New Protein Skimmer or MP40? what would you do?
- Thread starter lubeck
- Start date
acrylic51
Active Member
The skimmer cup should be pretty leak tight, but will await pics to see where your saying it's leaking water.....It is also known and has been documented from the very beginning that these skimmers are not leak proof or exactly water tight......That's why these skimmers are in sump only.
As far as the Vortech....It should be pretty quiet.....If your getting a lot of noise, I would assume that you don't have it properly aligned. Being that it's the new style and all. When the pump is running you might have to tweak it to fine the perfect spot. You might also notice as you run the pump a bit more it does quiet down some. My MP60 took me a little tweaking to align it perfect and now they are all but dead silent, and the more you crank it wide open the more the noise will increase as well. I only have my (2) MP60's running about 40% and they are "all but dead silent". I do notice if I run them at 100% they are a bit louder as well.
As far as the Vortech....It should be pretty quiet.....If your getting a lot of noise, I would assume that you don't have it properly aligned. Being that it's the new style and all. When the pump is running you might have to tweak it to fine the perfect spot. You might also notice as you run the pump a bit more it does quiet down some. My MP60 took me a little tweaking to align it perfect and now they are all but dead silent, and the more you crank it wide open the more the noise will increase as well. I only have my (2) MP60's running about 40% and they are "all but dead silent". I do notice if I run them at 100% they are a bit louder as well.
2quills
Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by acrylic51 http:///t/390779/new-protein-skimmer-or-mp40-what-would-you-do/20#post_3465646
The skimmer cup should be pretty leak tight, but will await pics to see where your saying it's leaking water.....It is also known and has been documented from the very beginning that these skimmers are not leak proof or exactly water tight......That's why these skimmers are in sump only.
As far as the Vortech....It should be pretty quiet.....If your getting a lot of noise, I would assume that you don't have it properly aligned. Being that it's the new style and all. When the pump is running you might have to tweak it to fine the perfect spot. You might also notice as you run the pump a bit more it does quiet down some. My MP60 took me a little tweaking to align it perfect and now they are all but dead silent, and the more you crank it wide open the more the noise will increase as well. I only have my (2) MP60's running about 40% and they are "all but dead silent". I do notice if I run them at 100% they are a bit louder as well.
Wait a minute, hold the phone...so if you want your vortechs to be quite then you have to live with half a pump? What a rip...sorry, I couldn't resist.
Originally Posted by acrylic51 http:///t/390779/new-protein-skimmer-or-mp40-what-would-you-do/20#post_3465646
The skimmer cup should be pretty leak tight, but will await pics to see where your saying it's leaking water.....It is also known and has been documented from the very beginning that these skimmers are not leak proof or exactly water tight......That's why these skimmers are in sump only.
As far as the Vortech....It should be pretty quiet.....If your getting a lot of noise, I would assume that you don't have it properly aligned. Being that it's the new style and all. When the pump is running you might have to tweak it to fine the perfect spot. You might also notice as you run the pump a bit more it does quiet down some. My MP60 took me a little tweaking to align it perfect and now they are all but dead silent, and the more you crank it wide open the more the noise will increase as well. I only have my (2) MP60's running about 40% and they are "all but dead silent". I do notice if I run them at 100% they are a bit louder as well.
Wait a minute, hold the phone...so if you want your vortechs to be quite then you have to live with half a pump? What a rip...sorry, I couldn't resist.
acrylic51
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///t/390779/new-protein-skimmer-or-mp40-what-would-you-do/20#post_3465682
Wait a minute, hold the phone...so if you want your vortechs to be quite then you have to live with half a pump? What a rip...sorry, I couldn't resist.
Hey Corey!!!!!! I only have them turned down under 1/2 way seeing what movement I was getting.....At 1/2 in my case they are dead silent....Scary to the point that I checked daily to make sure they were running.....It has been noted and I think "acceptable noise" is a debate able subject, but cranked all the way yes they do make noise.....I don't think Eco ever really claimed they were dead silent to begin with. Cranked all the way up in my case it's not an issue, because they are in the fish room, so unless your behind the tank you wouldn't hear them. On the noise side they are nosier than my return pump though.....
Again I think a big key to the noise issue is more with alignment. It's not a simple slap together as some might imagine. Yes the 2 magnets hold the 1/2's together, but that doesn't mean their aligned......Even when they are together and out of alignment the impeller will still turn, but the noise is amplified, and as you tune the alignment in you can obviously hear the difference in the tone of the pump.....Small, small adjustments make a huge difference.....
