snakeblitz33
Well-Known Member
Hmm. Very good to know. This is a pic of my Horizontal Algae Scrubber built in a 10g sump. 2x23 watt CFL bulbs. I may go double that, but I will have a very low fish bioload.
Mega-Powerful Nitrate and Phosphate Remover Replaces Skimmer, Refugium, Everything
- Thread starter santamonica
- Start date
santamonica
Member
Just get the lights as close to the screen as possible, while keeping the light spread out evenly from side to side.
santamonica
Member
Coming Soon: Good news for nano owners who want scrubbers. If you have not been able to easily put a scrubber below or above your tank, this might work for you. And you probably already have the parts to make it.
snakeblitz33
Well-Known Member
ooo, you better not tell me there's a better way after I built a verticle one for my 20g nano! I'm tingling with anticipation.
desertdawg
Member
I just built a bigger overflow out of PVC to supply my scrubber with more flow and upgraded my lights, biggest I could find at the hardware store were 40W 2700K CFL's.
My screen hasn't really been growing much lately because my old bulbs were 2 small, 2 far away, and 2 old... So I took the time 2 upgrade it....
Going on a cruise for 7 days so I hope it grows some while I'm gone.
My screen hasn't really been growing much lately because my old bulbs were 2 small, 2 far away, and 2 old... So I took the time 2 upgrade it....
Going on a cruise for 7 days so I hope it grows some while I'm gone.
santamonica
Member
It's still vertical. And will be several months anyway.
santamonica
Member
LED test on SM100:
9 days of growth after cleaning. Fluorescent on left, LED on right. LED is the 50 watt Grow Light from EshineSystems in China. Actually uses 41 watts per the KillOwatt. Was raised up 3/4 inch to fit in middle of scrubber window. Camera is unfortunately an old one, since new one is being repaired. Growth was very similar on both sides; too similar to tell them apart. Growth on the LED side was floating a bit higher since it had no light near the bottom. LED was about $140 including shipping, and I asked for the black case:
Video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKcib4YaoTc
LED:
http://www.eshinesystems.com/growlight/50W-led-grow-light-3g.htm
9 days of growth after cleaning. Fluorescent on left, LED on right. LED is the 50 watt Grow Light from EshineSystems in China. Actually uses 41 watts per the KillOwatt. Was raised up 3/4 inch to fit in middle of scrubber window. Camera is unfortunately an old one, since new one is being repaired. Growth was very similar on both sides; too similar to tell them apart. Growth on the LED side was floating a bit higher since it had no light near the bottom. LED was about $140 including shipping, and I asked for the black case:
Video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKcib4YaoTc
LED:
http://www.eshinesystems.com/growlight/50W-led-grow-light-3g.htm
santamonica
Member
New Scrubber Sizing Guideline (Sept 2011)
Scrubbers will now be sized according to feeding. Nutrients "in" (feeding) must equal nutrients "out" (scrubber growth), no matter how many gallons you have. So...
An example VERTICAL waterfall screen size is 3 X 4 inches = 12 square inches of screen (7.5 X 10 cm = 75 sq cm) with a total of 12 real watts (not equivalent) of fluorescent light for 18 hours a day. If all 12 watts are on one side, it is a 1-sided screen. If 6 watts are on each side, it is a 2-sided screen, but the total is still 12 watts for 18 hours a day. This screen size and wattage should be able to handle the following amounts of daily feeding:
1 frozen cube per day (2-sided screen)
1/2 frozen cube per day (1-sided screen)
10 pinches of flake food per day (2-sided screen)
5 pinches of flake food per day (1-sided screen)
10 square inches (50 sq cm) of nori per day (2-sided screen)
5 square inches (50 sq cm) of nori per day (1-sided screen)
0.1 dry ounce (2.8 grams) of pellet food per day (2-sided screen)
0.05 dry ounce (1.4 grams) of pellet food per day (1-sided screen)
High-wattage technique: Double the wattage, and cut the hours in half (to 9 per day). This will get brown screens to grow green much faster. Thus the example above would be 12 watts on each side, for a total of 24 watts, but for only 9 hours per day. If growth starts to turn YELLOW, then increase the flow, or add iron, or reduce the number of hours. And since the bulbs are operating for 9 hours instead of 18, they will last 6 months instead of 3 months.
HORIZONTAL screens: Multiply the screen size by 4, and the wattage by 1.5
Flow is 24 hours, and is at least 35 gph per inch of width of screen [60 lph per cm], EVEN IF one sided or horizontal.
Very rough screen made of roughed-up-like-a-cactus plastic canvas.
