nitrates to high

[bowser220]

My nitrates are 40 ppm. I have done water changes and I put a nitrate remover in my media. My ammonia levels are 0 but my PH is 7.8. I have crushed coral as a substrate. Can the rise in nitrates impact my PH? How can I get the nitrate level down. I am having an algae breakout of course. T he tank is 2 years old and fish only. I plan on adding live rock this week but I want to get the levels looking good. Any suggestions?

 

[celacanthr]

1)I can almost gauruntee that the trates are bieng caused by the crushed coral. Get the crushed coral out NOW b4 you put in the rocks
2) the sooner you add the rocks the better, just be sure to clean and cycle the rocks in a different container

 

[bowser220]

shouldn't the crushed coral keep the PH level?

 

[duke13]

I wouldn't worry too much about your PH level, most good salts out there will sustain that.
Like CELACANTHr said, get rid of the crushed coral immediately.
Crushed Coral = Nitrate pockets waiting to release at first disturbance

 

[1journeyman]

Sand will aid your pH far better than CC.

 

[unleashed]

I have always used cc in place of sand .if you maintain your water it (cc)wont effect your nitrates you ph could be dropping due to water changes(top offs). you can always add a buffer to maintain ph.make sure you are using a syphon and accually cleaning the substrate.all subsrtates harbor bacteria that can lead to high nitrates.most substrates also need to be changes periodicly by removing some not all.and adding some new,this should be done within aprox 2 yrs of set up give or take.

 

[otto13]

It should be finely crushed. All of my stuff is about 5x a grain of salt.

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by unleashed
I have always used cc in place of sand .if you maintain your water it (cc)wont effect your nitrates you ph could be dropping due to water changes(top offs). you can always add a buffer to maintain ph.make sure you are using a syphon and accually cleaning the substrate.all subsrtates harbor bacteria that can lead to high nitrates.most substrates also need to be changes periodicly by removing some not all.and adding some new,this should be done within aprox 2 yrs of set up give or take.
The problem with cc is not that it harbors bacteria (that's a good thing), but that is catches detritus. CC doesn't allow for the neccessary clean up crews to properly do their job, it manages to catch and hold detritus (even with vigorous water movement), and it doesn't break down until your pH is dangerously low.
Sand (aragonite) allows for better clean up crew viability, keeps detritus on the surface of the sand, and breaks down as your pH approaches 8.0 (thus buffering your pH). Also, you don't have to remove old sand.. it simply desintegrates over time... you just add more occasionally.

 

[jdragunas]

i have to agree with journeyman on this one. Sand is far better for your tank. Also, if you get any bottom-dwelling fish, or corals, the CC will most likely injur them, causing infections, and most likely deaths.
As for your ph, DO NOT ADD A BUFFER!!! Your ph is tied directly with your alkalinity and your calcium levels. The first thing you need to do is figure out what's causing the low PH. If you have low alkalinity, then you can add a buffer (as buffer is just pure alkalinity). However, if your calcium levels are low, you should add calcium, and not a buffer. You should never add anything to your tank until you figure out what the cause of the problem is first!
So, here are three things for you to do:
1. remove CC and add sand
2. Test for alkalinity
3. test for caclium
When you do the 2nd two, post the results, and we'll go from there.

 

[bang guy]

Originally Posted by unleashed
you can always add a buffer to maintain ph.
I respectfully disagree with this. Adding a buffer when alkalinity is already fine will only cause an imbalance and the PH climb will be very temporary.
If ALK is low then by all means add a buffer to raise it and that will certainly help PH. Don't blindly add a buffer though.

 

[otto13]

I use argonite which I though was a finely crushed coral. Is it sand?

 

[bang guy]

Originally Posted by otto13
I use argonite which I though was a finely crushed coral. Is it sand?
Aragonite is just a type of Calcium carbonate. It's found in the form of sand, crushed coral, powder, coral skeletons, boulders, etc.

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by jdragunas
i have to agree with journeyman on this one....
you make it sound like that is a bad thing...

 

[pco1988]

I don't know, I have had my 30gal set up for a long time and the nitrates are at about 200ppm. Now I have tried all different tests and they give me the same thing anywhere from 150-250ppm.
Now people like bang guy know what my tank looks like and all of you can look at my pics of it as I update them frequently. Now with that I have never done a water change in about 10-12months. Will this ever come back too bite me, as it hasn't for the last year? Or am I just a wierd statistic that nothing has never happened.
I have had one algea bloom and had a protein skimmer on the tank until it died and don't add anything to the tank concerning additives as the tests always come out fine. The only thing I do to the tank is add cold tap water (city water with low amount of elements in it) to it once a day as for the evapotation rate is high because I run an open water tank with power compacts with an extra shied for the light fixture.
I also have CC and have never, never had a problem concerning things like my scooter blenny or my purple reef lobster ever having visable blemishes from burrowing. Now in some pics the CC is covered in layers in algea in the middle but never the top inch. I have 50lbs. of CC and about 70-75lbs. of live rock in the tank.
Can anyone finsd out why the tank is doing so well, or is this dumb luck that will eventually run out of such luck? Now the 120gal monster I just started about 6 monthes ago is a different story and that, that tank is so hard too keep up with. Isn't the larger tanks suppose to be easier to take care of?
Just wanted to bring this to your attention and that you can yell and scream when need be about this weird tank of mine.
Philip

 

[celacanthr]

Well... I think that bigger tanks are easier UP TOO A POINT... which I would guess is between 80-100 gallons.

