New to the salt Fish world, plz help

[fretfreak13]

Probably shock from acclimation. This is just my example, it kinda sucks, but it makes sence to me. Have you ever been to a big city where they have oxygen bars? Basically it's like a builing where they have really pure air and what not. You walk in from the street and the difference hits you like a brick wall. That is kind of what's happening to your fish, except they're a lot more sensitive.

 

[zako]

What levels should i be testing for in my water?... for when i go buy the test kits. how can you tell if your tank cycle has started and ended?

 

[fretfreak13]

Oh, here's a question people forgot to ask. lol Where did you get your LR? If you got it from your LFS and brought it straight home, most likely you wouldn't have had much of a cycle. Without any livestock in the but the rock, put in an uncooked peice of shrimp. The good bacteria in your tank will start to eat on in and reproduce.
I bought a kit for ammonia, PH, nitrate, and nitrite. However, I'm looking to upgrade my testing supplies now that I have coral. Get those four for sure, but you also might want to look into Phosphates, Calcium, Magnesium...etc. Other's chime in on that one?

 

[zako]

Originally Posted by Fretfreak13
http:///forum/post/3172737
Oh, here's a question people forgot to ask. lol Where did you get your LR? If you got it from your LFS and brought it straight home, most likely you wouldn't have had much of a cycle. Without any livestock in the but the rock, put in an uncooked peice of shrimp. The good bacteria in your tank will start to eat on in and reproduce.
I bought a kit for ammonia, PH, nitrate, and nitrite. However, I'm looking to upgrade my testing supplies now that I have coral. Get those four for sure, but you also might want to look into Phosphates, Calcium, Magnesium...etc. Other's chime in on that one?
Yea all my LR came from the LFS, straight home and into the tank, thanks for recommendations on the test kits, the two damsles that died this afternoon are still in there would they help or hurt the cycle, all my hermits and snails are still alive do they do anything for the cycle?

 

[fretfreak13]

IMO, if there isn't a spike in ammonia go ahead in leave the damsels until there is. It should serve the same purpose as the uncooked shrimp, if I"m not mistaken. Once you do see the spike though you should take them out, though your CUC will probably have eaten most of them by then. You might want to take out your hermits and crabs, the cycle could kill them.

 

[zako]

Originally Posted by Fretfreak13
http:///forum/post/3172748
IMO, if there isn't a spike in ammonia go ahead in leave the damsels until there is. It should serve the same purpose as the uncooked shrimp, if I"m not mistaken. Once you do see the spike though you should take them out, though your CUC will probably have eaten most of them by then. You might want to take out your hermits and crabs, the cycle could kill them.
So my cycle hasnt even started? and why would the LFS tell me my water is fine when it keeps killin all my fish.

 

[fretfreak13]

I'm not exactly sure if your cycle has started or not. If there's nothing to fuel the cycle, to my understanding you wont have one.
Also, something else just struck me. Do you have an electrical tester? Like the kind that you stick into a plug socket? Maybe you have stray voltage comming from somewhere and it might be shocking your fish. That sure wouldn't show up in any water test lol. It's just a VERY wild guess, but it's possible.

 

[zako]

Originally Posted by Fretfreak13
http:///forum/post/3172757
I'm not exactly sure if your cycle has started or not. If there's nothing to fuel the cycle, to my understanding you wont have one.
Also, something else just struck me. Do you have an electrical tester? Like the kind that you stick into a plug socket? Maybe you have stray voltage comming from somewhere and it might be shocking your fish. That sure wouldn't show up in any water test lol. It's just a VERY wild guess, but it's possible.
I do but im not so sure thats the problem, ive had everything plugged in and have moved rocks around in the tank and havent felt in fault current, and also the hermits and snails are doing good and not all the fish have died as fast as the last couple

 

[fretfreak13]

I forgot about the hermits and snails. *sigh* I'm at a loss then. I do think that your tank hasn't made a full cycle yet, though. Most likely your LR came out of a tank with only LR in it, or at least that's how my LFS has theirs set up. When you add fish it increases the bio load and adds ammonia to the tank though waste and uneaten food, but I can't see that happening in only forty five seconds.
Personally if this was me, I would take the CUC back to the lfs and see if they'll let you get the same ammount later when your water ballences out. Buy a test kit. When you see an ammonia spike from the dead damsels, take them out and make them a sacrifice to the Porcelian God. Watch the water level as it ballences out from there. I'm pretty sure you know this already from what you've written so far, but the ammonia should spike, then go down, then the nitrites should spike and go down, and then you'll have nirtates. The nitrates are safe to have, but in numbers of 0-20 ppm.

