PH question

[joshradio]

Originally Posted by Bang Guy
Lowering the PH fluctuation is probably a good thing. An balanced Alkalinity level will usually accomplish this. That's what you're doing when you add your Reef Builder, it raises Alkalinity. If Alkalinity is low then raising it is fine. If Alkalinity is high and you raise it more you can cause a disaster.
Ok, to put this to rest, the stuff I'm referring to is Seachem's Marine Buffer... the way it is made, you can not over dose it! it neutralizes what ever, high or low, to a safe 8.3. I got it when I was a newb, and it saved me... now 3 years later, it still saves... it's not masking anything, just monitors it is all! Sorry Bang, usually I'm right there with you, but we'll just have to agree to disagree on this'en!

and yes 8.4 is fine!
Psssst, Bang... Lower the fever, and your body fixes it's self.... correct the pH and the tank starts to "learn" on it's own and maintains safe levels :thinking:

 

[nine28girl]

Originally Posted by JoshRadio
So what all is in your tank... the entire inventory?
Tons of LR
1 Anenome
1 Green Carpet
1 Toad stool
Some Frog Spawn
Grass looking stuff
Mushrooms
Tons of feather dusters
Some other corals not sure what they are
1 Niger Trigger
1 Velvet Wrass
2 Cleaner wrasses
1 Yellow Tang
1 Purple Tang
1 Clown
1 Flame Angle
1 Damsel
1 snow flake eel
Bunch of hemits

 

[bang guy]

Originally Posted by JoshRadio
Psssst, Bang... Lower the fever, and your body fixes it's self.... correct the pH and the tank starts to "learn" on it's own and maintains safe levels :thinking:
That is just plain wrong, sorry.
I can't tell you how many people have destroyed nice reef tanks by overdosing Borate. The Borate masks the problem of inadequate Carbonate, without the carbonate corals can't grow, corals that can't grow die.
You're in a death spiral and you just don't know it yet. The marketers have you brainwashed. I can't help you but I can try to get other people not to take the same path.
Feel free to fix your Meningitis, Malaria, Strep Throat or Appendicitis with Tylenol, good luck with that.

 

[bang guy]

Originally Posted by kmc
Oh Boy! Another test kit. I'm starting to feel like that Beaker character from the Muppets,

What is considered a good reading fro Alkalinity?
In my opinion 2.5 - 3.5 Meq/L is good. I try to maintain above 3.0Meq/l but less than 3.5Meq/L. Alkalinity is one of the more important parameters to maintain for reef tanks.

 

[nine28girl]

Originally Posted by Bang Guy
For High PH (again, your PH is fine) the problem is almost always a deficiency of CO2. This can be from leaving lights on too long, adding limewater too fast, or a PH buffer overdose. High PH isn't a common problem.
Aerating the water usually solves the problem by adding CO2 back into the water. Skimmers are good at this as is good waterflow (20X turnover rate).
So I need to add a bubble maker? Here is a wierd thought- ph was 8.4 and I made a food cocktail - mixed a bunch of meaty foods etc and fed everything.. a few hours later I noticed the ph dropped to 8.3? Coincidence?

 

[bang guy]

Originally Posted by Nine28girl
Any thoughts on too much LR and bio balls - some where I heard you should remove them. Is this true?
What are your Nitrates at? Live rock can Denitrify but it works better if it is the main source of filtration. Bioballs are very efficiant at gas exchange and at processing ammonia but the end product is Nitrate.
If your Nitrates are climbing I'd suggest slowly removing your Bioballs so that the filtration takes place in the live rock. Go slow, don't shock you system. A handful of bioballs a day is a good pace, slower is better.

 

[bang guy]

Originally Posted by Nine28girl
So I need to add a bubble maker? Here is a wierd thought- ph was 8.4 and I made a food cocktail - mixed a bunch of meaty foods etc and fed everything.. a few hours later I noticed the ph dropped to 8.3? Coincidence?
No, like I said, your PH is just fine.
Your PH probably dropped after feeding because of decomposing organics. Not a coincidence. It's natural.

 

[nine28girl]

Originally Posted by Bang Guy
No, like I said, your PH is just fine.
Your PH probably dropped after feeding because of decomposing organics. Not a coincidence. It's natural.
Ok, but isn't 8.3 more desirable? What's to say if I stop with the ph down and stop fighting it next it will go to 8.5 which is bad? If I bubble thing can help shouldn't I try that?