Clean algae off of screen every 7 to 14 days, so that you can see the white screen material.
Scrubbers will now be sized according to feeding. Nutrients "in" (feeding) must equal nutrients "out" (scrubber growth), no matter how many gallons you have. So...
An example VERTICAL waterfall screen size is 3 X 4 inches = 12 square inches of screen (7.5 X 10 cm = 75 sq cm) with a total of 12 real watts (not equivalent) of fluorescent light for 18 hours a day. If all 12 watts are on one side, it is a 1-sided screen. If 6 watts are on each side, it is a 2-sided screen, but the total is still 12 watts for 18 hours a day. This screen size and wattage should be able to handle the following amounts of daily feeding:
1 frozen cube per day (2-sided screen)
1/2 frozen cube per day (1-sided screen)
10 pinches of flake food per day (2-sided screen)
5 pinches of flake food per day (1-sided screen)
10 square inches (50 sq cm) of nori per day (2-sided screen)
5 square inches (50 sq cm) of nori per day (1-sided screen)
0.1 dry ounce (2.8 grams) of pellet food per day (2-sided screen)
0.05 dry ounce (1.4 grams) of pellet food per day (1-sided screen)
High-wattage technique: Double the wattage, and cut the hours in half (to 9 per day). This will get brown screens to grow green much faster. Thus the example above would be 12 watts on each side, for a total of 24 watts, but for only 9 hours per day. If growth starts to turn YELLOW, then increase the flow, or add iron, or reduce the number of hours. And since the bulbs are operating for 9 hours instead of 18, they will last 6 months instead of 3 months.
HORIZONTAL screens: Multiply the screen size by 4, and the wattage by 1.5
Flow is 24 hours, and is at least 35 gph per inch of width of screen [60 lph per cm], EVEN IF one sided or horizontal.
Very rough screen made of roughed-up-like-a-cactus plastic canvas.
Clean algae off of screen every 7 to 14 days, so that you can see the white screen material.
snakeblitz33
Well-Known Member
I have a 10x12" screen on one of my tanks, roughed up plastic canvas with 23 real watts of light per side. I've had it on an 18hour per day timer for two weeks and it has barely grown anything at all. The light is close to it like you have recommended. I don't understand why it's not growing anything at all, and I don't even have a skimmer on the tank.
I'm at a loss, and fixin' to throw the whole thing away and opt for a protein skimmer and some chaeto if I can't figure out why it's not working.
On my other tanks that I run an algae scrubber on, it works great! Nice dark green growth, very thick, week after week... but this one particular tank doesn't grow any algae on the screen, even with dosing some Kent essentials to boost iron in the system.
I need a bit of help on this one... I can provide pics if necessary.
I'm at a loss, and fixin' to throw the whole thing away and opt for a protein skimmer and some chaeto if I can't figure out why it's not working.
On my other tanks that I run an algae scrubber on, it works great! Nice dark green growth, very thick, week after week... but this one particular tank doesn't grow any algae on the screen, even with dosing some Kent essentials to boost iron in the system.
I need a bit of help on this one... I can provide pics if necessary.
snakeblitz33
Well-Known Member
Has anyone ever looked into Enkamat as a possible screen?
It's the stuff that landscapers lay down on slopes before they put down sod. It helps to keep soil erosion down to a minimum and provides a medium for roots to get a better hold. It's 3d, kinda thick/thin. Seems like a perfect screen to use to grow algae on, and you don't have to rough it up at all... it's already "ready to go." People already use it in saltwater aquaria as a "mesh mod" for modifying their protein skimmer pumps.
Anyone else try Enkamat? If not, I'm willing to give it a go...
It's the stuff that landscapers lay down on slopes before they put down sod. It helps to keep soil erosion down to a minimum and provides a medium for roots to get a better hold. It's 3d, kinda thick/thin. Seems like a perfect screen to use to grow algae on, and you don't have to rough it up at all... it's already "ready to go." People already use it in saltwater aquaria as a "mesh mod" for modifying their protein skimmer pumps.
Anyone else try Enkamat? If not, I'm willing to give it a go...
snakeblitz33
Well-Known Member
Today's pic of my algae scrubber:
travelerjp98
Active Member
WOW... that's a lot of growth. I'm sure that that absorbed a LOT of nitrates...
