I need some input and advice..Please

flower

Well-Known Member
Hi,
 
 
I had an interesting thing take place and I want to share and get some back feed from you guys. Because it gave me an idea.
 
My SG was low, so I put saltwater in my ATO and wet skimmed. The removed water was light green. The added plus was that my nitrates dropped to 10, it was at 40. I have been vodka dosing a small amount and doing water changes every week and still my nitrates are at 40. I got it to 0 once and the next day it was 80, that was when I decided to try the vodka.
 
What if I constantly, while I’m home to monitor water levels..Wet skimmed the tank replacing the removed water with constant fresh mixed saltwater. Turning it down to regular skim levels at night while I work, with the lights off there would be very little evaporation for me to concern myself with, I may even just turn off the ATO at night.
 
I was thinking the constant turnover of seawater would do more good than anything I have tried. Salt would be a little more expensive, I would use about 3g a day of mixed saltwater to replace what is skimmed off. Right now a once a week water change takes 14g. at 3g a day I would be replacing 21g each week. It is a 90g reef tank.
 
Also I was wondering…Since the vodka is at such a low dose and as yet isn’t making any real difference, can I stop dosing or must I continue once started even at the low dose of 0.3 it has only been a week? or Should I do both, wet skim and dose?
 
What do you guys think? Also this would eliminate water changes and it would be replaced with a constant flow of fresh mixed seawater.
 
P.S.
My skimmer is attached to a tube that feeds to a big jug..I didn't even think of how it must sound to have to play with the collection cup all day.
 

posiden

Active Member
You could just setup a continuous water change system. That would leave you out of the picture. Well, pretty much. Your proposed idea for me is to labor intensive and I would get tired of it pretty quickly. 3g of water through the collection cup is a lot of baby sitting IMO.
 
I believe you can just stop the vodka. You really haven't put much in. I have started dosing in the past and stopped cold turkey. I didn't notice any ill effects. That's just my experiences though.
 
How old is your tank?
 

flower

Well-Known Member
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Posiden http:///forum/thread/379734/i-need-some-input-and-advice-please#post_3301622
You could just setup a continuous water change system. That would leave you out of the picture. Well, pretty much. Your proposed idea for me is to labor intensive and I would get tired of it pretty quickly. 3g of water through the collection cup is a lot of baby sitting IMO.
 
I believe you can just stop the vodka. You really haven't put much in. I have started dosing in the past and stopped cold turkey. I didn't notice any ill effects. That's just my experiences though.
 
How old is your tank?
Hi,
 
LOL...I have a tube and a 5g jug, I don't empty the collection cup so I wouldn't have to babysit. A continuous water change system is what I'm talking about.
 
I was thinking of removing old water through the skimmer, as water was skimmed and removed, it would be replaced with fresh saltwater, using my ATO system already under the cabinet.
 
Is there another way that would be easier?
 
Oh and the tank is 6 years old
 

spanko

Active Member
I am not saying this is what is going on in your tank but it is certainly some more information for you to digest.
 
