On being rude
- Thread starter florida joe
- Start date
florida joe
Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by coachKLM
http:///forum/post/2486972
ohh they .. agreed to put it to rest.... whueeew
good job guys we all care... just in different ways .. good night.
peace my friend and a job well done from one vet to another
http:///forum/post/2486972
good job guys we all care... just in different ways .. good night.
peace my friend and a job well done from one vet to another
1journeyman
Active Member
Joe, indeed it can be frustrating.
Then again, two points you must consider; "Tone" does not get communicated over the message board very well. Also, not everyone who uses these forums are native English speaking aquarists. The second point is that an offended visitor may leave and never return.
Just keep both of these things in mind. Your post may come across more harshly than you intended because your tone was lost. Even more so if the reader doesn't speak English well.
If a poster has a problem, comes here, is attacked and leaves look how much more damage is done. Not only to the hobby but to our community here as well.
Finally, no member has ever been asked to no longer post here because they are overly passionate about the hobby.
We do occasionally, however, have to remind the passionate to be a bit more gentle.
Our main goal here is to perpetuate the hobby, to share our experiences, to learn, and to expand the community. Just keep all of the goals in mind when you post.
Then again, two points you must consider; "Tone" does not get communicated over the message board very well. Also, not everyone who uses these forums are native English speaking aquarists. The second point is that an offended visitor may leave and never return.
Just keep both of these things in mind. Your post may come across more harshly than you intended because your tone was lost. Even more so if the reader doesn't speak English well.
If a poster has a problem, comes here, is attacked and leaves look how much more damage is done. Not only to the hobby but to our community here as well.
Finally, no member has ever been asked to no longer post here because they are overly passionate about the hobby.
Our main goal here is to perpetuate the hobby, to share our experiences, to learn, and to expand the community. Just keep all of the goals in mind when you post.
sepulatian
Moderator
Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/2486857
And just where are all these people that are learning by example certainly not on these boards just take a look at the disease forum the oh you have to live and learn by your own mistakes is doing a hell of a lot of good on the fish population
I am one of those people. Beth was absolutely correct. When I came to these boards I had a world of ich in a tank. Lion_crazz and Beth were the two that helped me through everything. They were very patient with all of my questions, and let me tell you, I had a ton of them. I now spend every chance that I can giving back to this community that helped me so much. Beth, lion_crazz, myself, and many others spend a great deal of time answering the same questions over and over again. Chastising people gets you nowhere. Explaining the correct way of doing things, even repeatedly, is much more effective. They get it. You cannot just yell at a new hobbyist though. Some of the posts that started this thread were made by people that were looking to rectify their mistakes. They don't deserve to be yelled at, by any means. If they did not care then they would not be trying to fix the situation now. I have to be honest here, there is no greater thrill on this board than walking someone through a treatment, no matter what lip they gave you, and seeing pictures posted of a fish that you helped save. I absolutely LOVE that.
Originally Posted by all108
http:///forum/post/2486959
Joe, I agree, people on the board can be a little arrogant with their comments. QT isn't always necessary with fish, I think people should only post ADVICE, and constructive help, not criticisms. I joined this for help, and it sucks when people get rude or make a comment implying that I may be a 'irresponsible fish keeper.'
However I own a reef tank, so I see perks in setting up the QT to get faster treatment for my fish without hurting my anemone etc. I hope you don't keep having such bad luck!
Fish absolutely need to be quarantined, as well as rock, coral, and inverts. If you do not then we will eventually be seeing you back in this forum. Ich happens, and when it does it needs to be treated appropriately. We will be here.
http:///forum/post/2486857
And just where are all these people that are learning by example certainly not on these boards just take a look at the disease forum the oh you have to live and learn by your own mistakes is doing a hell of a lot of good on the fish population
I am one of those people. Beth was absolutely correct. When I came to these boards I had a world of ich in a tank. Lion_crazz and Beth were the two that helped me through everything. They were very patient with all of my questions, and let me tell you, I had a ton of them. I now spend every chance that I can giving back to this community that helped me so much. Beth, lion_crazz, myself, and many others spend a great deal of time answering the same questions over and over again. Chastising people gets you nowhere. Explaining the correct way of doing things, even repeatedly, is much more effective. They get it. You cannot just yell at a new hobbyist though. Some of the posts that started this thread were made by people that were looking to rectify their mistakes. They don't deserve to be yelled at, by any means. If they did not care then they would not be trying to fix the situation now. I have to be honest here, there is no greater thrill on this board than walking someone through a treatment, no matter what lip they gave you, and seeing pictures posted of a fish that you helped save. I absolutely LOVE that.
