fishkiller
Active Member
I guess some find following a tradition to be worth it.
jealious wife!
- Thread starter califishdude
- Start date
drkegel
Member
I'm actually an Aerospace Engineering major, but materials science is a necessity for any engineering degree here.
I appreciate tradition, although I believe the tradition was the circle - not the stone in the middle of it. I respect your opinion and your right to spend your money how you feel is right, no eyeroll here.
I also think that knowing where your product comes from and how it gets to you is also important. I think many people would be appalled at the conditions diamond miners are forced to tolerate in Africa, where 95% of the world's diamonds come from. There is no way of knowing if the diamond you buy was traded for smuggled drugs or illegal weapons.
I refer anyone who is interested in learning more to the following websites:
www.moissanite.com
http://edwardjayepstein.com/diamond/prologue.htm
or send me a private message.
I appreciate tradition, although I believe the tradition was the circle - not the stone in the middle of it. I respect your opinion and your right to spend your money how you feel is right, no eyeroll here.
I also think that knowing where your product comes from and how it gets to you is also important. I think many people would be appalled at the conditions diamond miners are forced to tolerate in Africa, where 95% of the world's diamonds come from. There is no way of knowing if the diamond you buy was traded for smuggled drugs or illegal weapons.
I refer anyone who is interested in learning more to the following websites:
www.moissanite.com
http://edwardjayepstein.com/diamond/prologue.htm
or send me a private message.
fishkiller
Active Member
Actually, it came from Belgium.
fishkiller
Active Member
l know your maizonite is inlabs, I was saying our stone came from Belgium. I don't know about 95% of them coming from africa. And if you are worried about working conditions, you'd beter throw out half of your shoes and clothes.
drkegel
Member
To my knowledge, people who make my shoes aren't subjected to daily bodily cavity searches, prohibited from seeing their families for months at a time, only allowed to have conjugal visits from prostitutues (which has promoted the rapid spread of HIV and AIDS in diamond mining camps), among many other human rights violations.
Are the people who make my shoes underpaid and overworked? I'm sure. Am I underpaid and overworked - I think so, and I'll wager most people on this board would feel the same way about their respective careers. But I'm pretty sure no one is beaten or subjected to the atrocities those in diamond mining camps are. They are treated, in many cases, worse than slaves.
If you are interested in learning more about the dark side of diamond mining and diamond history, feel free to send me a PM. My girlfriend is more than happy to share her research with you or anyone on the subject. This is not the forum for an open debate on the topic.
Are the people who make my shoes underpaid and overworked? I'm sure. Am I underpaid and overworked - I think so, and I'll wager most people on this board would feel the same way about their respective careers. But I'm pretty sure no one is beaten or subjected to the atrocities those in diamond mining camps are. They are treated, in many cases, worse than slaves.
If you are interested in learning more about the dark side of diamond mining and diamond history, feel free to send me a PM. My girlfriend is more than happy to share her research with you or anyone on the subject. This is not the forum for an open debate on the topic.
rook
Member
Majority of diamonds are mined in Africa, andsent to Antwerp Belgium where they and put into the diamond system.
But, there have been tremendous strides in recent years to correct the problems with conflict diamonds and the problems in Africa and Seri Leona (sp). Today most diamonds are certified to guarantee that they are not conflict diamonds. Also, you can buy Canadian diamonds that are mined, cut, and certified by the Canadian government to verify that the are from Canada, and thus not conflict diamonds.
Also, diamonds are a very recent tradition in the last thirty years. In the past either a solid ring, or an opal or pearl was traditionally given for engagement.
Although, if she does not want a diamond, even if it is guaranteed to be non-conflict, then some other choices could be, synthetic diamonds by Van Graft. Very Very good. So good that many gemologist with years of experiance have trouble telling them apart from real diamonds. Also, alexandrite is a popular replacment, but not cheap. Very nice stuff though. I like the color change of it.
If you want any links to websites I have a boat load. I have been researching diamonds and gemstones constantly for about ten months. I even spend more time doing that than studing reef tanks.
But, there have been tremendous strides in recent years to correct the problems with conflict diamonds and the problems in Africa and Seri Leona (sp). Today most diamonds are certified to guarantee that they are not conflict diamonds. Also, you can buy Canadian diamonds that are mined, cut, and certified by the Canadian government to verify that the are from Canada, and thus not conflict diamonds.
Also, diamonds are a very recent tradition in the last thirty years. In the past either a solid ring, or an opal or pearl was traditionally given for engagement.
Although, if she does not want a diamond, even if it is guaranteed to be non-conflict, then some other choices could be, synthetic diamonds by Van Graft. Very Very good. So good that many gemologist with years of experiance have trouble telling them apart from real diamonds. Also, alexandrite is a popular replacment, but not cheap. Very nice stuff though. I like the color change of it.