 

[bang guy]

Originally Posted by Nine28girl
Ok, but isn't 8.3 more desirable? What's to say if I stop with the ph down and stop fighting it next it will go to 8.5 which is bad? If I bubble thing can help shouldn't I try that?
8.3 isn't really more desireable. 8.5 isn't bad either, it's just a bit high. 8.6 can start Calcium carbonate precipitation if Calcium or Alkalinity are high but it's fairly uncommon unless you dose limewater.
You have a skimmer, that's all you need. I highly doubt you will see your PH exceed 8.5 unless you overdose a chemical.
In other words, don't worry, you have no problems.

 

[nine28girl]

Ok, its got to the point now where if I have the lights on during the day my ph goes to 8.6 - I don't know what the problem is..??
Nitrate 0
Nitrites 0
Ammonia .25
I tried the bubbler but it doesn't seem to work, I think I need some kind of co2 reactor??
Any ideas?

 

[aztec reef]

Originally Posted by Bang Guy
PH is an indicator of whats going on in your aquarium similar to a fever thermometer telling you how your body is doing. Using PH down to "fix" the PH is exactly like using a ice cube on a thermometer to "fix" a fever.

sorry! i didn't mean to hijack, but it's funny cause that's how i always looked at it.

keep going.....

 

[bang guy]

Originally Posted by Bang Guy
In other words, don't worry, you have no problems.

 

[nine28girl]

So it's ok? 8.6??

 

[bang guy]

As long as your skimmer is operating properly, you have plenty of waterflow, and you haven't overdosed Carbonate then 8.6 is fine.
The only time High PH is a problem is when something like limewater has been overdosed or you're attempting to maintain very high levels of Calcium and Carbonate in the system.
It's just fine for the average reef tank.

 

[marine]

one question....limewater....i've heard of that reference. I just thought it was a joke. What is the significance of limewater?

 

[bang guy]

Limewater AKA Kalkwasser, is lime (Calcium hydroxide or Calcium oxide) dissolved in water.
When slowly added to saltwater the Hydroxide reacts with CO2 and creates Carbonate or Bicarbonate (Alkalinity). The Calcium is also added in the form Ca++. It adds Carbonate and Calcium in the exact ratio that it is used up by corals.

 

[nine28girl]

Originally Posted by Bang Guy
Limewater AKA Kalkwasser, is lime (Calcium hydroxide or Calcium oxide) dissolved in water.
When slowly added to saltwater the Hydroxide reacts with CO2 and creates Carbonate or Bicarbonate (Alkalinity). The Calcium is also added in the form Ca++. It adds Carbonate and Calcium in the exact ratio that it is used up by corals.
Thanks Bang guy, I just bought this stuff Kalkwasser BUT I HAVEN'T added yet- I am assuming at this point don't do it??

 

[kronnk7]

Hi Bang, I love when people get so worried about the little stuff and start listening to the lfs chemical adders.

My 90 gal has been setup for over a year :joy: and I just started adding coral accel. to help jump start some of my frag projects. I really don't like to dose my tank but I thought long and hard about it and coral accel. (if added correctly) won't do much damage. Soooo, Bang are you ready to sell me one of those beautiful baby clowns yet?

 

[bang guy]

Not until you need to.
This means you need to start testing Calcium and Alkalinity :happyfish
Until you get a good coral load in your system water changes may be all you need to maintain Calcium and Alkalinity.

 

[nine28girl]

Originally Posted by kronnk7
Hi Bang, I love when people get so worried about the little stuff and start listening to the lfs chemical adders.

My 90 gal has been setup for over a year :joy: and I just started adding coral accel. to help jump start some of my frag projects. I really don't like to dose my tank but I thought long and hard about it and coral accel. (if added correctly) won't do much damage. Soooo, Bang are you ready to sell me one of those beautiful baby clowns yet?

kronnk7 - I do not blindly listen to my LFS, I haven't been there for anything more than food prior to this kalkwasser in almost a year. I listen to a friend that use to work for my LFS and that personal has 260 and a 180 that are beautiful. I just haven't seen him in a while and I am concern about PH. It's not a bad thing to be a concious and concerned hobbyist- I am responsible that's all.