Lionfish compatibility and feeding?

[Tom the Bomb]

I'm setting up a Red Sea Reefer Deluxe XXL 750 (200-gallons) and I'm planning to put a clearfin lionfish as the main fish.
I was originally thinking of Niger triggerfish since they were the least aggressive of the triggerfish but after browsing through some forums, they often said that triggers+lions were a bad pair. There were some with success but it was mostly luck. So i was thinking of an angelfish (emperor or koran), a blue tang, a yellow tang and a powder blue surgeon. Would that work with the lion?
I asked people on Reddit about porcupine puffers with the lionfish and they said it was ok as long as I avoid the dogface or any small puffers that might nip at the lion. Would a porcupine puffer or burrfish work? Like would they nip at the lion? Anyone have any success doing this?
Also what are some other good tank mates for the lionfish? Would an angler/ frogfish be fine?
I was also thinking of rays (cortez) buts it too hard...
If the puffer is a yes, then my second question is: If I keep corals but no other inverts would the puffer try to eat the corals
What corals are safe with the puffer...
Also, for heating, (I know its a stupid question) what if I keep the heater in the refugium of the sump (would it work or am I just stupid)
Also i know a refugium is optional but if i have one what should I stock it with?
Also what are some good macroalgae?
I've also heard it's hard to get the lionfish to eat and some suggested dead ghost shrimp???

Oh yes I for got to add: Red sea reefers have no lid but I really want a chainink or zebra moray eel too.
I heard they make good tank mates for lions but there needs to be lots of caves and it needs to be covered.
Im getting the net cover would that be enough? the net's really sturdy too...

I have kept sw before but it was a small tank with 3 clowns in a 20 gallon with a cleaner shrimp and an anemone

 

[Tom the Bomb]

Also if I put the heaters in the refugium, would I need the same wattage like 800w-1000w all in the refugium

and I also have tons of FW. Im really experienced in FW and just decided to get back into SW now

 

[jay0705]

Your list is fine with a lion. That is alot of fish even for a 200 tho. I like a zebra moray myself. The net should be fine. As far as the heater. Yes you need what ever wattage is needed for your size tank. Most people keep them in the sump

 

[lmforbis]

I’d go with multiple smaller heaters but only what you need. Too much heater capacity tends to cause frequent on off cycles which leads to early failure. A large heater that fails on will cook the tank pretty quickly.
if you keep your house in the 68-72 degree range you shouldn’t need anywhere near that much heater capacity. I run 2 100 watt heaters in my 120. They aren’t on even half the time. I live in a cold climate and my house is at around 64 all night and most of the day. The pump as a power heads produce heat as well.
I would suggest an aquarium controller like the Apex. You can use them to control most everything in the tank but especially heaters. You can set the controller to turn the power to the heaters on and off by setting a max and min temp as well as to send you an alert if something isn’t working. It is a good way to Protect those expensive fish you are hoping to get.

 

[Tom the Bomb]

Yes I know I mean multiple 100-200w heaters that add up to 800w

 

[lmforbis]

You really shouldn’t need that much. I’d start wit maybe 400 and see how it goes.

 

[Tom the Bomb]

That is alot of fish even for a 200 tho

Yes I know Im not getting all
If u say all are ok
then my stock will be:
-1 clearfin lionfish
-1 zebra or chainlink moray eel
-1 porcupine puffer
-1 frogfish
-1 blue or (maybe 2-3) yellow tang(s) or a powder blue surgeon (Depends on what the fish stores have)


-----

i've also seen small sharks with lions like small cat sharks or bamboo sharks etc.
Is this possible

 

[Tom the Bomb]

I’d start wit maybe 400 and see how it goes.

WAT.. i thought it was like 5w per gallon
anyways im in canada and the room temp is like always at 70
once my cichlid tank's heater failed and the temperature went to 71.(80 gallons with 300w)
ok then ill go with maybe 600w?

 

[lmforbis]

You need to have a lot more equipment in a saltwater tank. In 200 gallons you will need. probably 4 (maybe more) power heads in the >1000 gph size range, they produce heat. Your return pump produces heat etc. it will take a long time for a 200 gal tank to cool off. You are setting up a very expensive system. This is why I’m suggesting an aquarium controller. It will alert you to problems. I do feel it is a good idea to have a couple extra heaters around (not in the tank) just in case.

