Nice fish, very expensive.

[reefstar22]

Why does that make me dumb?
If rock is 9.50 per lb at 500lbs needed for a 500 gallon tank your looking @ $4750.
If you look at a plane ticket to a tropical island your looking on average of about $1300. - Time to stay for a few days at a local price at a place that isn't to expensive your looking at $500. - Now your @ 1800. - At this point your on vacation enjoying yourself. - Figure $300 for food at local prices now your @ $2100. Keep in mind there ARE places on Earth where you can harvest rock legally.
Hire a local to take you out by boat to find rock in approved area's your looking at around $60-$100 depending if your getting ripped off. - Now your to a running total of $2200. - Rental for gear - $200 on the expensive end. Now your @ $2400. - Shipping for live rock home with box around $500 by cargo ship. - Now your @ $2,900.
At this point your saving $1850. - And you got a vacation out of it. - May take alittle longer, but you've picked out the rocks, made a trip out of it for yourself and have the EXACT rocks you want for your tank. - With that $1850 you can buy the best skimmer and a good part of your lighting.
Sorry If I like to take my hobby to the extreme, but there is a reason I'm good with money. - Man I'm dumb.

You know whats on my mind here? - Saving money in paradise. Woot!

 

[ssssoma]

Originally Posted by Reefstar22
I'm glad the great painters of the world stood there ground against sticking to the norm, or we'd never have great paintings like Mona Lisa, Scream...etc

I'm sorry, but this analogy makes absolutely no sense. If your fish were not living creatures I could see where you're coming from.
But you're talking about putting an animal's life on the line for your own amusement.
That's pretty pathetic.

 

[reefstar22]

Originally Posted by Ssssoma
I'm sorry, but this analogy makes absolutely no sense. If your fish were not living creatures I could see where you're coming from.
But you're talking about putting an animal's life on the line for your own amusement.
That's pretty pathetic.

What about the monkeys they test for medical purposes? Or the rabbits they do tests on? - What about the tests they put animals through to make your make up and perfumes better?
What about the medical testing they put forth in the middle ages? What about that? With out that trial and error we would be no where near where we are in modern medicine. Try new things, learn from the mistakes and move forward.
Only mistake with my stingray if anything was the type of sand I had, other than that the tank was set up perfectly for it. - Now I know, if I want a stingray I need softer sand. - Documented and its going to be added.

How is that different?

 

[sh2000]

I live on the ocean in Deal, NJ and in Rockaway, NY. So I have access to ocean water and sand and shells rocks etc...is it legal for me to pick a nice shell up and put it in my DT ? (The live sand is on my private property and shells..) Do i need to throw it back to the ocean ?

 

[reefstar22]

Originally Posted by SH2000
I live on the ocean in Deal, NJ and in Rockaway, NY. So I have access to ocean water and sand and shells rocks etc...is it legal for me to pick a nice shell up and put it in my DT ? (The live sand is on my private property and shells..) Do i need to throw it back to the ocean ?

You want to watch taking stuff right off the beach because its polluted more than likely. - I would suggest boiling it as well in case there are parasites. - Yes you take the risk adding anything from the ocean, but once you boil it over over time bacteria will take back over and it will come back to life if you have good live sand in your tank. - If your going to take sand I would get it in a remote area or out in the ocean, but at that point you have to dive for it. - Kinda pointless for sand.

 

[t316]

Why does that make me dumb?
If rock is 9.50 per lb at 500lbs needed for a 500 gallon tank your looking @ $4750.
If you look at a plane ticket to a tropical island your looking on average of about $1300. - Time to stay for a few days at a local price at a place that isn't to expensive your looking at $500. - Now your @ 1800. - At this point your on vacation enjoying yourself. - Figure $300 for food at local prices now your @ $2100. Keep in mind there ARE places on Earth where you can harvest rock legally.
Hire a local to take you out by boat to find rock in approved area's your looking at around $60-$100 depending if your getting ripped off. - Now your to a running total of $2200. - Rental for gear - $200 on the expensive end. Now your @ $2400. - Shipping for live rock home with box around $500 by cargo ship. - Now your @ $2,900.
At this point your saving $1850. - And you got a vacation out of it. - May take alittle longer, but you've picked out the rocks, made a trip out of it for yourself and have the EXACT rocks you want for your tank. - With that $1850 you can buy the best skimmer and a good part of your lighting.
=====================================
=====================================
Or here's a more realistic scenario...
all of the above up until the getting off the local's boat. Get off boat, only to be arrested for illegal taking of a government regulated item, and all of your possessions seized, only to find out the local who took you out had no idea what he was talking about, only wanted your $. Get hauled down to the local cave/cell block where you are pronounced guilty, fined $20,000, and sentenced to 5 years in local holding area, not to leave the country. Meanwhile being gaurded and fed by another local girl named Nummba. Get sick and have the squirts for 6 months from some disease from the food Nummba fed you. Finally released after 3 years, which included good behavior and American governmental pressure. Return home to a wife that's left you by now and married your brother. And still don't have the rock since it was thrown in the dumpster at the boat dock when seized.
Trip, stay, & food (before arrest) = 2100.00
Fine = 20,000.00
One way trip home = 1000.00
Medical costs associated w/ follow up Doctor visits from Nummba's disease = 8000.00
Total = $31,100.00
Lesson learned from some other idiot and not going further than lfs in the first place = priceless

 

[reefstar22]

WOW.
Thats a story. - I said find a place thats legal. - Speak to the local authorities before you do so. - I shouldn't have to hold your hand when giving examples.
There are many places in the indo pacific ocean you can legally collect items from the ocean, rock/sand/corals. - I know, I've looked.
Going to an illegal area and a legal area are completely different things.

