I'm tired of letting my babies die

flower

flower

Well-Known Member
I decided to try my hand at keeping my Kuda babies alive...I have a design I copied from Seahorse org from Danu. I like it because it has a filter.

Right now I'm gathering information, and next month I can work on the tank setup. It looks pretty simple but it has to be drilled on the bottom. I already have the filter...
What is ID tubing? Can I use PVC? LOL...are they the same thing?
Can I fix this rig to not overflow if there is a power failure?
 
mr. limpid

mr. limpid

Active Member
ID is inside dimension, VS OD outside dimension. Looks like a good design, this would work with any kind of babies. My kids are aways asking me to raise my clowns, they have laid eggs again. They do several batches from late January to early April.
"Can I fix this rig to not overflow if there is a power failure?" Yes, pull the plug on pump and see how much flows back into lower tank (start with low water in tank below). Mark the line from were it was then measure back up to that line. Then mark a line of were to top of on lower tank.
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Limpid http:///t/390952/im-tired-of-letting-my-babies-die#post_3464804
ID is inside dimension, VS OD outside dimension. Looks like a good design, this would work with any kind of babies. My kids are aways asking me to raise my clowns, they have laid eggs again. They do several batches from late January to early April.
"Can I fix this rig to not overflow if there is a power failure?" Yes, pull the plug on pump and see how much flows back into lower tank (start with low water in tank below). Mark the line from were it was then measure back up to that line. Then mark a line of were to top of on lower tank.
It won't keep siphoning? That is what I was worried about. Or do I not allow the return to go below the water surface?
Right now the first hurdle...I can't even find a 15g tall tank to purchase. I found 1 that has all kinds of fancy lights, filter the whole bit...I just want a plain ol stand and tank....how hard is that?
 
mr. limpid

mr. limpid

Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flower http:///t/390952/im-tired-of-letting-my-babies-die#post_3464809
It won't keep siphoning? As soon as the water goes below top of stand pipe it will stop siphoning. This why you need to know how much water will flow back down into your sump. And just keep that much cushion That is what I was worried about. Or do I not allow the return to go below the water surface? it will by itself when the pump stop, you can't stop that from happening.
Right now the first hurdle...I can't even find a 15g tall tank to purchase. I found 1 that has all kinds of fancy lights, filter the whole bit...I just want a plain ol stand and tank....how hard is that? This will work with any size tank, if you are like me you probably have 10gal laying around. I have 2 in my crawl space.
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
I found a 15g tall tank from glass cages for $52.00...a 10g cost about $12.00, I just got one for a QT at *****
I want to copy the design exactly...I'm sure as a sump a 10g can't hold much, and using the marineland filter means I can't let the water get too low to leave room in it.
 
novahobbies

novahobbies

Well-Known Member
Make sure there is a siphon break on your return line, otherwise you might have a siphon started from the return if power fails. Just a hole above the waterline in the tubing will do. If your standpipe is near the water surface of the "display" tank, you won't have too much water dropping into the 10g. Aren't 10 and 15g tanks the same length and width?
 
geoj

geoj

Active Member
You need a kreisel tank so to keep the fish from being crushed in the foam of the stand pipe.
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by novahobbies http:///t/390952/im-tired-of-letting-my-babies-die#post_3464854
Make sure there is a siphon break on your return line, otherwise you might have a siphon started from the return if power fails. Just a hole above the waterline in the tubing will do. If your standpipe is near the water surface of the "display" tank, you won't have too much water dropping into the 10g. Aren't 10 and 15g tanks the same length and width?
Yes, thats why the 10g will fit for a sump under the stand...I assume anyway. The 15g tall I guess is for the circulation to go the way he has it drawn up. All the other baby tanks on that site are round. I'm not sure why unless baby horses get stuck in corners.
I asked on seahorse.org and have been reading, but so far I haven't found an answer.
As I have been reading.... another hurdle is the food for my wee little guys. Seems I will have to not only breed BBS but baby copepods too, because Kuda fry is different than Erectus fry. I think before I attempt to even start a baby tank going I better figure out how to breed these feeders. I have to figure out what artemia is and how to get it. Looks like I would also have to grow phytoplankton...the list of feeders to feed the feeders keep growing
 
geoj

geoj

Active Member

 
 
 Yes, thats why the 10g will fit for a sump under the stand...I assume anyway.  The 15g tall I guess is for the circulation to go the way he has it drawn up. All the other baby tanks on that site are round. I'm not sure why unless baby horses get stuck in corners.
  I asked on seahorse.org and have been reading, but so far I haven't found an answer.
 