Originally Posted by all108
http:///forum/post/2486959
Joe, I agree, people on the board can be a little arrogant with their comments. QT isn't always necessary with fish, I think people should only post ADVICE, and constructive help, not criticisms. I joined this for help, and it sucks when people get rude or make a comment implying that I may be a 'irresponsible fish keeper.'
However I own a reef tank, so I see perks in setting up the QT to get faster treatment for my fish without hurting my anemone etc. I hope you don't keep having such bad luck!
Fish absolutely need to be quarantined, as well as rock, coral, and inverts. If you do not then we will eventually be seeing you back in this forum. Ich happens, and when it does it needs to be treated appropriately. We will be here.
Florida Joe, you have been a member of SWF for a few months, while I have been here since its inception. When I say I have seen change in this hobby in terms of people QTing, trust me I have. No, many starting out do not automatically take that route but come to do it as they understand the necessity.
Speaking of arguing for the sake of arguing, I feel like this topic is pretty much falling into that category. I'd much rather spend time trying to help someone than bash someone. Bashing is a negative reflection on you, and does noting to inspire hobbyist who don't QT.
Bottom line, SWF forums are here to advance this hobby and lend a welcoming helping relaxed atmosphere for fellow hobbyists to share experiences, get help, and resolve problems. Its not here for any one individual to "sound off" about there personal pet peeves. For that, you need to fork out the money and invest in your own blog where you can rant and rave to heart's content.
Speaking of arguing for the sake of arguing, I feel like this topic is pretty much falling into that category. I'd much rather spend time trying to help someone than bash someone. Bashing is a negative reflection on you, and does noting to inspire hobbyist who don't QT.
Bottom line, SWF forums are here to advance this hobby and lend a welcoming helping relaxed atmosphere for fellow hobbyists to share experiences, get help, and resolve problems. Its not here for any one individual to "sound off" about there personal pet peeves. For that, you need to fork out the money and invest in your own blog where you can rant and rave to heart's content.
florida joe
Well-Known Member
Rude chastise demean and as Beth said I rant and rave about my personal pet peeves so Beth let me then make amends for my heinous crimes against the good people on these boards with individual apologies. I went back and copied my responses to their posts that so hurt them
To sac10918 I am so very sorry for saying
“Sir Q i love being the bad guy has anyone heard of the life cycle of ick”
To Hillious I am sorry for saying
Im confused as to what you’re trying to do are you using the qt to cure the rock and you defiantly need a filter
To Andrew Michael forgive me for saying
Sorry Sir Q but I must here is a novel idea QUARINTINE BEFORE YOU INTRODUCE ANYTHNG INTO YOUR DT do you think anyone is getting the message Sir Q
To Fishermon sorry for hurting your feelings by saying
Please read beths thread on setting up a QT tank but right off the bat you need to cycle your QT no just add tank water you will need a filter a heater something like a piece of pvc to make the fish feel safe the 3 to 4 weeks is only if your fish shows not signs of any disease if it does keep it in hypo for 4 weeks after the signs are gone
I don’t know a lot of people with a 50g QT 10 is good 20 better but go with what you have just QT
Enough with the ick magnet S---t please tangs need large tanks to prosper it has nothing to do with ick once again if no ick is present in your tank or on your fish THERE IS NO ICK
I feel so much better now ok yes its better to QT in a 10G QT for 3 to 4 weeks if no signs of disease you can put him in your DT if something is present treat with hypo or copper then 4 weeks after signs are
Hunter770 sorry friend for saying
Ok not a good choice but the horse is out of the barn now so what other fish do you have in your tank if you can not bring him back then it is your obligation to give him the best chance at survival do all the research you can on line in the library be the person who turned a wrong choice into a success story im rooting for you
