantime, feed your fish food soaked in garlic. Additionally, visit our Disease Forum and read the 2 "stickies" at the top of that forum.
In fact, to better help you, I'm going to go ahead and move your thread over to the Disease Forum.

 

[thejdshow]

Its never as easy as it sounds. I currently am doing a hypo in my QT and things arn't going well. I havn't seen the ich since I put them in there, but the fish are starting to act funny. I am having a hard time keeping ammonia in check, and I am only feeding once every three days. I have a clarkii, and a damsel fish (both hardy fish) and I am still worried. Good luck to you, and to me!

 

[guineawhop]

first you do not want to bring the salinity down past 1.012 when doing hypo. i use it at 1.014 and have successfully got rid of the ick. try adding stress coat to the water to help destress the fish in the tank. when you destress a fish it helps them fight the ick. garlic would also be a good idea as well. kent sells a liquid extract or you can soak food in chopped up garlic.

 

[mwaraxa]

First off. You HAVE to QT your new fish for atleast a couple weeks before you add them to the display tank. Trust me, i've learned that the hard way. They didn't get ick because you moved a stinking rock. It was already in the tank. And if you hadn't done QT it would be in your main tank.
i agree with beth. You want to bring it down under 1.010. I had to do hypo on my tang and i brought it down to 1.009 before i saw results. It appeared that nothing was working but i gave it time. Eventually the dots left and never returned. He even started to get pop eye for several days. But i just let him be and 4 weeks later, no ick and eye is fine.
I had it under 1.010 for over a month and he was just fine. Be patient.

 

[mwaraxa]

Originally Posted by Thejdshow
Its never as easy as it sounds. I currently am doing a hypo in my QT and things arn't going well. I havn't seen the ich since I put them in there, but the fish are starting to act funny. I am having a hard time keeping ammonia in check, and I am only feeding once every three days. I have a clarkii, and a damsel fish (both hardy fish) and I am still worried. Good luck to you, and to me!

JD
Yer having a hard time with your ammonia because you didn't have time to let the tank cycle if i remember correctly. Thats not because of the hypo.

 

[guineawhop]

Originally Posted by mwaraxa
First off. You HAVE to QT your new fish for atleast a couple weeks before you add them to the display tank. Trust me, i've learned that the hard way. They didn't get ick because you moved a stinking rock. It was already in the tank. And if you hadn't done QT it would be in your main tank.
i agree with beth. You want to bring it down under 1.010. I had to do hypo on my tang and i brought it down to 1.009 before i saw results. It appeared that nothing was working but i gave it time. Eventually the dots left and never returned. He even started to get pop eye for several days. But i just let him be and 4 weeks later, no ick and eye is fine.
I had it under 1.010 for over a month and he was just fine. Be patient.
you can bring it to 1.009, but the lower you go the more you stress the fish out. that is why i suggest not going any lower than 1.012. when a fish is stressed he loses his slime coat. when they lose their slime coat they become more suseptable to parasites and other sicknesses other than parasites. that is also why i suggest putting slime coat in the tank with the fish.

 

[mwaraxa]

Towards the end of the QT time i did end up adding some some of the slime coat stuff which i do think helped.

 

[ace007]

Try getting a UV sterilizer. Ick is in your tank so you need to treat your tank. I used garlic extreme, metronidazole and focus. I found out that my sterilizer did not have enough flow so I got a more powerful power head on and have not had a problem since. I medicated for probably 10 days but symptoms disappeared in a couple. I did not loose a fish! Good luck!

 

[unleashed]

1.009 is leathal to your fish you can cure ich with salinaty as low as 1.015 some ppl go as low as 1.012 but its not nessesary to go that low.you fish are bloating becus they are in less that brackish waters now brackish is 1.015 your need to raise that level slowly and leave it no les than 1.015 until the ich is gone at that time I would add some melafix to your QT to help reduce the stress also you can feed your fish every day instead of trying to feed them every 3 just minimize the amount of food they are getting.if you do regular water changes the extra feeding wont make a difference with your amonia and nitrates.
Originally Posted by Beth
Hyposalinity will not work until you have it down to 1.009...1.010 will not do. Also, hyposalinity and copper as well, will not work until the ick is in the free-swimming stage. Ick will not become free-swiming at this point [since you can still see them on your fishes' bodies].
Drop the SG down to 1.009. In the meantime, feed your fish food soaked in garlic. Additionally, visit our Disease Forum and read the 2 "stickies" at the top of that forum.
In fact, to better help you, I'm going to go ahead and move your thread over to the Disease Forum.

 

[beth]

That just is not so.

 

[guineawhop]

actually it is, the whole point of hypo salinity is to kill parasites which are like inverts in that they like water to be higher in salinity. when you get to a certain point it really is not only hurting the parasites but the fish as well which is why i would not go past 1.014

 

[nicetry]

Contrary to what some of you are suggesting, reef fish adapt very well to hyposaline conditions. A wide vartiety of them can live comfortably at SG's as low as 1.010 for extended periods of time (2-3 months).
Emperor angelfish were a subject of one such study and were kept in salinities of 7 ppt for thirty days with no ill effects. Those of you saying 1.009 is lethal are misinformed.
A target salinity of 14 ppt is suggested to allow for a margin of error during the procedure. It will not harm the fish and as stated, if the salinity is allowed to vary upwards for even a short time, you can lose the efficacy of the procedure.

 

[exile415]

HYPO will not work unless down to 1.009. I've tried 1.010+ it wont work. I just follow the rules and i had no problem at all.

 

[beth]

Originally Posted by guineawhop
actually it is, the whole point of hypo salinity is to kill parasites which are like inverts in that they like water to be higher in salinity. when you get to a certain point it really is not only hurting the parasites but the fish as well which is why i would not go past 1.014

I'm afraid you are incorrect.

 

[jer4916]

i just personally set up a qt tank, used copper, didn't touch my salinity, left it at .23 ..did it for two weeks,...left my main tank alone...and my ich was gone, i just had to do water changes every day on my qt.
thank worked for me, i run copper...and i suggest it.
~chris

 

[beth]

Copper works very well for ich, but copper is copper [a very potent medication]. If you have cancer and have the choice of treating it by removing the cancer surgically or removing it and doing chemotherapy and radition therapy but just removing the cancer would work fine without the rest, then why use the rest?
What I am trying to say is that copper is the kind of medication that can have adverse effects on fish, particually angels and tangs. So, if you don't need to use it, why use it??

 

[jer4916]

Thats true, i've only had ich once, it worked..and all my fish are fine. so i dont know alot about ich, i just know it works...but right now in my qt tank with my new fish i bought (thank goodness for the qt tank i found out he had ich, i have copper in the tank with him and its improving big time...should be good in about 2 weeks for my main tank)
~chris

 

[beth]

If you are going to using copper, the treatment should continue for 3 wks.

 

[kcarr]

If you use the copper in your qt tank is there anything you should do to the fish before putting him back in the display tank? Like a dip or something to make sure no copper enters the main tank from the transfer?