As I have been reading.... another hurdle is the food for my wee little guys. Seems I will have to not only breed BBS but baby copepods too, because Kuda fry is different than Erectus fry. I think before I attempt to even start a baby tank going I better figure out how to breed these feeders.  I have to figure out what artemia is and how to get it. Looks like I would also have to grow phytoplankton...the list of feeders to feed the feeders keep growing
 
 
 
It is to keep the fry in a condensed area to feed them and to keep the fry suspended in the water column and prevent them from being suck out through the filtration system.
Google, Water Jug Kreisel Tank
first link...
This www page has all the info you need and support if you ask for it...
 
geoj

geoj

Active Member
Find the link that I am referring to and it will help you out lots. I found it when looking in to Kreisel Tanks for an up coming experiment.
 
geoj

geoj

Active Member

So it is the circular motion shown in the diagram? Sorry I didn't see your post until now...
 
 
Yes, that is an attempt to create a Kreisel Tank and if the flow of the return is very low it may work. I would use a method that is known to work for seahorse rather then create my own.
 
novahobbies

novahobbies

Well-Known Member
I think Flower is saying that this IS a tried method....Dan from Seahorse Source scaled this down for the folks at SH.org
Flower, Geo is correct, the kreissel method is used to keep the little buggers "localized" so they are condensed with the food and so they can't snick any excess air from the surface.
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeoJ http:///t/390952/im-tired-of-letting-my-babies-die#post_3464877
Find the link that I am referring to and it will help you out lots. I found it when looking in to Kreisel Tanks for an up coming experiment.
My problem is I'm not handy at all, and the Kreisel tanks are modified. The one I have the diagram of, looked like something I could do.
I guess first I need to figure out a way to breed the right foods...I know I can get a BBS hatcher, but I don't know about breeding rotifers, or even what a artemia is. I also need to figure out the differnce between a pelagic and benthic fry.
LOL..artemia is brine shrimp...just a fancy word.
Kuda fry don't hitch...they free swim. I suppose thats why they need a circulation that keep them out of harms way.
 
geoj

geoj

Active Member

I think Flower is saying that this IS a tried method....Dan from Seahorse Source scaled this down for the folks at SH.org

Flower, Geo is correct, the kreissel method is used to keep the little buggers "localized" so they are condensed with the food and so they can't snick any excess air from the surface.
Yes, I understand that the diagram has been used by other with good results. I mean to say that Flower should not modified it with out knowing how it works first.
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeoJ http:///t/390952/im-tired-of-letting-my-babies-die#post_3464889
Yes, I understand that the diagram has been used by other with good results. I mean to say that Flower should not modified it with out knowing how it works first.
LOL...I can't modify anything...that's why I was looking for the exact tank and everything else listed. I also seen one done with two fish bowls...but I can't make out exactly how everything was working in it... It had no explanation just pictures...can anyone make it out?

Having the right foods on hand seems to be the hard part. I would need to raise copepods first, and move to BBS after a few weeks. They were talking daily water changes and even fry dying from the water change. The more I read the more it looks like doing this is over my head. I just hate to see all those little babies die without even trying to keep them alive. I had another batch of babies this morning.
I won't be trying to do anything until I feel confident that I can do it. I know it's expected to fail the first few times, but I don't want to just jump in and spend a bunch of money on a tank, stand and plumbing...what good will it do if the little critters have nothing to eat. I have been trying to get copepods going in my in-tank refugium for a few months now...I can't see them, I was told to look for their one red eye..but if I can't see the speck, how can I see it's eye?
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Update: I have been reading and checking out Seahorse source and seahorse.org....Before I try and get a tank going I'm going to work at cultivating the food for them. SH source sells everything I need to get started. If I can feed them, I can figure out a tank to keep the fry in. At least now I can see a plan forming.
I won't be starting until the first of the month, I will update on how the food culture thing goes. Then you guys can help me figure out a fry tank.
 
mr. limpid

mr. limpid

Active Member
Sounds like you have a good plan and a good source of information. Keep us posted with your progress, wishing you good luck. Once you have horses to sell you'll have to help me start a horse tank. I want to be a customer for Flower's raised horses.
 
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