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///t/390779/new-protein-skimmer-or-mp40-what-would-you-do/20#post_3465682
Wait a minute, hold the phone...so if you want your vortechs to be quite then you have to live with half a pump? What a rip...sorry, I couldn't resist.
Hey Corey!!!!!! I only have them turned down under 1/2 way seeing what movement I was getting.....At 1/2 in my case they are dead silent....Scary to the point that I checked daily to make sure they were running.....It has been noted and I think "acceptable noise" is a debate able subject, but cranked all the way yes they do make noise.....I don't think Eco ever really claimed they were dead silent to begin with. Cranked all the way up in my case it's not an issue, because they are in the fish room, so unless your behind the tank you wouldn't hear them. On the noise side they are nosier than my return pump though.....
Again I think a big key to the noise issue is more with alignment. It's not a simple slap together as some might imagine. Yes the 2 magnets hold the 1/2's together, but that doesn't mean their aligned......Even when they are together and out of alignment the impeller will still turn, but the noise is amplified, and as you tune the alignment in you can obviously hear the difference in the tone of the pump.....Small, small adjustments make a huge difference.....
lubeck
Active Member
When I woke up this morning the skimmer is not producing any skim mate yet. Im not certain I have the right water height and bar height. Pump sounds the same too. I have to say I was getting much better surface agitation before and overall movement still giving it a chance though it's only been a day
acrylic51
Active Member
When I say 6" of water, I'm referring to the measurement from the bottom of the skimmer upward 6"......If your about this level you should be pretty good, but there's always room to tweak the skimmer as well. Another very good option for the skimmer is to do the gate valve mod, which makes the skimmer a bit easier to tune as well....
You mention plumbing issues.....I'm also curious as where you have the skimmer placed in the sump, does the water level fluctuate any.....and how calm or turbulent is the skimmer area.....If this area fluctuates from time to time, that will create skimming issues as well......
I use to run the ASM line a ways back and with tweaking and playing I was able to actual force the lid off the skimmer, it can pull that well.....The foam would literally ooze from under the lid. You have seen they aren't super water tight, but they are the cheaper alternative to the Euro Reef skimmers back in the day as well......
You mention plumbing issues.....I'm also curious as where you have the skimmer placed in the sump, does the water level fluctuate any.....and how calm or turbulent is the skimmer area.....If this area fluctuates from time to time, that will create skimming issues as well......
I use to run the ASM line a ways back and with tweaking and playing I was able to actual force the lid off the skimmer, it can pull that well.....The foam would literally ooze from under the lid. You have seen they aren't super water tight, but they are the cheaper alternative to the Euro Reef skimmers back in the day as well......
lubeck
Active Member
Just an update on the new ASM mini skimmer and MP10... The skimmer was doing fairly well drawing a decent amount of crap after about a week of break in. However, after my last water change and raising the skimmer up another 4" to maximize the amount of water in the sump, it has not pulled anything for about 4 days. I have it set around 6-7" from the base with the drain pipe just below the lip of the collection cup..... I'm not sure because i removed it and cleaned it if it has to break in again but I'm actually nervous because I carbon dose with vodka which promotes increased amounts of crud and I'm not seeing it..........
As for the MP10... I'm not as happy as I thought i would be. It makes quite a bit of noise from the motor. Ive adjusted it and even sent a video to EcoTech. They said it sounded normal and let it break in another couple weeks to break in the bearings. Besides the noise, it does not move enough water and so I had to put back one of my hydro 1250's. I'm going to give it some more time and tweak it but would like to get another if i see some improvements in sound. Has anyone tried to place two MPs on the back walls instead of the sides of the aquarium? would that work? any luck or modifications that could be done to the unit to make it quieter?
As for the MP10... I'm not as happy as I thought i would be. It makes quite a bit of noise from the motor. Ive adjusted it and even sent a video to EcoTech. They said it sounded normal and let it break in another couple weeks to break in the bearings. Besides the noise, it does not move enough water and so I had to put back one of my hydro 1250's. I'm going to give it some more time and tweak it but would like to get another if i see some improvements in sound. Has anyone tried to place two MPs on the back walls instead of the sides of the aquarium? would that work? any luck or modifications that could be done to the unit to make it quieter?
acrylic51
Active Member
Lubeck as far as the skimmer, I'd do a little googling and find where most are running the skimmer at meaning water depth inside the sump.....I would leave it and make a small adjustment......