Hunter no disrespect intended but are you sure you got a Moorish idle and not a banner fish seems like a very expensive and hard to keep fish for some one with only 1 year experience did you talk about keeping him with your LFS
Hunter no one is ganging up on you but we are all brothers and sisters in this hobby and sometimes like so we tend to to push our point but in the long run we all try to help each other as best we can not only for the hobbyist but from the fish as well
JPC763 forgive me
The end result of QT and if necessary treatment is a happy fish rid of disease hence any size QT is better then none
Monk sorry friend for saying
Just a note on the notion that invert cant get ick, which is true, but they can carry it in its encystement stage reason to QT them also
Jman72 sorry again for saying
Bottom line my friend is you have Ick in you DT what you are seeing it the life cycle by all means set up a QT but address the issue of ick in your DT now
i will not bore you with anymore of my posts but beth please look them over and feel free to post my rantings and raving
Beth having reread your post I sincerely need to apologize if I was missinterpiting your last statements as being directed at me and not in general or was it for that would be rude
To sac10918 I am so very sorry for saying
“Sir Q i love being the bad guy has anyone heard of the life cycle of ick”
To Hillious I am sorry for saying
Im confused as to what you’re trying to do are you using the qt to cure the rock and you defiantly need a filter
To Andrew Michael forgive me for saying
Sorry Sir Q but I must here is a novel idea QUARINTINE BEFORE YOU INTRODUCE ANYTHNG INTO YOUR DT do you think anyone is getting the message Sir Q
To Fishermon sorry for hurting your feelings by saying
Please read beths thread on setting up a QT tank but right off the bat you need to cycle your QT no just add tank water you will need a filter a heater something like a piece of pvc to make the fish feel safe the 3 to 4 weeks is only if your fish shows not signs of any disease if it does keep it in hypo for 4 weeks after the signs are gone
I don’t know a lot of people with a 50g QT 10 is good 20 better but go with what you have just QT
Enough with the ick magnet S---t please tangs need large tanks to prosper it has nothing to do with ick once again if no ick is present in your tank or on your fish THERE IS NO ICK
I feel so much better now ok yes its better to QT in a 10G QT for 3 to 4 weeks if no signs of disease you can put him in your DT if something is present treat with hypo or copper then 4 weeks after signs are
Hunter770 sorry friend for saying
Ok not a good choice but the horse is out of the barn now so what other fish do you have in your tank if you can not bring him back then it is your obligation to give him the best chance at survival do all the research you can on line in the library be the person who turned a wrong choice into a success story im rooting for you
Hunter no disrespect intended but are you sure you got a Moorish idle and not a banner fish seems like a very expensive and hard to keep fish for some one with only 1 year experience did you talk about keeping him with your LFS
Hunter no one is ganging up on you but we are all brothers and sisters in this hobby and sometimes like so we tend to to push our point but in the long run we all try to help each other as best we can not only for the hobbyist but from the fish as well
JPC763 forgive me
The end result of QT and if necessary treatment is a happy fish rid of disease hence any size QT is better then none
Monk sorry friend for saying
Just a note on the notion that invert cant get ick, which is true, but they can carry it in its encystement stage reason to QT them also
Jman72 sorry again for saying
Bottom line my friend is you have Ick in you DT what you are seeing it the life cycle by all means set up a QT but address the issue of ick in your DT now
i will not bore you with anymore of my posts but beth please look them over and feel free to post my rantings and raving
Beth having reread your post I sincerely need to apologize if I was missinterpiting your last statements as being directed at me and not in general or was it for that would be rude
florida joe
Well-Known Member
Can I assume that no one that I offended so badly is accepting my apologue?
crimzy
Active Member
Joe, I have to say that it seems you have an exaggerated opinion of your role on SWF.com. You are just one of many who shares an opinion.