R
rattler739
Guest
just got done reading the whole thread, probably going to make one for my 30 gal. Oh and was curious how the patent is coming
santamonica
Member
Well the focus has been on the new version that will make nano's really easy. In a few months I'll post the details... you probably have all the parts.
santamonica
Member
Updates on the LED test. 3 pics from 2nd cleaning, and 1 vid from 3rd cleaning:
2nd cleaning, 7 days, top:
http://www.radio-media.com/fish/SM100LEDTest8.jpg
2nd cleaning, 7 days, T5:
http://www.radio-media.com/fish/SM100LEDTest9.jpg
2nd cleaning, 7 days, LED:
http://www.radio-media.com/fish/SM100LEDTest10.jpg
3rd cleaning, 11 days:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBEkVdEQ_oQ
.
.
.
.
2nd cleaning, 7 days, top:
http://www.radio-media.com/fish/SM100LEDTest8.jpg
2nd cleaning, 7 days, T5:
http://www.radio-media.com/fish/SM100LEDTest9.jpg
2nd cleaning, 7 days, LED:
http://www.radio-media.com/fish/SM100LEDTest10.jpg
3rd cleaning, 11 days:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBEkVdEQ_oQ
.
.
.
.
santamonica
Member
Coming in 2012:
Algae Scrubber II
(nano owners rejoice)
Algae Scrubber II
(nano owners rejoice)
snakeblitz33
Well-Known Member
Now you're just teasing us.
travelerjp98
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33 http:///t/330606/mega-powerful-nitrate-and-phosphate-remover-replaces-skimmer-refugium-everything/1340#post_3428808
Now you're just teasing us.
haha..... +1.
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33 http:///t/330606/mega-powerful-nitrate-and-phosphate-remover-replaces-skimmer-refugium-everything/1340#post_3428808
Now you're just teasing us.
haha..... +1.
santamonica
Member
Two updates:
1. The cyano stage: Some people, who start using a scrubber for the first time, get rid of their nuisance algae but then get some cyano that they never had before. The reason for this is that cyano is able to "fix" it's own nitrogen, which means it is good at getting the last nutrients that are available. However, once these last nutrients are removed, the cyano will go away too. And the more powerful the scrubber is, the quicker this happens.
2. High coral-growth theory: Some people are wanting faster growth with their SPS corals. In a scrubber-only tank, when there are no other filters, you have higher amounts of dissolved and particulate food in the water than if you had other filters running. However, the lighting remains the same. In other words, growth requires light and food; a scrubber-only tank has more food, but the same light. My theory is that if you increased the light too, you would get much more growth; possibly more that natural levels.
This is based on watching "traditional" SPS tanks with lighting problems (low light/food ratio): The corals grow slow (if at all), and tend to stay brown. When the lights are fixed/replaced (high light/food ratio), the colors brighten up and the growth starts again. However a scrubber-only SPS tank has much more food in the water, yet still only has "traditional" amounts of lighting. So the light/food ratio is low again. So my theory is that if you increased the lighting to more than "traditional" levels, you would get "more than traditional" SPS growth. Bleaching is less of a concern in a scrubber-only tank, because of the larger quanitity of food that is available (studies have shown that more food reduces bleaching).
1. The cyano stage: Some people, who start using a scrubber for the first time, get rid of their nuisance algae but then get some cyano that they never had before. The reason for this is that cyano is able to "fix" it's own nitrogen, which means it is good at getting the last nutrients that are available. However, once these last nutrients are removed, the cyano will go away too. And the more powerful the scrubber is, the quicker this happens.
2. High coral-growth theory: Some people are wanting faster growth with their SPS corals. In a scrubber-only tank, when there are no other filters, you have higher amounts of dissolved and particulate food in the water than if you had other filters running. However, the lighting remains the same. In other words, growth requires light and food; a scrubber-only tank has more food, but the same light. My theory is that if you increased the light too, you would get much more growth; possibly more that natural levels.
This is based on watching "traditional" SPS tanks with lighting problems (low light/food ratio): The corals grow slow (if at all), and tend to stay brown. When the lights are fixed/replaced (high light/food ratio), the colors brighten up and the growth starts again. However a scrubber-only SPS tank has much more food in the water, yet still only has "traditional" amounts of lighting. So the light/food ratio is low again. So my theory is that if you increased the lighting to more than "traditional" levels, you would get "more than traditional" SPS growth. Bleaching is less of a concern in a scrubber-only tank, because of the larger quanitity of food that is available (studies have shown that more food reduces bleaching).
santamonica
Member
Since I've been working on the new scrubber, I've not done much with the 25 nano model. So if anyone would like to test, build, and market it, I could sell you the patent application and you could take it over. It is a U.S. PPA which expires March 7, 2012. You would then file your own U.S. NPA.