My memory is a little fuzzy, but what size ASM did you put on the 30 gallon......I'm pretty sure the skimmer is a bit over sized for the tank, and as I had mentioned before with over sizing a skimmer doesn't mean you'll get increased skimming ability or action. In fact I know I had mentioned it might not be as productive consistently as a skimmer normally would be, and the fact you've moved it a few times, might have upset things as well. ASM's if my memory serves me correctly they do seem to take a tad longer to break in than other skimmers....Not necessarily sure why, but they don't seem to be the "quickest" of the bunch....I think I do remember about 2 weeks before they actually start performing well, but that could vary depending on the tank and it's load as well.
Curious a bit about your sump where the skimmer is located as well......How constant is the water level where the skimmer is placed.....Is the area where the skimmer is placed turbulent or calm......Some things I've hinted or questioned can play a huge part in how the skimmer performs as well......If your water level is fluctuating and I don't mean over a day or 2, but if you can notice the water level rise and fall in that area, that would give you sporadic skimming, if the water is super turbulent or rough/choppy in the area as well, could affect how the pump is operating.....
As far as the MP10's.......Again you see why I wasn't super pleased with the customer service, and the money spent......I do get tired of hearing well that's odd.....for the money they charge they should be dead perfect, but noise is an issue though.....I did notice that on initial start up running my 60's they were noisy, but after 2-3 days, mine actually seemed to quite a good bit.....to the point I actually had to walk up to them to see if they were running......
My memory is a little fuzzy, but what size ASM did you put on the 30 gallon......I'm pretty sure the skimmer is a bit over sized for the tank, and as I had mentioned before with over sizing a skimmer doesn't mean you'll get increased skimming ability or action. In fact I know I had mentioned it might not be as productive consistently as a skimmer normally would be, and the fact you've moved it a few times, might have upset things as well. ASM's if my memory serves me correctly they do seem to take a tad longer to break in than other skimmers....Not necessarily sure why, but they don't seem to be the "quickest" of the bunch....I think I do remember about 2 weeks before they actually start performing well, but that could vary depending on the tank and it's load as well.
Curious a bit about your sump where the skimmer is located as well......How constant is the water level where the skimmer is placed.....Is the area where the skimmer is placed turbulent or calm......Some things I've hinted or questioned can play a huge part in how the skimmer performs as well......If your water level is fluctuating and I don't mean over a day or 2, but if you can notice the water level rise and fall in that area, that would give you sporadic skimming, if the water is super turbulent or rough/choppy in the area as well, could affect how the pump is operating.....
As far as the MP10's.......Again you see why I wasn't super pleased with the customer service, and the money spent......I do get tired of hearing well that's odd.....for the money they charge they should be dead perfect, but noise is an issue though.....I did notice that on initial start up running my 60's they were noisy, but after 2-3 days, mine actually seemed to quite a good bit.....to the point I actually had to walk up to them to see if they were running......
lubeck
Active Member
Thanks Shawn. The Water line does not fluctuate any more than evaporation more or less. The sump itself is actually very slow as far as water movement. That is one reason why I wanted to hard line it because right now I have my drain pipe on the far left, next is the return pump which is under sized because I have to throttle back the drain pipe ( can you help me size the return Pump?) after the pump is 15lbs of LR and chateo, then my skimmer. I want my return to be at the far right so it has the water had a chance to cycle through the skimmer,LR and chateo.
acrylic51
Active Member
Lubeck I'd love to see a couple pics of the sump as it's setup currently.......Sometimes pics speak a 1000 words in some cases.....As far as the fluctuation due to evaporation, that to can affect the skimmer performance/operation as well....Might seem very insignificant, but can play a factor into things......
You spoke of your return pump being undersized....What are you currently running.....I would never advise throttling back the drain of the tank unless the overflow system is designed for it, and I'm pretty sure that isn't the case here.....First big question is what turnover rate are you looking for.....Being it's a 30 gallon tank with a 3-5X turnover rate you'd be looking at anywhere between 90gph to 150gph using that calculation......You then have to figure what height your pumping the water to return it back to the tank.....
What size plumbing is being used....How many elbows, valves, and water outlets are your planning or have.....
These are some of the things we'll need to look at when we size the return pump...... Sorry for all the questions.
You spoke of your return pump being undersized....What are you currently running.....I would never advise throttling back the drain of the tank unless the overflow system is designed for it, and I'm pretty sure that isn't the case here.....First big question is what turnover rate are you looking for.....Being it's a 30 gallon tank with a 3-5X turnover rate you'd be looking at anywhere between 90gph to 150gph using that calculation......You then have to figure what height your pumping the water to return it back to the tank.....
lubeck
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by acrylic51 http:///t/390779/new-protein-skimmer-or-mp40-what-would-you-do/20#post_3467369
Lubeck I'd love to see a couple pics of the sump as it's setup currently.......Sometimes pics speak a 1000 words in some cases.....As far as the fluctuation due to evaporation, that to can affect the skimmer performance/operation as well....Might seem very insignificant, but can play a factor into things......