 

[zako]

Originally Posted by Fretfreak13
http:///forum/post/3172769
I forgot about the hermits and snails. *sigh* I'm at a loss then. I do think that your tank hasn't made a full cycle yet, though. Most likely your LR came out of a tank with only LR in it, or at least that's how my LFS has theirs set up. When you add fish it increases the bio load and adds ammonia to the tank though waste and uneaten food, but I can't see that happening in only forty five seconds.
Personally if this was me, I would take the CUC back to the lfs and see if they'll let you get the same ammount later when your water ballences out. Buy a test kit. When you see an ammonia spike from the dead damsels, take them out and make them a sacrifice to the Porcelian God. Watch the water level as it ballences out from there. I'm pretty sure you know this already from what you've written so far, but the ammonia should spike, then go down, then the nitrites should spike and go down, and then you'll have nirtates. The nitrates are safe to have, but in numbers of 0-20 ppm.
Yea, thats how they had there LR in one big tank. So they tank not being fully cycled would kill a fish in as little as 45 seconds?

 

[flukes]

Hello Zako,
Sounds like you are getting frustrated, and for good reason. You have your LFS telling you that everything is fine and your ready to start adding fish and it is heart breaking to see them die after putting them in your tank. I do question any fish store that would sell you a tang let-a-lone two tangs, knowing that you have a 40 gallon tank.

Now would be a good time to stop and collect information, which you are now doing, take a deep breath and rethink things a bit.
I would began again with buying a master test kit, as others has advised, a refractometer and a RO/DI unit. I would also do a large water change using the RO/DI water and then restart your cycle. By doing this you are removing variables (unknown problems). Some of the problems that you may be having is from using your well water. It is hard to say what is in the water and there isn't a feasible way to test the well water. I do agree with the others that your acclimation process could be the cause of the loss of fish.
One of the great things about saltwater aquariums is that there is so much life in our tanks that it is more than just fish. As your tank cycles you will see all kinds of awesome and alien life moving around in the tank, enjoy these little creatures in the mean time. Keep your chin up, relax and take things slow

 

[raymond2688]

number one thing is the test kit and stop getting advice from LFS. my tank took 4 months to cycle and recycle and recycle do to bad advice if i had come here first it would have cost me way less money and aggrivation.
i read threw this whole post but did not see anywhere were you explained how you acclimated your fish.
good luck if you have a bit of patients and listen to the folks on here you will have a great tank

 

[zako]

Originally Posted by raymond2688
http:///forum/post/3172897
number one thing is the test kit and stop getting advice from LFS. my tank took 4 months to cycle and recycle and recycle do to bad advice if i had come here first it would have cost me way less money and aggrivation.
i read threw this whole post but did not see anywhere were you explained how you acclimated your fish.
good luck if you have a bit of patients and listen to the folks on here you will have a great tank
Yea, im slowly startin to figure out the LFS likes watching me kill fish after fish, i acclimated them by leaving the bag in the water for 15 mintues, the opened up the top and every 5 minutes would put 1/3 cup of water into the bag until it was full then waited another 10 minutes and netted the fish out.