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by pco1988
I don't know, I have had my 30gal set up for a long time and the nitrates are at about 200ppm.... Just wanted to bring this to your attention and that you can yell and scream when need be about this weird tank of mine.
Philip
LOL... wow. Well, each system is different. I can't believe your inverts can survive in that though... have you had success adding them to the tank since the nitrate is sooo high?
Imho that is exactly why "not" to have cc though... I'm not lucky enough to get away with something like that. If my nitrates went that high everything would die on me.

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by CELACANTHr
Well... I think that bigger tanks are easier UP TOO A POINT... which I would guess is between 80-100 gallons.
I'm not sure... my tank really isn't "hard" to take care of:
I add water... sure it's a pain to carry in 25 gallons of water every week, but not really THAT much more of a pain then having to carry in 5 gallons.
Breaking down pumps and cleaning them isn't fun... but 1 or 3... not THAt big of a deal.
Making my own food. No difference. Just use bigger ice trays to freeze the blocks in.
Cost... that one stinks... sand, rock, lights, salt, etc... more sand to replace sand that is disintergrating...
Scraping glass... nope... let the snails do it.
Water changes... Again, not really much more work to do 30 gallons instead of 5.
Testing is the same.
So, really, if I had to do it over again I wouldn't hesitate to set up a larger tank.

 

[jdragunas]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
you make it sound like that is a bad thing...

ugh, it is... i like being my own person, and having to agree with someone kinda puts a damper on that free spirit of mine...

lol!
As for the lack of water change for a year, lemme say one thing... :scared: :scared: :scared:
It is actually a miracle that you haven't had any problems. My guess is that it's taken a year for your nitrates to get up to 200ppm, so your fish have just gotten used to the burning lungs... kinda like smokers... it's unpleasant at first, but you get used to it after a while. It's not really high nitrates that kill fish, it's the shock of going from 0-50 in a day. That big of a change in that little time shocks the fish, and that's why they die. Your luck will run out, however... IMO, if you want a saltwater tank, you have to be responsible for caring for it too. That means doing water changes at least monthly, and testing frequently, and feeding the fish properly, and providing them a good home. With 200ppm nitrates, that's not a very good home, and those poor fish are probably suffering so much.
This is what you need to do asap! Do weekly water changes of 10-15%. I believe in your case, you shouldn't do too big of water changes, because you may actually shock the fish by taking your nitrates down so much so quickly.
You really need to clean out your CC, if you decide to keep it. The layer of algae in the middle of it is probably a big collection of leftover rotten food, and fish pooh. That's not a very healthy environment for anyone. The mandarinfish really needs a sandy bottom. you've mentioned that you haven't actually seen visible abrasions on its stomach, but how often does your fish just turn upside down so you can see his belly. My guess is not very often...
I'm not yelling at all, so don't take me that way!

but you really need to be dedicated to your saltwater fish tank. Remember, most of these fish have been pulled from their comfy home out on some great reef, probably with cyanide, transported for days on end, thrown in some tank in some shopping store, where people with big faces come and stare and tap on the glass all day long. It's our job to try and give them the best home possible after all of that traumatization, and that means providing clean water for them to live in. If you don't have time, or are not up for that responsibility, then you should really trade in your fish, and start a freshwater tank, as those are much easier to care for, and require much less responsibility. I hope you make the right decision!

 

[pco1988]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
LOL... wow. Well, each system is different. I can't believe your inverts can survive in that though... have you had success adding them to the tank since the nitrate is sooo high?
The three shrimp in the tank were added about two monthes ago. As for the lobster he has been there since August 2004.
Originally Posted by jdragunas
Do weekly water changes of 10-15%. I believe in your case, you shouldn't do too big of water changes, because you may actually shock the fish by taking your nitrates down so much so quickly.
Won't this much shock them anyway???
Originally Posted by jdragunas
you've mentioned that you haven't actually seen visible abrasions on its stomach, but how often does your fish just turn upside down so you can see his belly. My guess is not very often...
She scoots a cross the glass when I feed them, she comes from where she is to the top right corner to eat.
Philip

 

[jdragunas]

a 10% water change isn't that much. If you space them a week apart, it'll bring down the nitrates quickly, but not too quickly...
And that's not the only reason you shouldn't have CC... as your water parameters have proven, they are a waste trap, and cause a high amount of nitrates...