"Hi Eric, I was hoping you could help me to understand better what it means for a system to "mature" or "become established". Hobbyists (me included) are always saying not to keep that sps or this anenome for a least a year until your system has matured. What exactly are the differences between a tank which finished cycling a month ago and one that finished cycling 11 months ago? Does it have to do with water parameters being more stable? Does it have to do with natural food availability? Does "tank maturity" pertain more to those who utilize a DSB, because it takes 6 months for a DSB to become functional ?<<
Tank maturity seems to be even more of an issue without the sand bed. The sand bed just takes some time to get enough nutrients in it to sustain populations and stratify into somewhat stable communities and become functional. So, here's the tank reason, and then I'll blow into some ecology for you. When you get a tank, you start with no populations of anything. You get live rock to form the basis of the biodiversity - and remember that virtually everything is moderated by bacteria and photosynthesis in our tanks. So liverock is the substrate for all these processes, and also has a lot of life on it. How much depends on a lot of things.
Mostly, marine animals and plants don’t like to be out of water for a day at a time...much less the many days to sometimes a week that often happens. So, assuming you are not using existing rock from a tank, or the well-treated aquacultured stuff, you have live rock that is either relatively free of anything alive to begin with, or you have live rock with a few stragglers and a whole lot of stuff dying or about to die because it won’t survive in the tank. Some, if not most, rock exporters have a “curing process” that gets rid of a lot of the life to begin with and some of this is to keep it from dying and fouling further, but some of it would have lived if treated more carefully.
From the moment you start, you are in the negative. Corallines will be dying, sponges, dead worms and crustaceans and echinoids and bivalves, many of which are in the rock and you won't ever see. Not to mention the algae, cyanobacteria, and bacteria, most of which is dehydrated, dead or dying, and will decompose. This is where the existing bacteria get kick started. Bacteria grow really fast, and so they are able to grow to levels that are capable of uptaking nitrogen within...well, the cycling time of a few weeks to a month or so. The “starter bacteria” products give me a chuckle. Anyone with a passing knowledge of microbiology would realize that for a product to contain live bacteria in a medium that sustains it would quickly turn into a nearly solid mass of bacteria, and if the medium is such that it keeps them inactive, then the amount of bacteria in a bottle is like adding a grain of salt to the ocean compared to what is going to happen quickly in a tank with live rock in it.
However, if you realize the doubling time of these bugs, you would know that in a month, you should have a tank packed full of bacteria and no room for water. That means something is killing or eating bacteria. Also realize that if you have a tank with constant decomposition happening at a rate high enough to spike ammonia off the scale, you have a lot of bacteria food...way more than you will when things stop dying off and decomposing. So, bacterial growth may have caught up with the level of nitrogen being produced, but things are still dying...you just test zero for ammonia because there are enough bacteria present to keep up with the nitrogen being released by the dying stuff. It does not necessarily mean things are finished decomposing or that ammonia is not being produced.
Now, if things are decomposing, they are releasing more than ammonia. Guess what dead sponges release? All their toxic metabolites. Guess what else? All their natural antibiotic compounds which prevents some microbes from doing very well. Same with the algae, the inverts, the cyano, the dinoflagellates, etc. They all produce things that can be toxic – and sometimes toxic to things we want, and sometimes to things we don’t want. So, let's just figure this death and decomposition is going take a while.
OK, so now we have a tank packed with some kinds of bacteria, probably not much of others. Eventually the death stops. Now, what happens to all that biomass of bacteria without a food source? They die. Some continue on at an equilibrium level with the amount of nutrients available. And, denitrification is a slow process. Guess what else? Bacteria also have antibiotics, toxins, etc. all released when they die. But, the die-off is slow, relative to the loss of nutrients, and there is already a huge population, and yet you never test ammonia. "The water tests fine.” But, all these swings are happening. Swings of death, followed by growth until limited, then death again, then nutrients available for growth, and then limitation and death. But, every time, they get less and less, but they keep happening – even in mature tanks. Eventually, they slow and stabilize.
What's left? A tank with limited denitrification (because its slow and aerobic things happen fast) and a whole lot of other stuff in the water. Who comes to the rescue and thrives during these cycles? The next fastest growing groups...cyanobacteria, single celled algae, protists, ciliates, etc. Then they do their little cycle thing. And then the turf algae take advantage of the nutrients (the hair algae stage). Turfs get mowed down by all the little amphipods that are suddenly springing up because they have a food source. Maybe you've bought some snails by now, too, or a fish. And the fish dies, of course, because it may not have ammonia to contend with, but is has water filled with things we can't and don't test for...plus, beginning aquarists usually skimp on lights and pumps initially, and haven't figured out that alkalinity test, so pH and O2 are probably swinging wildly at this point.
So, the algae successions kick in, and eventually you have a good algal biomass that handles nitrogen, produces oxygen through photosynthesis, takes up the metabolic CO2 of all the other heterotrophs you can’t see, the bacteria have long settled in and also deal with nutrients, and the aquarium keeper has probably stopped adding fish for a spell because they keep dying. Maybe they started to visit boards and read books and get the knack of the tank a bit. They have probably also added a bunch of fix-it-quick chemicals that didn’t help any, either. Also, they are probably scared to add corals that would actually help with the photosynthesis and nutrient uptake, or they have packed in corals that aren't tolerant of those conditions.
About a year into it, the sand bed is productive and has stratified, water quality is stable, and the aquarist has bought a few more powerheads, understands water quality a bit, corallines and algae, if not corals and other things are photosynthesizing well, and the tank is "mature." That's when fish stop dying when you buy them (at least the cyanide free ones) and corals start to live and grow and I stop getting posts about "I just bought a coral and its dying and my tank is two months old" and they start actually answering some questions here and there instead of just asking questions (though we should all always be asking questions, if not only to ourselves!).
So, ecologically, this is successional population dynamics. Its normal, and it happens when there is a hurricane or a fire, or whatever. In nature though, you have pioneer species that are eventually replaced by climax communities. We usually try and stock immediately with climax species. And find it doesn't always work.
Now, the "too mature" system is the old tank syndrome. Happens in nature, too. That whole forest fire reinvigorating the system is true. Equally true on coral reefs where the intermediate disturbance hypothesis is the running thought on why coral reefs maintain very high diversity...they are stable, but not too stable, and require storms, but not catastrophic ones....predation, but not a giant blanket of crown of thorns, mass bleaching, or loss of key herbivores.
This goes to show what good approximations these tanks are of mini-ecosystems. Things happen much faster in tanks, but what do you expect given the bioload per unit area. So, our climax community happens in a couple years rather than a couple of centuries. Thing is, I am fully convinced that intermediate tank disturbance would prevent old tank syndrome.
My advice on starting tanks is to plan the habitat you want. Find the animals and corals you like. Learn about the tiny area of the reef you will try and recreate, and do not try to make a whole coral reef in one tank. Then, purchase the equipment required to emulate that environment. Then, add the appropriate types of substrate (sand, rubble, rock, whatever) and wait long after “your tank water tests fine” before you add fish and corals. First, add herbivores and maintain water quality. Water changes, carbon, skimming, alkalinity, calcium. Keep the water of high quality, even for things you can’t test for. Wait a few months and enjoy the growth that will happen. Then, add some of the species that you plan to keep….invertebrates and corals. They help create the environment, and also photosynthesize, add biodiversity, stabilize nutrients, etc. Then….then….add fish. The fish will have a reef as their new home. They won’t be stressed by this variable bouilllabaise of water and a strange habitat that keeps changing as things are added or die. They will have a stable tank with real habitat, and then the original concept you imagined will have happened.
_____________________
Eric Borneman"
 