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by Reefstar22
- Shipping for live rock home with box around $500 by cargo ship. - Now your @ $2,900....
And you'll get a box in a few weeks of rotting, dead rock.
Cargo ship?

 

[reefstar22]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
And you'll get a box in a few weeks of rotting, dead rock.
Cargo ship?

When they ship goods, in and out of countries such as small islands they use what are called " Cargo ships" - They bring good such as : Food/Water/Cars...etc.
When your rock comes home directly from the ocean it needs to be cured. -To eliminate the dye off. - This is why pet stores often offer massive discounts if the live rock needs to be cured, however due to the smell many stores buy the rock pre cured. - The " LIVE " rock your getting at the pet store has HUGE amounts of dye off compared to what it was in like in the ocean.
Often times when people are collecting the rock from the ocean, they let it sit on the beach for days in the hot sun before it is brought to areas for cleaning/curing.

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by Reefstar22
When they ship goods, in and out of countries such as small islands they use what are called " Cargo ships" - They bring good such as : Food/Water/Cars...etc.
When your rock comes home directly from the ocean it needs to be cured. -To eliminate the dye off. - This is why pet stores often offer massive discounts if the live rock needs to be cured, however due to the smell many stores buy the rock pre cured. - The " LIVE " rock your getting at the pet store has HUGE amounts of dye off compared to what it was in like in the ocean.
Often times when people are collecting the rock from the ocean, they let it sit on the beach for days in the hot sun before it is brought to areas for cleaning/curing.
Quality collectors do not let the rock sit on the shore in the sun for long periods of time. That's why live rock varies in quality.
When they ship live rock they ship it in the cargo hold of Commercial Airlines. Live rock would certainly NOT make it back to you alive if it was shipped on a boat for weeks...
All rock shipped needs to be cured; even out of the water a few hours it has die off.
They ship fish/inverts the same way. Feel free to research this for yourself. Many of us on this forum have purchased live rock directly from exporters and pick it up from the airport....

 

[reefstar22]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
Quality collectors do not let the rock sit on the shore in the sun for long periods of time. That's why live rock varies in quality.
When they ship live rock they ship it in the cargo hold of Commercial Airlines. Live rock would certainly NOT make it back to you alive if it was shipped on a boat for weeks...
All rock shipped needs to be cured; even out of the water a few hours it has die off.
They ship fish/inverts the same way. Feel free to research this for yourself. Many of us on this forum have purchased live rock directly from exporters and pick it up from the airport....

I'm not saying livestock is shipped by boat, however you have to understand even if it does die through the boat ride, that some life will survive, when you cure it it will be fine.
I've added lbs of base rock to my tank before, to find them teaming with life only after a few months.

 

[ncognito]

Personally I think guy has no idea what he is talking about and just making crap up as he goes along. I couldn't stop laughing when I read his "cargo ship" story. Obviously he doesn't have clue that they ship the rock including fish in the "cargo hold" area of a plane. Bottom line.....he has no idea what he is talking about and one day we just might be reading about him iin the news. I hope for the day!!!!

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by Reefstar22
I'm not saying livestock is shipped by boat, however you have to understand even if it does die through the boat ride, that some life will survive, when you cure it it will be fine.
I've added lbs of base rock to my tank before, to find them teaming with life only after a few months.
But that is precisely my point. Live rock should be considered "livestock" for most purposes.
Base rock will never supply your tank with all of the micro stars, worms, pods and assorted other critters fresh live rock will.
We've gotten off topic here a bit, but I think it was an important clarification so that new visitors to the site didn't get the wrong idea about how live rock should be handled.

 

[sh2000]

Is it better to buy premium Fiji LR from LFS for $5-6/lb that you can just put into your DT w/o curing it ? or get it online for $3-4/lb and then have to cure it for 2-4 weeks ?

 

[reefstar22]

I'm saying for cost. You can ship it that way cheaper. -Planes work, but do you know much that is to ship that kind of weight?
Issue is its ROCK. - It only needs a bit of biological material to live, once it arrives and cures everything will take its course.

 

[nctarheels]

this argument is pointless. even if you do take rock from the ocean and it does save you a buck, you are depriving some other fish out there of their homes. reef destruction may not seem to be a big deal now, but in 40 years, there will be a lot less left. what reefstar does is his priority, but nothing anyone says will change his mind, and i would hope that he would eventually see that he is destroying the reefs and taking homes of the fish, but we cant do anything to stop him so there is no point in arguing. just let it be known that this is not the responsible thing to do being the avid marine aquarist.

 

[sh2000]

Originally Posted by SH2000
Is it better to buy premium Fiji LR from LFS for $5-6/lb that you can just put into your DT w/o curing it ? or get it online for $3-4/lb and then have to cure it for 2-4 weeks ?
Can someone answer this ?

 

[wangotango]

If you plan on taking it back on the plane with you, I think customs would be an issue. If you wanted to ship it, since it's heavy it would probably cost a lot. I really don't think a round trip plane ticket, hotel, and shipping costs could possible be cheaper, but you do what you want.
-Justin

 

[wangotango]

Originally Posted by SH2000
Can someone answer this ?
I don't think it matters, but if you order the rock and cure it, it gives you the chance to catch any bad hitch-hikers before they get into your tank, whereas with LR from the lfs could be crawling with stuff that you wouldn't know about unit it's in your tank.
-Justin

 

[sh2000]

what's so bad about hitchhikers ? and what exactly is a hitchhiker ?