If you want any links to websites I have a boat load. I have been researching diamonds and gemstones constantly for about ten months. I even spend more time doing that than studing reef tanks.
drkegel
Member
My mistake - PM's are disabled for some reason on this BBS.
There are no "fake" diamonds that are as close to the properties of a diamond as moissanite is. The synthetic diamonds made in labs are all colored. Diamondique (the QVC brand) "diamonds" are not as hard as moissanite and do not have the reflective/refractive properties that moissanite has. There are no real diamonds that are as clear and "bright" as moissanite either.
Again, I refer you to the moissanite website for the basic information.
There are no "fake" diamonds that are as close to the properties of a diamond as moissanite is. The synthetic diamonds made in labs are all colored. Diamondique (the QVC brand) "diamonds" are not as hard as moissanite and do not have the reflective/refractive properties that moissanite has. There are no real diamonds that are as clear and "bright" as moissanite either.
Again, I refer you to the moissanite website for the basic information.
rook
Member
If you, or I should say your intended, like moissanites than that is what you should get. But, I want to give you some extra information just in case you are an information nut like me.
Moissanites do not look like diamonds. Well they do, but they are easily distinguishable. Know one could mistake a moissanite and a diamond. Correct that moissanites are a created gemstone and not a simulant diamond like cz's, but cz's are in fact closer in look and performance to an actually diamond (at least the good ones.) Also, moissanites tend to have a warmer yellowish to greenish color hue. Most are around a j/k compared to the diamond color scale. Some are greenish though. Moissanites are double reflective, meaning that the pavillion facets reflect light back up to the table twice. Some like this, most do not.
The good quality simulant diamonds such as diamondique, or better yet, Van Graffs are very similar in look and light performance (brillance, fire, dispersion) to diamonds. Van Graffs are typically very white, around d-f on the diamond color scale, and internally flawless. Moissanites usually are very included.
Here is a qoute from a person who owns both moissanites and Van Graffs.
"Yes, I have seen Van-Graff and Moissanite side by side in a similar size and identical shape. There really is no comparison. To me, the VG is that much more beautiful and believable, and I am a person who actually likes moissanite. (Many here do not.) I don't mind the warm tint of moissanite and I enjoy the dispersion, but it can't be considered a good diamond simulant when stacked up against even ordinary CZ. Moissanite is moissanite. The Van-Graff is an incredibly beautiful diamond simulant, and it is also much more affordable.
The differences I saw in the moissanite and Van-Graff were:
1) Moissanite is much, much darker. It does not have the brilliance of the VG. This makes the VG look much larger even in the same size.
2) Moissanite is much more yellow. I have seen different qualities of moissanite: some are hideously green, the one I was looking at was an attractive warm tint. The difference was marked.
3) Moissanite's larger dispersion was mostly invisible. Because the VG was so much brighter, it appeared to be giving off more fire even if I know that moissanite has a higher dispersion.
4) Moissanite is cut funny. I don't know a more technical way to put this. I believe I had read that moissanite is cut in a way to show the beauty of moissanite. The round brilliant cut really didn't look like the VG cut in the same size.
5) Moissanite is fuzzy. The double refraction of the facets makes the stone look fuzzy or blurred when viewed through a crown angle. It does not have the crisp, diamond-like look of the VG.
I enjoy moissanite. I wouldn't turn one down. However, I feel that the VG is a much more believable, beautiful, and affordable diamond sim. I prefer the VG. "
Now as I said, if your intended likes moissanite than that is wonderful, I would just like to see you and her make a well informed decision. Also, make sure you do not buy a moissanite without seeing it first hand as there are many moissanites with poor cuts, color, clarity.
For more information see:
www.van-graff.com
www.pricescope.com Diamond info forum.
www.diamondtalk.com Diamond info forum.
Sorry for the long post but I love talking about diamonds.
Moissanites do not look like diamonds. Well they do, but they are easily distinguishable. Know one could mistake a moissanite and a diamond. Correct that moissanites are a created gemstone and not a simulant diamond like cz's, but cz's are in fact closer in look and performance to an actually diamond (at least the good ones.) Also, moissanites tend to have a warmer yellowish to greenish color hue. Most are around a j/k compared to the diamond color scale. Some are greenish though. Moissanites are double reflective, meaning that the pavillion facets reflect light back up to the table twice. Some like this, most do not.
The good quality simulant diamonds such as diamondique, or better yet, Van Graffs are very similar in look and light performance (brillance, fire, dispersion) to diamonds. Van Graffs are typically very white, around d-f on the diamond color scale, and internally flawless. Moissanites usually are very included.