flower

Well-Known Member
Hi Spanko,
 
Well I don’t have new tank syndrome, I don’t have dying coral or fish. My coralline is everywhere. I don’t have any junk settled on the rocks because I have such current carrying it all away.
 
What I have is nitrates because I don’t have fauna in the sand, the sand sifting goby eats it all out. He also eats mysis and even nips the algae sheets so he is fat and happy and won’t starve. He is a favorite fish, even though he dumps sand all over and rearranges the sand into piles. My tank would not be a happy house addition without him.
 
I like the corals, I have successfully kept soft corals, non-photosynthetic corals, and LPS. What I can’t keep alive are SPS corals….but I want them nonetheless.
 
My options are:

  • A refugium

  • Vodka dosing
    Allot of water changes.
 
I’m not happy with the vodka dosing, I’m afraid of it to be honest. Also, I like the algae and so do my tangs and urchin. It isn’t hair algae nor have I had a cyano outbreak in a very long time. It’s the healthy green mass that grows on the tank sides, and back. The rocks are picked clean and coralline is thick all over it. Large areas of the sides are now coralline as well. I got the diadema urchin to eat the coralline, but it just skims the top layer and it keeps spreading..Since I have been dosing vodka (one week) the coralline on the rocks looks grey, I do see orange peeking out, that turns red. I have allot of purple still on the tank sides. No new algae is forming on the sides and the tangs have only the algae sheets to eat.
 
I can’t afford the refugium at the moment…so now I am dreaming of a way to do allot of water changes. Once a week isn’t dropping the nitrates as desired. So I was now wondering about using the skimmer to wet skim and use my ATO to replace the lost saltwater. I would have to replace about 3g of saltwater a day, that is how much the skimmer pulls out. I have to somehow figure in the evaporation so I don’t land up with really high SG.
 
Can you help me, or do you think this is a bad direction to take. OR Should I give up and just keep the corals I have always kept and be happy with that much, and give up getting the nitrates to 0
 

spanko

Active Member
I saw some posts from Bealsbob (sp?) about an in tank refugium. Might be an option until you can set up something real. I think it just sectioned off a part of the display for the macro algae to grow in. Used egg crate I believe, If I were to do it I would get black egg crate for aesthetic reasons.
 