 

[happyfeet]

Originally Posted by Zako
http:///forum/post/3172977
Yea, im slowly startin to figure out the LFS likes watching me kill fish after fish, i acclimated them by leaving the bag in the water for 15 mintues, the opened up the top and every 5 minutes would put 1/3 cup of water into the bag until it was full then waited another 10 minutes and netted the fish out.
Get some air tubing, it's like $1 at the LFS and pick up a small bucket, OR do what I do and just cut the top off a Milk Jug(I use the ones that had distilled water in them and recommend not using one previously filled with milk). Tie a Loose knot in the air tubing 6 inches from one end. Poke a small hole in the milk jug and thread the side of the tubing with the knot through the hole into the milk jug.
Take the other end of the tubing and put it into your display tank, or sump if you have one.
Cut open the fish bag and place your fish along with the water in the Jug. Now suck on the end of tubing with the knot until it starts a siphon. Tighten the knot or loosen the knot until about 3 drops of water come out per second. Cover the Milk Jug with a clean towel and let it sit for about 2 hours. Check back every so often to make sure the knot is still regulating flow and the jug isn't about to overflow. After a couple hours net your fish and place them in your tank.
If your fish are dying in a matter of seconds and your LFS is saying your cycle is done, I don’t think it has anything to do with a cycle (UNLESS both LFS are bold faced liars and you have a ton of Nitrite or Ammonia in your system). It seems to me its more likely associated with how your acclimating your fish.
That being said you may have a chemical in your tank. Did you clean your tank out when you bought it? Clean any part of it? Did you use Windex to make the outside of it nice and shiny? Did you spray raid to kill any cockroaches in your house? Did you use drano to unplug a drain recently?
I know it sounds extreme, but you’re getting pretty extreme results. I sprayed raid in my house to kill cockroaches and some of the particles went airborne and made its way to my tank. I literally watched my Fish, Inverts, Algae, and Macro Algae’s die overnight.

 

[zako]

Originally Posted by Happyfeet
http:///forum/post/3173016
If your fish are dying in a matter of seconds and your LFS is saying your cycle is done, I don’t think it has anything to do with a cycle (UNLESS both LFS are bold faced liars and you have a ton of Nitrite or Ammonia in your system). It seems to me its more likely associated with how your acclimating your fish.
That being said you may have a chemical in your tank. Did you clean your tank out when you bought it? Clean any part of it? Did you use Windex to make the outside of it nice and shiny? Did you spray raid to kill any cockroaches in your house? Did you use drano to unplug a drain recently?
I know it sounds extreme, but you’re getting pretty extreme results. I sprayed raid in my house to kill cockroaches and some of the particles went airborne and made its way to my tank. I literally watched my Fish, Inverts, Algae, and Macro Algae’s die overnight.
I cleaned my tank with just a paper towl with hot water and rubbed the insides, there are still hermits and snails living in there, i have cleaned the front of the tank with windex but never have sprayed it directly onto the tank, I sprayed it onto a towel then rubbed the front glass down i wasnt to close to the tank when i sprayed it on there i went around a corner.

 

[luvmyreef]

Well, I have to agree with what flukes stated above.....You said you use well water....well water contains a lot of things like heavy metals, etc. some things you cant test for. this is probably your issue or it will be another one for you. Either change to distilled water from the store or buy a RO/DI unit. Either way, do not dump well water in your tank.

 

[jstdv8]

Im kind of a newbie too, but could the quick deaths have anything to do with PH shock? he never said if the fish store tested for PH.
If using well water you will probably have some copper in there if your house is aged much. Gotta get a tester kit of your own preferably the master reef ones becuase they come with calcium and phosphates usually too, but any kit is better than no kit. ammonia, nitirites and nitrates at the very least.
and definatley get an Ro/Di system so you can make your own pure water.

 

[eric b 125]

Originally Posted by Flower
http:///forum/post/3172723

The ocean hasn't changed in many thousands of years .
the oceans have changed drastically.

 

[zako]

The results are in, I took the advice of everyone helping me out and went and got a test kit. now only if i knew what that numbers ment, heh..
pH: 7.7
amonia: kinda tough to read, wasnt 0 but wasnt 0.25 looked closer to 0 to me.
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate:0
KH: 13
Salinity 1.026
Would these numbers explain why a fish would die so fast? The owner of my LFS says to disolve a table spoon of baking soda in a glass to try and bring my pH up.

 

[fretfreak13]

I still think you havn't had a cycle yet, especially if you have a small ammonia reading and no nitrates. Did you leave the damsels in there? That might be the cause of the ammonia, too.