Here is a qoute from a person who owns both moissanites and Van Graffs.
"Yes, I have seen Van-Graff and Moissanite side by side in a similar size and identical shape. There really is no comparison. To me, the VG is that much more beautiful and believable, and I am a person who actually likes moissanite. (Many here do not.) I don't mind the warm tint of moissanite and I enjoy the dispersion, but it can't be considered a good diamond simulant when stacked up against even ordinary CZ. Moissanite is moissanite. The Van-Graff is an incredibly beautiful diamond simulant, and it is also much more affordable.
The differences I saw in the moissanite and Van-Graff were:
1) Moissanite is much, much darker. It does not have the brilliance of the VG. This makes the VG look much larger even in the same size.
2) Moissanite is much more yellow. I have seen different qualities of moissanite: some are hideously green, the one I was looking at was an attractive warm tint. The difference was marked.
3) Moissanite's larger dispersion was mostly invisible. Because the VG was so much brighter, it appeared to be giving off more fire even if I know that moissanite has a higher dispersion.
4) Moissanite is cut funny. I don't know a more technical way to put this. I believe I had read that moissanite is cut in a way to show the beauty of moissanite. The round brilliant cut really didn't look like the VG cut in the same size.
5) Moissanite is fuzzy. The double refraction of the facets makes the stone look fuzzy or blurred when viewed through a crown angle. It does not have the crisp, diamond-like look of the VG.
I enjoy moissanite. I wouldn't turn one down. However, I feel that the VG is a much more believable, beautiful, and affordable diamond sim. I prefer the VG. "
Now as I said, if your intended likes moissanite than that is wonderful, I would just like to see you and her make a well informed decision. Also, make sure you do not buy a moissanite without seeing it first hand as there are many moissanites with poor cuts, color, clarity.
For more information see:
www.van-graff.com
www.pricescope.com Diamond info forum.
www.diamondtalk.com Diamond info forum.
Sorry for the long post but I love talking about diamonds.
drkegel
Member
The moissanites I've seen are far more clear than even the highest quality diamond.
The green and yellow stones I've seen are actually attempts to synthetically manufacture a diamond in a lab. Most synthesized attempts at re-creating a diamond are either yellow or brown in color. Yellow syntheized diamonds are the closest anyone has come to re-creating a diamond in a lab.
I'm sure moissanite is available in many different colors - but it is also available with far more clarity and a higher refraction index than any diamond.
CZ (cubic zirconia) IS NOT a diamond, IS NOT a synthetic diamond, and is easily distinguished under the eye of a good gemologost from a real diamond. CZ is a compound in its own right, with properties that are similar to diamonds, but are NOT synthetic diamonds. Intense light also clearly distinguishes the three by the unique spectrum spread each produces. Moissanite is likewise easily distinguishable from both CZ and real diamonds.
Moissanite is used in many engineering applications where a diamond is far to prone to fail: ie. high heat applications. As the videos on moissanite.com show you, a diamond incinerates at a much lower temp than a diamond.
There is no such thing as a "perfect" diamond. Every naturally occuring (real) diamond has some level of imperfection in it. The really super expensive ones have very small, very few imperfections, but they still have them.
My information does not only come from websites but from people with double PHD's in materials science. I'm recalling a lot of this info from a couple years ago; I'll have to hunt down my notes after I'm done moving.
I really wish there was a PM service on here so we didn't clutter up the reef board.
The green and yellow stones I've seen are actually attempts to synthetically manufacture a diamond in a lab. Most synthesized attempts at re-creating a diamond are either yellow or brown in color. Yellow syntheized diamonds are the closest anyone has come to re-creating a diamond in a lab.
I'm sure moissanite is available in many different colors - but it is also available with far more clarity and a higher refraction index than any diamond.
CZ (cubic zirconia) IS NOT a diamond, IS NOT a synthetic diamond, and is easily distinguished under the eye of a good gemologost from a real diamond. CZ is a compound in its own right, with properties that are similar to diamonds, but are NOT synthetic diamonds. Intense light also clearly distinguishes the three by the unique spectrum spread each produces. Moissanite is likewise easily distinguishable from both CZ and real diamonds.
Moissanite is used in many engineering applications where a diamond is far to prone to fail: ie. high heat applications. As the videos on moissanite.com show you, a diamond incinerates at a much lower temp than a diamond.
There is no such thing as a "perfect" diamond. Every naturally occuring (real) diamond has some level of imperfection in it. The really super expensive ones have very small, very few imperfections, but they still have them.
My information does not only come from websites but from people with double PHD's in materials science. I'm recalling a lot of this info from a couple years ago; I'll have to hunt down my notes after I'm done moving.