I am not really comfortable with the idea of saltwater as top off because of the concern you already have about Sg. Seems like it could work if monitored well enough though. You might, if you go that route, want to get some type of electronic Sg monitor with an alarm on it if such a thing exists.
 
And from above;
"Now, the "too mature" system is the old tank syndrome. Happens in nature, too. That whole forest fire reinvigorating the system is true. Equally true on coral reefs where the intermediate disturbance hypothesis is the running thought on why coral reefs maintain very high diversity...they are stable, but not too stable, and require storms, but not catastrophic ones....predation, but not a giant blanket of crown of thorns, mass bleaching, or loss of key herbivores.
This goes to show what good approximations these tanks are of mini-ecosystems. Things happen much faster in tanks, but what do you expect given the bioload per unit area. So, our climax community happens in a couple years rather than a couple of centuries. Thing is, I am fully convinced that intermediate tank disturbance would prevent old tank syndrome."
 

robertmathern

Active Member
I got to be honest I like your idea here but dont think your going to get the result you are looking for. Here are my opinions on this by wet skimming and refilling the tank via ato you will be removing some of the new water that was added. I am a fan of vodka dosing so my opinion is biased there and in my honest opinion a refugium is not really worth the effort you put into one. If I get a chance to redo my system I will be removing mine. They can be handy if setup right but they also can trap detrius witch can defeat the purpose of adding one bucuase you can actually raise your nitrates instead of lower them. Yes you can grow macros and stuff but macro alge is not a cure all it just helps and from what I have seen dont that much for the time and money put into one. As far as your silinity on your wet skimming idea just look at it like this if you use you ato to refill the tank then you just no longer have an ato so you will just have to add water manually. Keep and eye on your salinity witch I am sure didnt need to be stated here but you never know. So I say try it out for a while and see what happens you can always switch back to what you are doing now.
 

flower

Well-Known Member
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by spanko http:///forum/thread/379734/i-need-some-input-and-advice-please#post_3301689
I saw some posts from Bealsbob (sp?) about an in tank refugium. Might be an option until you can set up something real. I think it just sectioned off a part of the display for the macro algae to grow in. Used egg crate I believe, If I were to do it I would get black egg crate for aesthetic reasons.
 
I am not really comfortable with the idea of saltwater as top off because of the concern you already have about Sg. Seems like it could work if monitored well enough though. You might, if you go that route, want to get some type of electronic Sg monitor with an alarm on it if such a thing exists.
 
And from above;
"Now, the "too mature" system is the old tank syndrome. Happens in nature, too. That whole forest fire reinvigorating the system is true. Equally true on coral reefs where the intermediate disturbance hypothesis is the running thought on why coral reefs maintain very high diversity...they are stable, but not too stable, and require storms, but not catastrophic ones....predation, but not a giant blanket of crown of thorns, mass bleaching, or loss of key herbivores.
This goes to show what good approximations these tanks are of mini-ecosystems. Things happen much faster in tanks, but what do you expect given the bioload per unit area. So, our climax community happens in a couple years rather than a couple of centuries. Thing is, I am fully convinced that intermediate tank disturbance would prevent old tank syndrome."
Hi,
 
 
Yes the SG thing is a concern...I will have to contemplate what to do.

I have the in tank refugium, it's too small to really impact my system. Are you taking about creating a mini storm with a turkey baster?...I have done this before, when I had grey stuff on my rocks, I no longer have that problem..Are you saying it will help with nitrates???
 
 

spanko

Active Member
Anything that will remove detritus prior to it degrading and entering the cycling process (ammonia - nitrites - nitrates) will help. Blowing the rocks with a baster or power-head to suspend detritus in the water column for removal by the mechanical filters will be of benefit. I make this at least a monthly event at water change time and am always amazed at the amount of stuff that comes up.
Your nitrates are coming from something that is adding protein material to the tank and not enough uptake and or removal mechanism to counteract it. (captain obvious here) so the need is to find out where the imbalance is and develop a plan to bring things back into balance.
Have you thought about where the proteins (excess above filtering capacity) are coming from?
 

