Multitier Tank Stand Questions

[scopus tang]

Ok, I've been designing a frag tank set-up in my head for awhile now. I want to use two 29 gallon extra long tanks (same foot print as the 55, but only 12 1/2" high), one sitting above the other. The stand will sit on top of a cabinet built overlarge with a counter top to allow for a chiller, sump/fuge (probably a 29 long) but I'm also considering connecting an octo tank to it as the first chamber (blue pad filter over LR rubble) and a large (25 or 30 gallon plastic container) for a remote DSB and additional water volume.
My first question is in regards to the stand itself; how to build a wooden rack to support a tank of the same size over another tank without all the weight sitting on the s c r e w s? Obviously I can put in short cripple studs or even cross studs, but ultimately you are still depending on s c r e w s to support the weight. A 29 isn't that heavy, but still

. Any thoughts?
Second question is on the remote sandbed/extra volume container; where and how to plumb it in. Do you use a second pump to send water to the container or do you split waterflow off the main return? which is going to give you the most effect results?

 

[scopus tang]

Nobody?!

 

[scopus tang]

Wow, who knew this question was going to be such a stumper - 13 views and not a single response or suggestion

.
Scopus, perhaps you should consider bolts instead of s c r e w s. Certainly bolts would be heavier than s c r e w s and capable of supporting more weight. That of course would require that you countersink the bolts (so they can be covered for astetic reasons of course).

 

[scopus tang]

Well Scopus, I hadn't originally considered bolts (frankly I never thought of it before you mentioned it), certainly it may be a consideration. Bolts being countersunk however does raise a question of integrity. Certainly if you are drilling and countersinking bolts into your support pieces, you are reducing the integrity of those pieces, especially the cross supports. Still, we are talking only a 29 gallon tank here, would the reduction of integrity be enough to cause concern.

 

[scopus tang]

Interesting, I hadn't really considered the integrity issues. Have you considered hurricane clips of some sort? Certainly if they can support a roof in hurrican force winds, they ought to be able to support a 29 gallon aquarium.

 

[scopus tang]

hmmmmm Scopus, must admit I hadn't considered hurricane clips. Perhaps, perhaps - I wonder if they make them in a style and size the would work for this application - tomorrow perhaps (or today, since today is now tomorrow) I shall have to visit the hardware store and see if they indeed have such an item.
Thank you Scopus, certainly you've given me some food for thought. Appreciate the input.

 

[scsinet]

As humerous as this thread is, I'll throw in...
In your original post, you mentioned that a 29g tank isn't that heavy. You're right.
If you consider that you have four corners where you are putting in screws, each one will take roughy 1/4 of the weight. If you use 4 screws in each corner, that's 16 total screws supporting 15lbs per

[hr]
. That should not be an issue.
A couple idea...
Use deck screws, not drywall screws. They are thicker.
Use liquid nail or some other heavy construction adhesive on the joints. This will make them more than strong enough.
Use metal L brackets underneath each joint for extra reinforcement - though rust may well be a problem.

 

[natclanwy]

I'm not sure if this would take the load of the screws or not but in my mind it would work. If you use the sandwiched 2x4s and cut the inside 2x4 so that the lower shelf sits on top of the lower portion of the 2x4 and the upper shelf sits on top of the upper portion of the 2x4" which is sitting on top of the 2x4 for the lower shelf. That should transfer the weight all the way to the bottom of the stand provided all of the joints are snug. I also would use adhesive to bind all of the 2x4s together for maximum strength.
Man it is difficult to describe a building design if I get time this evening I will draw a diagram but in the mean time hopefully you can make sense out this, I just reread it and it made my head swim

 

[scopus tang]

Originally Posted by SCSInet
http:///forum/post/2911913
As humerous as this thread is, I'll throw in...
Thank you, thank you very much

In your original post, you mentioned that a 29g tank isn't that heavy. You're right.
If you consider that you have four corners where you are putting in screws, each one will take roughy 1/4 of the weight. If you use 4 screws in each corner, that's 16 total screws supporting 15lbs per

[hr]
. That should not be an issue.
A couple idea...
Use deck screws, not drywall screws. They are thicker.
Use liquid nail or some other heavy construction adhesive on the joints. This will make them more than strong enough.
Use metal L brackets underneath each joint for extra reinforcement - though rust may well be a problem.
One a more serious note SCSInet (Quint isn't it?) - thank you for the input - I certainly would use deck screws rather than drywall screws. I considered an adhesive, but was actually thinking along the lines of waterproof wood glue, Liquid nails would probably be a much better idea. The L brackets are also a good idea, although like you I think rust would be a potential problem - I have yet to have a saltwater tank that doesn't have some issues with salt creep, and salt creep and metal always = rust. Obviously hurrican clips would have a similar potential.