I'm also going to suggest you get an other tank for a quarantine system. Unlike fresh water, salt water diseases are hard to treat and you can’t do it in a display tank. It is a good practice to quarantine all fish, one at a time,for 30 days minimum. This allows you to observe them. You will be able to catch diseases early and treat the fish in a controlled environment. It will allow you to get fish eating when there is no competition. You want tangs (I’d limit them to 2 of different species). Tangs are very prone to parasites, the kind that will whine out all your fish. The wholesalers systems are full of parasites as are the fish stores. They tend to run their tanks with a sub clinical level of copper and/or low salinity. This hides the problem until you get the fish home and then there is an explosion of something. Once you put one sick fish in a tank the tank is infected. You then need to treat ALL the fish and leave the tank fish less for 72 days to let the parasites die off. you don’t want to be trying to treat several large fish.

you list looks great Except. I’d skip the porkey they get really big, in the 2 foot range. Tangs you need to be careful with. They are aggressive to other tangs. There should be only one of each type. One zebrasoma (yellow, scopes, purple, etc), one acantherus (powder blue, powder brown, etc) one paracantharus (hippo, etc). You need to watch out for similar body shapes and similar coloration. All fish need to be bigger than your lions mouth when you buy them or they will become dinner For the lion.

 

[lmforbis]

I Missed the frogfish On your list. I love frogfish but they do best in a species only tank. It may do ok in a peaceful community tank. They are not beginner fish. Like the lion it will eat anything that fits in its mouth and it’s mouth is huge. Tank mates need to be bigger than the frog fish’s mouth. Someday I’m going to get one.

 

[Tom the Bomb]

ok quarantine tank? sure i have one but its for freshwater, im not buying any freshwater fish soon so i could convert it? it has a HOB power filter
and is a bare-bottomed 15 gallon

Also Im starting slow with this tank. I'll buy the lion first and wait like 3-4 weeks till i buy the others.


Also just wondering is it ok to keep rays (cortez) or sharks (coral cat, bamboo) with the lion
if ok then ill get rid of the tangs (prevent overstocking) :|
also did anyone here have success keeping triggers with lions? im not doing it myself not worth the risk but im curious

 

[Tom the Bomb]

You need to have a lot more equipment in a saltwater tank. In 200 gallons you will need. probably 4 (maybe more) power heads in the >1000 gph size range, they produce heat. Your return pump produces heat etc. it will take a long time for a 200 gal tank to cool off. You are setting up a very expensive system. This is why I’m suggesting an aquarium controller. It will alert you to problems. I do feel it is a good idea to have a couple extra heaters around (not in the tank) just in case.

Oh ya I bought 2 hydor evolution 1150gph wavemakers. (one on each side)

and a controller for it

should i get this one? Its the best?

also what do these things do
they turn off and on the lights at regular intervals.
they act as a thermostat for the heaters turning them on and off at certain temps
turn off and on wavemakers?

 

[Tom the Bomb]

also these apex neptune things are so expensive...
$900!!!
Anyone have a suggestion for a cheaper but still decent aquarium controller??? (<$200)

 

[lmforbis]

You may need more than the two power heads.

The apex does turn on and off things. It can ramp things up and down like wave makers and lights. It monitors temp and turns the heaters on and off based on temp. It can send you email alerts if something isn’t working. You can control your tank from anywhere you have an internet connection.
It monitors electrical usage.
I have an auto feeder, moon lights, my Kessil LEDs, my T5s, my heaters all controlled by it. I have other things like my return pump and skimmer plugged into it.

For a quarantine I use a 10 or 20 gallon depending on the size of the fish. BAre bottom with a small heater, a sponge filter, and some PVC connectors for the fish to hide in. You want it in a place away from your display but also a place where you can keep an eye on the fish. Where you can examine the fish several times a day. Nothing you use in the quarantine should be used on the display unless it is fully sterilized (30 min in 10% pure bleach) then air dried. One fish at a time. Plan on 30 days. If something pops up it will probably be longer.

 

[lmforbis]

also these apex neptune things are so expensive...
$900!!!
Anyone have a suggestion for a cheaper but still decent aquarium controller??? (<$200)

Unfortunately the main competitor, the Reef Keeper, has been discontinued. You can get the basic apex unit for $500.

 

[Tom the Bomb]

Oh wow Saltwater's getting expensive.
i'm trying to keep this all under $10,000 CAD.
My 80 gallon only costed $800 for everything.
On the website it says u can get one for as little as $239.95.

I'm also trying to buy everything on saltwater aquarium .com
since that's like the only place that has the DELUXE version of the 750 and delivers to canada at the same time.
except for the hydrometer since for some reason they only sell refractometers.
Isn't the instant ocean one the best? (im buying on amazon)

 

[Tom the Bomb]

the text is glitchy but is this controller ok?

 

[lmforbis]

You want a refractometer not a hydrometer. Refractometers are accurate hydro meters are not.

 

[lmforbis]

View attachment 4180
the text is glitchy but is this controller ok?

This is the one I purchased. It is fully expandable so you can add on later.

 

[Tom the Bomb]

i dunno how to ues refractosthe calibration andall that is confusing. calibration solutions??

also do yellowhead eels get big and will eat lion?