I really wish there was a PM service on here so we didn't clutter up the reef board.
drkegel
Member
Doing a little direct comparison work here, by taking information off of both www.moissanite.com and from www.va-graff.com:
From www.van-graff.com:
The Van Graff CZ:
hardness: 8.77 Mohs (scale of 1-10)
refraction: 2.24
dispersion: 0.060
From www.moissanite.com:
Moissanite:
hardness: 9.25 Mohs
refraction: 2.65-2.69
dispersion: 0.104
Diamonds (real ones):
hardness: 10 Mohs
refraction: 2.42
dispersion: 0.044
Van Graff uses Cubic Zirconia (with a special, top-secret, "dopant"). Essentially, the Van Graff stone is a Cubic Zirconia on steroids. It is not as hard as a diamond or as hard as moissanite, has less refraction than both the diamond and moissanite, and less dispersion than moissanite, but more dispersion than a diamond.
From www.van-graff.com:
The Van Graff CZ:
hardness: 8.77 Mohs (scale of 1-10)
refraction: 2.24
dispersion: 0.060
From www.moissanite.com:
Moissanite:
hardness: 9.25 Mohs
refraction: 2.65-2.69
dispersion: 0.104
Diamonds (real ones):
hardness: 10 Mohs
refraction: 2.42
dispersion: 0.044
Van Graff uses Cubic Zirconia (with a special, top-secret, "dopant"). Essentially, the Van Graff stone is a Cubic Zirconia on steroids. It is not as hard as a diamond or as hard as moissanite, has less refraction than both the diamond and moissanite, and less dispersion than moissanite, but more dispersion than a diamond.
kzlen
Member
My fiance' was the one to suggest I start a Saltwater Tank. I have been messing with freshwater for about 9yrs and it has become soo easy .. didnt even have to do water changes but like once a year, maybe.
I was going to start a Saltwater about 5 yrs ago, bought some of the stuff but decided to move instead . and move and move.......Now that we have settled in our new place for atleast a year, I am giving it another try, learning ALOT this time.
My almost Husband plays guitar as a hobby and has a nice electric setup. He also loves to play online games. Thats the thing I would complain about , spending soo much time on the computer! I didn't have a hobby of my own and he suggested I may need one. heh. So, I got back into trying Saltwater.
He buys me anything I need and want for my tank. I am the one that thinks everything is soo expensive. He doesn't care, he just buys it. I think hes still trying to make up for spending soo much money on his guitar equipment. He also thinks SW is cool and if he can have a SW Tank without having to do a thing, then why the heck not!
I was going to start a Saltwater about 5 yrs ago, bought some of the stuff but decided to move instead . and move and move.......Now that we have settled in our new place for atleast a year, I am giving it another try, learning ALOT this time.
My almost Husband plays guitar as a hobby and has a nice electric setup. He also loves to play online games. Thats the thing I would complain about , spending soo much time on the computer! I didn't have a hobby of my own and he suggested I may need one. heh. So, I got back into trying Saltwater.
He buys me anything I need and want for my tank. I am the one that thinks everything is soo expensive. He doesn't care, he just buys it. I think hes still trying to make up for spending soo much money on his guitar equipment. He also thinks SW is cool and if he can have a SW Tank without having to do a thing, then why the heck not!
P
puffygrrl
Guest
I just had to post to bring some more female input. At first my boyfriend was jealous at the amount of time I spent on the tanks and how much I talked about them and the amount of time I spent on the board. Now that I have brought the 80 gallon home to set up a reef, he sits in front of it the minute he gets home and looks for new growth on the rocks. I bought him a book and he looks through it trying to name everything...it's so cute. We now have a 250 gallon and 100 gallon in process of purchasing...proof that addiction is contagious!
fishkiller
Active Member
However you care to state it, calling minor inclusions in a NATURAL stone imperfections is the same as calling fingerprints on a human an imperfection.
fishkiller
Active Member
FLY FISHING???????? LOL!!!!!
fishkiller
Active Member
not a thing. I LOVE FISHING!!! lol, but I don't think this is the place to talk about fishing...lol I wish I could go fishing right now, but the closest water to me is the little stream of carwash run-off from up the street.....
I wish I could go fishing right now, but the closest water to me is the little stream of carwash run-off from up the street.....
mishka
Member
Since reading this thread, my husband and I tease about me being the Jealous wife, and the one that goes to the lfs and says ooh, I want this one, and that one! Well today it happened... we went to the lfs just to look around (yeah right!). I see a crab with a feather duster on its shell. I have to have it because it looks like "a feather in his cap". Then we decide to get some more snails. Then he wants to get a mushroom. He picks out what he wants, and when asked if that's it, I chime in, and get another one. He just looked at me and laughed. I new he was thinking about this thread. Just had to share that story .
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