But, just so you know, your opinion is not absolutely, uncontestedly accurate... especially regarding FWLR. I don't QT and I haven't lost a fish to ich in my last 5 years of fish keeping. As CCampbell mentioned, there are detriments to QT, especially with large fish. Do you think that my 10" naso or 9" hippo would be better off living in a 50 gallon tank for 6 weeks with minimal mechanical or biological filtration and no LR? What about a 9" stingray? Do you think that a large moorish idol or pinnatus bat is likely to live for those 6 weeks?
People may get offended by your "holier than thou" attitude and that's your fault, not theirs. You are not really a fish saver... if you were then you'd abhor this hobby that corrupts these beautiful animals. God didn't bring fish to your living room, a guy with a big net did it for profit. please remember that.
Didn't really intend to flame you but you started this thread to justify rudeness for your love of the animal. I think you take yourself a bit too seriously. JMO
But, just so you know, your opinion is not absolutely, uncontestedly accurate... especially regarding FWLR. I don't QT and I haven't lost a fish to ich in my last 5 years of fish keeping. As CCampbell mentioned, there are detriments to QT, especially with large fish. Do you think that my 10" naso or 9" hippo would be better off living in a 50 gallon tank for 6 weeks with minimal mechanical or biological filtration and no LR? What about a 9" stingray? Do you think that a large moorish idol or pinnatus bat is likely to live for those 6 weeks?
People may get offended by your "holier than thou" attitude and that's your fault, not theirs. You are not really a fish saver... if you were then you'd abhor this hobby that corrupts these beautiful animals. God didn't bring fish to your living room, a guy with a big net did it for profit. please remember that.
Didn't really intend to flame you but you started this thread to justify rudeness for your love of the animal. I think you take yourself a bit too seriously. JMO
florida joe
Well-Known Member
Will you please clarify your comments point by point for me?
Exactly what is my exaggerated opinion of my role on SWF?
The fact that your no having not lost a fish in five years with out putting them in quarantine means what. It’s the better way to go?
What constitutes minimal filtration in a QT your biological filtration either is sufficient of not is that not so
YOUR QUOTE
“People may get offended by your "holier than thou" attitude and that's your fault, not theirs. You are not really a fish saver... if you were then you'd abhor this hobby that corrupts these beautiful animals. God didn't bring fish to your living room; a guy with a big net did it for profit. Please remember that”.
So you are saying that non of us really care about this hobby we just add to the corruption of it by filling the pockets of those importers and retailers And lastly since you know why I started this thread are not justifying someones actions serious
Exactly what is my exaggerated opinion of my role on SWF?
The fact that your no having not lost a fish in five years with out putting them in quarantine means what. It’s the better way to go?
What constitutes minimal filtration in a QT your biological filtration either is sufficient of not is that not so
YOUR QUOTE
“People may get offended by your "holier than thou" attitude and that's your fault, not theirs. You are not really a fish saver... if you were then you'd abhor this hobby that corrupts these beautiful animals. God didn't bring fish to your living room; a guy with a big net did it for profit. Please remember that”.
So you are saying that non of us really care about this hobby we just add to the corruption of it by filling the pockets of those importers and retailers And lastly since you know why I started this thread are not justifying someones actions serious
crimzy
Active Member
I'll answer your questions one at a time...
Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/2489325
Will you please clarify your comments point by point for me?
Exactly what is my exaggerated opinion of my role on SWF?
You appear to think that you must take it upon yourself to "save the fish". You also don't appear to recognize that there are different ways to keep a successful fish tank depending on the specifications of the tank and the inhabitants. People often come here for help... they are not here so you can preach about the virtue of your fish-saving opinions. Being rude to people does not save fish... it just reflects poorly on you.
Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/2489325
The fact that your no having not lost a fish in five years with out putting them in quarantine means what. It’s the better way to go?
For my specific tank, with my inhabitants and my ability to choose healthy specimens, yes it is a better way to go for me.
Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/2489325
What constitutes minimal filtration in a QT your biological filtration either is sufficient of no is that not so
I don't understand this question. Is this one or two sentences?
Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/2489325
YOUR QUOTE
“People may get offended by your "holier than thou" attitude and that's your fault, not theirs. You are not really a fish saver... if you were then you'd abhor this hobby that corrupts these beautiful animals. God didn't bring fish to your living room; a guy with a big net did it for profit. Please remember that”.
So you are saying that non of us really care about this hobby we just add to the corruption of it by filling the pockets of those importers and retailers
Yes that's pretty much what I am saying. Keeping these fish captive is not virtuous nor is it in the best interests of the fish. We do it for our own selfish reasons... we like the way they look and enjoy taking care of them. If you kept a siverback gorilla in your basement would you consider yourself a "gorilla-saver"? (this may be a poor example because actually the gorilla would have a better chance of surviving in your basement than fish do in most aquariums).
Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/2489325
Will you please clarify your comments point by point for me?
Exactly what is my exaggerated opinion of my role on SWF?
You appear to think that you must take it upon yourself to "save the fish". You also don't appear to recognize that there are different ways to keep a successful fish tank depending on the specifications of the tank and the inhabitants. People often come here for help... they are not here so you can preach about the virtue of your fish-saving opinions. Being rude to people does not save fish... it just reflects poorly on you.
Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/2489325
The fact that your no having not lost a fish in five years with out putting them in quarantine means what. It’s the better way to go?
For my specific tank, with my inhabitants and my ability to choose healthy specimens, yes it is a better way to go for me.
Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/2489325
What constitutes minimal filtration in a QT your biological filtration either is sufficient of no is that not so
I don't understand this question. Is this one or two sentences?
Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/2489325
YOUR QUOTE
“People may get offended by your "holier than thou" attitude and that's your fault, not theirs. You are not really a fish saver... if you were then you'd abhor this hobby that corrupts these beautiful animals. God didn't bring fish to your living room; a guy with a big net did it for profit. Please remember that”.
So you are saying that non of us really care about this hobby we just add to the corruption of it by filling the pockets of those importers and retailers
Yes that's pretty much what I am saying. Keeping these fish captive is not virtuous nor is it in the best interests of the fish. We do it for our own selfish reasons... we like the way they look and enjoy taking care of them. If you kept a siverback gorilla in your basement would you consider yourself a "gorilla-saver"? (this may be a poor example because actually the gorilla would have a better chance of surviving in your basement than fish do in most aquariums).
florida joe
Well-Known Member
crimzy;2489343 said:
florida joe
Well-Known Member
So please show me the instances of my being rude out weighing the selfishness, which you seem to think we all have you include in keeping an aquarium so its ok to keep these entities for our own selfish needs but its a crime punishable by death for saying something what is seen as being rude
crimzy
Active Member
Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/2489361
So please show me the instances of my being rude out weighing the selfishness, which you seem to think we all have you include in keeping an aquarium so its ok to keep these entities for our own selfish needs but its a crime punishable by death for saying something what is seen as being rude
Sorry but I don't understand this statement.
http:///forum/post/2489361
So please show me the instances of my being rude out weighing the selfishness, which you seem to think we all have you include in keeping an aquarium so its ok to keep these entities for our own selfish needs but its a crime punishable by death for saying something what is seen as being rude
Sorry but I don't understand this statement.
spanko
Active Member
I spent some time on the board when I first started reef keeping. Then for whatever reason I switched and spent most of my time on a local site and a site that mostly talks about nano tanks. That particular site got to the point that the "Old Timers" started to band together in calling people, newcomers mostly, that did less than educated things reeftards. I believe it was a mod that started the whole thing because he was upset with the coddling that some people were getting after making mistakes and took the situation to the other extreme. Then more and more people started to adopt this "beat them with a verbal stick" method of "helping".
I returned to this site. What was happening was not conducive to the things this site and others are really about. To advance this hobby and lend a welcoming helping relaxed atmosphere for fellow hobbyists to share experiences, get help, and resolve problems. (As Beth so eloquently put it)
In my opinion if you cannot say something to help, or you are tired of answering the same old question over and over, just don't say anything.