flower

Well-Known Member
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by robertmathern http:///forum/thread/379734/i-need-some-input-and-advice-please#post_3301694
I got to be honest I like your idea here but dont think your going to get the result you are looking for. Here are my opinions on this by wet skimming and refilling the tank via ato you will be removing some of the new water that was added. I am a fan of vodka dosing so my opinion is biased there and in my honest opinion a refugium is not really worth the effort you put into one. If I get a chance to redo my system I will be removing mine. They can be handy if setup right but they also can trap detrius witch can defeat the purpose of adding one bucuase you can actually raise your nitrates instead of lower them. Yes you can grow macros and stuff but macro alge is not a cure all it just helps and from what I have seen dont that much for the time and money put into one. As far as your silinity on your wet skimming idea just look at it like this if you use you ato to refill the tank then you just no longer have an ato so you will just have to add water manually. Keep and eye on your salinity witch I am sure didnt need to be stated here but you never know. So I say try it out for a while and see what happens you can always switch back to what you are doing now.
Hi,
 
 
I am a little worried about the vodka dosing because I already after just one week have run into C02 problems, it was an easy fix but still I worry about down the road. My PH will not go above 8.0 which is right on the edge of safe. I used to have it at 8.3.
 
What do you think of the Aquaripure system advertized all over SWF? It basically is a vodka dosing system, you inject it once a week with alcohol and it claims to end nitrate problems…
 
Or
 
I could get another ATO unit to regulate the top off...then it gets complicated...BIG sigh.
 

robertmathern

Active Member
Thats a tuff one to answer I have never used the aquaripure system but have herd good things about it however co2 is a big area of concern even with that system. But imho if you ran into problems with co2 with vodka dosing .3 ml in a 90 then I dont think you are getting enough gas exchange. That alone could make a big difference with nitrates. Do you have a ph pointing at the surface. And you could add another ato but I would try out your idea to see what happens before throwing money at it if its not needed.
 

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by robertmathern http:///forum/thread/379734/i-need-some-input-and-advice-please#post_3301705
Thats a tuff one to answer I have never used the aquaripure system but have herd good things about it however co2 is a big area of concern even with that system. But imho if you ran into problems with co2 with vodka dosing .3 ml in a 90 then I dont think you are getting enough gas exchange. That alone could make a big difference with nitrates. Do you have a ph pointing at the surface. And you could add another ato but I would try out your idea to see what happens before throwing money at it if its not needed.
Hi,
 
 
I have three power heads pointed at the surface, I first had two, then I turned another upward. So now I have Two #3s and one #4 Koralias all moving the surface water, it’s very turbulent. I also have a spray bar pointed vertically to push water behind the rocks and another #2 Koralia PH that is behind a cave pointed toward the front of the tank very low. I also have another output tube pushing a stream of water across the surface from the side coming from the other canister. The skimmer has an overflow box so it also puts some movement to the surface. Oh and the in tank refugium has a little power head that pushes water out of the container to the main tank.
 
The reason I assume I have CO2 problems is that my PH dropped from 8.3 to 7.8, everything I read said low PH was due to low oxygen to stir up the surface water to fix it…after I turned another #3 power head toward the surface, the PH went to 8.0.. Even after a water change. I am using API test kits under 1 month old.
 
There is so much water movement in my tank that the only place I can put a clove coral is way in the back in a corner and even then it has medium movement and it took the cloves over a week to open. That one spot has the lowest water flow in the tank.
 

flower

Well-Known Member
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by spanko http:///forum/thread/379734/i-need-some-input-and-advice-please#post_3301699
Anything that will remove detritus prior to it degrading and entering the cycling process (ammonia - nitrites - nitrates) will help. Blowing the rocks with a baster or power-head to suspend detritus in the water column for removal by the mechanical filters will be of benefit. I make this at least a monthly event at water change time and am always amazed at the amount of stuff that comes up.
Your nitrates are coming from something that is adding protein material to the tank and not enough uptake and or removal mechanism to counteract it. (captain obvious here) so the need is to find out where the imbalance is and develop a plan to bring things back into balance.
Have you thought about where the proteins (excess above filtering capacity) are coming from?
Hi,
 
 
I have no idea???? I clean the canister filters each month, they are very clean, not full of sludge or anything. I swap out the carbon each time. The only thing I have not really touched in years would be the intake and output tubes. Water flows to and from them so I don't bother them, I detach them to do maintenance on the filters so they never leave the tank.
 
The last tme I did the turkey baster thing nothing came off the rocks, they are clean.
 

robertmathern

Active Member
Yep that sounds like some pretty decent water movement at the surface. I just figured I would throw it out there just in case. Hmmmm dont know where you nitrates are comming from but wet skimming will remove nitrates. So I think your idea might be worth a shot to see what happens.
 