 

[scopus tang]

Originally Posted by natclanwy
http:///forum/post/2911951
I'm not sure if this would take the load of the screws or not but in my mind it would work. If you use the sandwiched 2x4s and cut the inside 2x4 so that the lower shelf sits on top of the lower portion of the 2x4 and the upper shelf sits on top of the upper portion of the 2x4" which is sitting on top of the 2x4 for the lower shelf. That should transfer the weight all the way to the bottom of the stand provided all of the joints are snug. I also would use adhesive to bind all of the 2x4s together for maximum strength.
Man it is difficult to describe a building design if I get time this evening I will draw a diagram but in the mean time hopefully you can make sense out this, I just reread it and it made my head swim

John, thank you for the input also. Like you I'm not really sure I followed your suggestion - however, the fact that I got very little sleep last night might also have something to do with it - I will try to reread it at a later time when my eyes are not crossing because I'm so tired

.

 

[usirchchris]

This is the most I will laugh all day, bout to go to work so this is guaranteed. Thanks Scopus

Oh, forgot my suggestion...throw some paint on her when you're finished!!

 

[scopus tang]

Originally Posted by usirchchris
http:///forum/post/2912127

This is the most I will laugh all day, bout to go to work so this is guaranteed. Thanks Scopus

Oh, forgot my suggestion...throw some paint on her when you're finished!!
You're welcome usirchchris, always happy to be of service

. As for paint, I (edit: my, did that sound bad when I reread it) prefer stains as I like to be able to see the wood grain and character (for reference check my 65 gallon aquarium thread in the show off your aquarium forum (or whatever the heck its called)). Certainly it will be finished, probably with multiple coats of polyurethane

.

 

[spanko]

Hmmmmm........
from this
My wife of course would kill me if she knew I was even thinking about a second system, so this is really simply dreaming . . .
to this
Certainly it will be finished, probably with multiple coats of polyurethane

 

[scopus tang]

Originally Posted by spanko
http:///forum/post/2912181
Hmmmmm........
from this
to this

OH Dang! I did it again - stupid Freudian slip

!
Certainly honey what I meant to say was, " If it ever where, by some miracle, to get built; Than I certainly would want to finish it with a polyurathane coating

.

 

[veni vidi vici]

Jack or cripple studs.And the sheer strength of a 16p nail or a #10 S crew is 94 lbs /per i believe.

 

[snakeblitz33]

I wouldn't use 4x4's, that's just - too much.
I would stick four 2x4 posts on all four sides of the aquarium on the bottom, then I would cut notches out of the top of those 2x4's so that two 2x4's can sit on top of them lenghwise. I would also put in a couple of 45 degree cross braces in the back
obviously, either way you go, the tank has to have the "built in wall" effect.

 

[scopus tang]

Originally Posted by Veni Vidi Vici
http:///forum/post/2912381
Jack or cripple studs.And the sheer strength of a 16p nail or a #10 S crew is 94 lbs /per i believe.
Ah, thanks Veni, I was hoping you were going to show up. Sounds like you and Quint agree - s crews should be sufficient, but some additional cripple studs with adhesive would probably be a good idea. Gives me a solid point to start. Thanks guys for the input

.

 

[snakeblitz33]

Adhesive - you are talking about wood glue, correct? Wood glue works wonders!!

 

[florida joe]

Randy can you post a working drawing ? just a ruff one would do. my old 1/2 brain works better with visuals

 

[scopus tang]

Ok, no guarante, but here we go - very crude and you may have to increase the size to see the details.

Ok Joe, don't know if you can see anything here or not - you'll have to let me know.