I don't know, just sayin............
I returned to this site. What was happening was not conducive to the things this site and others are really about. To advance this hobby and lend a welcoming helping relaxed atmosphere for fellow hobbyists to share experiences, get help, and resolve problems. (As Beth so eloquently put it)
In my opinion if you cannot say something to help, or you are tired of answering the same old question over and over, just don't say anything.
I don't know, just sayin............
dixonme
New Member
Relatively new to the hobby. Cycled a new tank with LR, shrimp, and snails for 8 mos before putting in first fishes (two clowns and a hypo) clowns did great hypo died. Everything was fine for almost a year then I added a long needled sea urchin and within two weeks lost everything! Didn't know anything about QT! Just ignorant, I guess, but no one at the fish store told me about it. The books I read didn't tell me about it, guess I just didn't read the right ones. Any way I have a 6 yr old autistic son who is very into marine life so I did it for him. As luck would have it I did leave the tank go at least four weeks over Thanksgiving and Christmas with just the cleaner shrimp, snails and urchin. Then I purchased fish from this website. The site was very good about exlaining acclimation, but it never mentioned QT as part of the process. It never said buy only one fish at a time. I bought a angel flame, two percula clowns, 4 chromis and a gramma along with a colt coral. Acclimated as advised to. Fish were fine for 4 weeks, then I went on vacation, left food MYSIS shrimp and Krill for my sister to give them, came back 3 chromis (the littler ones) and gramma no where to be found. Everything else looked healthy and were eating. Noticed the flame was a little pasty last night, couldn't find it this morning. When I did find it it was hiding in sand and the cleaner shrimp was on it. It has lost a lot of it's color and when I took it out of the tank and put into a bucket clear/white mucus came off it, ti's breathing is very labored and it can not keep itself upright. I have the two clown fish and chromis left. I will buy a QT tank today, now that I see from you postings how stupid it is to not have one and that each fish needs 3 weeks QT. I also learned from your "rude" postings that the hydrometer sold to me by the pet store isn't accurate enough. I have a marine testing kit and tested the water and it tested fine. So I guess I'll have to start over again, if it weren't for my son I would say forget it! So thanks for your rants, I have learned from it. Now the question is where did the ich (if it is ich there aren't any white spots on him) come from? Tank was fishless for 4+ weeks and fish coming from this site I would assume to be free of parasites, would it not? That's why I brought here rather than the pet store.
1journeyman
Active Member
Dixonme, please cut and paste that to a new thread. You'll get a lot more responses as it is really more off topic for this thread.
And, speaking of this thread, I think it's just about reached it's point of usefulness.
And, speaking of this thread, I think it's just about reached it's point of usefulness.
V
veeraj87
Guest
while all you guys are ranting.. your taking away from teh people that actually need help... your kinda wasting your time, people that want a QT will get one, its all over this forum, just help those that you want to with your time theres no point of this on going conversation
florida joe
Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by Veeraj87
http:///forum/post/2489481
while all you guys are ranting.. your taking away from teh people that actually need help... your kinda wasting your time, people that want a QT will get one, its all over this forum, just help those that you want to with your time theres no point of this on going conversation
And on that very wise note perhaps the good administrators should close out this thread
http:///forum/post/2489481
while all you guys are ranting.. your taking away from teh people that actually need help... your kinda wasting your time, people that want a QT will get one, its all over this forum, just help those that you want to with your time theres no point of this on going conversation
And on that very wise note perhaps the good administrators should close out this thread
chrgerondavins
Member
Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/2489657
And on that very wise note perhaps the good administrators should close out this thread
I will qt all my fish in a beta bowl before putting them in my 75 or 90 gallon
http:///forum/post/2489657
And on that very wise note perhaps the good administrators should close out this thread
I will qt all my fish in a beta bowl before putting them in my 75 or 90 gallon
1journeyman
Active Member
Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/2489657
And on that very wise note perhaps the good administrators should close out this thread
Done.
http:///forum/post/2489657
And on that very wise note perhaps the good administrators should close out this thread
Done.