You spoke of your return pump being undersized....What are you currently running.....I would never advise throttling back the drain of the tank unless the overflow system is designed for it, and I'm pretty sure that isn't the case here.....First big question is what turnover rate are you looking for.....Being it's a 30 gallon tank with a 3-5X turnover rate you'd be looking at anywhere between 90gph to 150gph using that calculation......You then have to figure what height your pumping the water to return it back to the tank.....
What size plumbing is being used....How many elbows, valves, and water outlets are your planning or have.....
These are some of the things we'll need to look at when we size the return pump...... Sorry for all the questions.
the reason i have to throttle back the return is so the drain pipe does not gurgle... If you look at a normal Fluval Studio 600 aquarium they are pre-drilled with a 3/4" and 1/2" lines. I believe what the intent was for the 1/2" line was for the drain pipe which only reaches 1/2 way up the tank.(which means it is fully submerged). The 3/4"was intended for the return spray bar...
I didn't set it up this way because I made a sump. I have the 3/4" as the drain because i wanted to use it as a mini over flow removing all the top skim to the sump to get cleaned up. As i mentioned above, i use a 485 gph return. My goal would be to take the return pump and place as far to the right as possible which is where my skimmer is currently. Im not sure i need to set up baffles because I dont have much room and since i have a gate valve i can control the water level pretty well. Most of all, this is where i pull my water out when doing water changes so i want to keep it as open as i can to remove the detrius that is all over the bottom of the sump...
With that said, I will remain with a 3/4 drain line. Now, i could go to a 3/4" return line and use a adapter to 1/2" once i get to the bulk head. Or just stick with the 1/2" and upgrade to the right size pump...I don't have the exact measurements but the return line would look like this (sticking with 1/2" for now). barb to straight fitting, 2" of pipe, 90, 12" of pipe, 90, 12" of pipe, fitting to return pump. So i don't know what the calculations are for the 90's but it looks like around 32" of pipe minus the 90's to get up and into the water column. O, i forgot a gate valve or i might just stick with the check valve that i already have in place (you can see in the pic)
Originally Posted by acrylic51 http:///t/390779/new-protein-skimmer-or-mp40-what-would-you-do/20#post_3467369
Lubeck I'd love to see a couple pics of the sump as it's setup currently.......Sometimes pics speak a 1000 words in some cases.....As far as the fluctuation due to evaporation, that to can affect the skimmer performance/operation as well....Might seem very insignificant, but can play a factor into things......
You spoke of your return pump being undersized....What are you currently running.....I would never advise throttling back the drain of the tank unless the overflow system is designed for it, and I'm pretty sure that isn't the case here.....First big question is what turnover rate are you looking for.....Being it's a 30 gallon tank with a 3-5X turnover rate you'd be looking at anywhere between 90gph to 150gph using that calculation......You then have to figure what height your pumping the water to return it back to the tank.....
the reason i have to throttle back the return is so the drain pipe does not gurgle... If you look at a normal Fluval Studio 600 aquarium they are pre-drilled with a 3/4" and 1/2" lines. I believe what the intent was for the 1/2" line was for the drain pipe which only reaches 1/2 way up the tank.(which means it is fully submerged). The 3/4"was intended for the return spray bar...
I didn't set it up this way because I made a sump. I have the 3/4" as the drain because i wanted to use it as a mini over flow removing all the top skim to the sump to get cleaned up. As i mentioned above, i use a 485 gph return. My goal would be to take the return pump and place as far to the right as possible which is where my skimmer is currently. Im not sure i need to set up baffles because I dont have much room and since i have a gate valve i can control the water level pretty well. Most of all, this is where i pull my water out when doing water changes so i want to keep it as open as i can to remove the detrius that is all over the bottom of the sump...
With that said, I will remain with a 3/4 drain line. Now, i could go to a 3/4" return line and use a adapter to 1/2" once i get to the bulk head. Or just stick with the 1/2" and upgrade to the right size pump...I don't have the exact measurements but the return line would look like this (sticking with 1/2" for now). barb to straight fitting, 2" of pipe, 90, 12" of pipe, 90, 12" of pipe, fitting to return pump. So i don't know what the calculations are for the 90's but it looks like around 32" of pipe minus the 90's to get up and into the water column. O, i forgot a gate valve or i might just stick with the check valve that i already have in place (you can see in the pic)