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by robertmathern http:///forum/thread/379734/i-need-some-input-and-advice-please#post_3301724
Yep that sounds like some pretty decent water movement at the surface. I just figured I would throw it out there just in case. Hmmmm dont know where you nitrates are comming from but wet skimming will remove nitrates. So I think your idea might be worth a shot to see what happens.
Hi,
 
Any idea how to keep the SG stable? If I figure out that glitch I will do it. I get paid Friday...to be honest I need new tires...LOL..but my Birthday is coming up maybe I can get donations from my family for tank stuff.
 
 

posiden

Active Member
I may get flamed for this thought but here goes.
 
You need to be careful with this idea since you have a 6 year old tank. I know you said you induce storms on your rocks but, Have you ever messed with the sand bed? Doing such a thing now could cause some problems however, that IMO would mean that's the problem. Maybe you could try and vacuum the sand bed a little bit at a time during your weekly water change?
 
Again this is just a thought based on my experiences. I think the sand bed needs to be molested pretty frequently in any tank. I know you have a fish but, Does he goes all the way to the bottom of your sand bed?
 

posiden

Active Member
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by spanko http:///forum/thread/379734/i-need-some-input-and-advice-please#post_3301679
The “starter bacteria” products give me a chuckle. Anyone with a passing knowledge of microbiology would realize that for a product to contain live bacteria in a medium that sustains it would quickly turn into a nearly solid mass of bacteria, and if the medium is such that it keeps them inactive, then the amount of bacteria in a bottle is like adding a grain of salt to the ocean compared to what is going to happen quickly in a tank with live rock in it.
_____________________
Eric Borneman"
While that was a great post, and very helpful to a lot of others. I found this part interesting. Makes me wonder what is in MB7 or the probiado(sp) packs? I fell for the bio-spira when I setup my first marine tank. It made my house smell like rotten eggs. If I could only be a noob again, at least I wouldn't get down on myself so hard for not knowing about this stuff.
 
Thank you for the post Spanko
 

xcali1985

Active Member
@FLOWER : If you use a dual drip method I would think that would work. If you installed a say 5 gallon tank and ran an airtube out the tank into the DT. And installed another drip just below the surface of the water then it can drip also into a drain or a large container or whatever. If you did this everyday and figure out the drip increment so that it happens over the course of a day then I would figure that would be a constant water change.
 
May be a system I look into installing on my new 240 Gallon, instead of one massive change change 5 gallons a day for a total of 150 Gallons a month. Seems ok with me. Quick and simple. And can be simply added to your feeding period. I believe you should be able to figure out exactly how many cups of salt you would need to get 5 gallons to the correct SG very quickly, making it quicker and easier to make.
 

flower

Well-Known Member
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xcali1985 http:///forum/thread/379734/i-need-some-input-and-advice-please#post_3301975
@FLOWER : If you use a dual drip method I would think that would work. If you installed a say 5 gallon tank and ran an airtube out the tank into the DT. And installed another drip just below the surface of the water then it can drip also into a drain or a large container or whatever. If you did this everyday and figure out the drip increment so that it happens over the course of a day then I would figure that would be a constant water change.
 
May be a system I look into installing on my new 240 Gallon, instead of one massive change change 5 gallons a day for a total of 150 Gallons a month. Seems ok with me. Quick and simple. And can be simply added to your feeding period. I believe you should be able to figure out exactly how many cups of salt you would need to get 5 gallons to the correct SG very quickly, making it quicker and easier to make.
 
Hi,
 
Wouldn't the skimmer be a better option since it draws out yuck as well? That way I won't have to rig another thing to the tank. Space is a problem for me.
 
Instead of using my ATO tank for refilling, I have a 13g tub. I am going to put the hose from the ATO and pump in that, so when I wet skim and the water line drops, it will auto refill the exact proper amount..When the 3g swap out that I want to do is complete, stop wet skimming and replace my hose and pump back into the ATO holding tank. My 13g tub will hold 4 days worth of new mixed saltwater for changes.
 
I won't be a constant water change but it can at least be a daily one. This way I won't have to worry about SG getting to high or changing. Any evaporation will still be handled with the ATO unit. After I get my tires, and I'm sure I have the cash I will purchase another hose and pump so I won't have to putz with swapping them from one tub to another.
 
So that's my plan, what do you think?
 
 
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