pls help: need frozen food with edible chunks... not cloud of pollution

scrapman

Member
My twelve year-old 90 gal fish are rather large and happy.... I bought some "Ocean Nutrition" Formula Two..... It just create a nuage of pollutant when unfrozen and piped in. Very disappointing.... garbage.
I need some frozen cubes which will actually provide nutrition in the form of chunks of food that the fish can aim to and grab (gobble).
Any advice?
Thanks
 

scrapman

Member
Thanks Bang Guy,
I've read about making your own food. Let's say I don't have time or patience to follow the guidelines.
bWhat do you recommend that I buy (whatever the cost) which will give my fish visible chunks of food instead of a cloud of invisible pollution like I described in my original post.
Thanks
 

xcali1985

Active Member
Hakari makes some awesome products and they make them in various sizes for your needs. Plus they have a low water package content.
 
S

saxman

Guest
The best bet is to rinse any thawed frozen food in a small net prior to feeding it out, regardless of what it is. This will improve your results remarkably.
 

geridoc

Well-Known Member
Ocean Nutrition now makes a line called RDF (or RFD, my dyslexia is kicking in) of both Formula 1 and 2. They produce larger pieces, so the cloud isn't so bad. It still isn't the size that a good sized angel or tang wants. I feed my tangs Hikari Mega-Algae because it does thaw into larger pieces.
 

bang guy

Moderator
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xcali1985 http:///t/393801/pls-help-need-frozen-food-with-edible-chunks-not-cloud-of-pollution#post_3504521
Rinsing your food has little to no effect, studies have shown. In fact if you have corals it eliminates particles that corals will grab out the air.
It depends on if the food is in a preservative (Sodium nitrate). The better brands do not do this but it's easy to test for. I agree with the coral food and I would recommend someone switch brand names (or better - make their own) vs rinsing out the Sodium nitrate.
 

xcali1985

Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gradymo http:///t/393801/pls-help-need-frozen-food-with-edible-chunks-not-cloud-of-pollution#post_3504619
Can you post a video? This, I gotta see!!

Don't know what you gotta see but if you have corals, especially zoas and palys then you would know that they are filter feeders and will grab food out the water column. Xenia is the same. There are tons of videos of corals feeding online use google. If your as childish to think I meant actual air then maybe you shouldn't comment at all.
 
S

saxman

Guest
Rinsing your food has little to no effect, studies have shown. In fact if you have corals it eliminates particles that corals will grab out the air.
I'd like to see "the studies", can you point me to them?
Beyond that, I can tell you that I've had peeps change to rinsing their frozen food, and guess what? It got rid of their cyano problem, so regardless of "the studies", it obviously works in some cases. I don't see how you can say rinsing makes no difference...it's the same as adding liquified food to the tank, do you honestly think that won't foul it? That's aquarium 101 dood.
If you check Coral magazine October/November 2006, vol. 3 #5, there's an article and the results of some studies run for both phosphate content and bacterial load. The bacteria was never on the solid block, but was always in the liquid. It was proven that the germ load in frozen food is concentrated in the melt water. Several labs were used to confirm the results by the Gottingen Veterinary Institute.
Based on the findings, the authors strongly suggest that folks rinse frozen food thoroughly in tapwater.
 

acrylic51

Active Member
I have to agree with Xcali1985.....I think it was Flower or Meowzer that started a thread about that very thing or maybe I did, and it was over on RC where it was discussed extensively and I think it might have been Randy who offered the validation of no real value on the grand scheme of things......
 

acrylic51

Active Member
Saxman I stand corrected I was the one that started the thread or topic on phosphates and frozen food......
 

cranberry

Active Member
Rinse it to get rid of bacteria, if nothing else.
IMO, the potential effect of phosphate really depends on how much you are feeding and water volume. Our seahorses, for example, ate 3 or more cubes of mysis in an 18g tank. The best thing we ever did was to start rinsing our frozen food. That alone took care of our nuisance algae issue.
If you want to feed your corals, buy high quality food items intended for such a purpose. Why use subpar drippage from another food item.
It's not only about the juice, but those little tiny pieces that are useless to some fish that get stuck everywhere. I use different sized nets to rinse depending on the size fish I'm feeding. Like, for the seahorses we used the larger mesh nets to filter out the smaller bits. We use a blue fine net for my Orange Spotted Filefish and Red Saddled Anthias. They like the smaller bits too.
Come at a phosphate reduction plan from all directions. Each source may seem small on it's own, but together with multiple other sources, they can pose a problem.
But I think we've kind of moved away from Scrapeman's question.
Scrapeman, what kind of fish are you feeding?
If my grammar sucks, please forgive me. I'm trying to wind down after a 13 hour night shift and a 2 hour after work tow truck session.
 

reefkprz

Active Member
I have always fed the "juice" to my tanks and always will especially when they are full or near full of corals. all those littel meaty bits are great foods for the filter feeders, benthic organisms and microfauna of the tank as well as being (dependant on the size of the particle) appropriatly sized for various filter feeding corals, due to the varied size of the particles in the "Juice" some of the particles are good for some and smaller or lager for others.
If your tank is not heavy in corals or other filter feeders or "newer" (imo newer means less than a full year established) your tank may not have enough filter feeders to benifit from the juices and in newer tanks there may not be appropriate amounts of benthic life and microfauna, or if you go from never feeding any plantonic food to adding the "juice" you can indeed be short of the needed life forms to benefit from the juice and can experience algal problems from the lack of utilization of the food stuffs until appropriate sized populations form the wasted uneaten food could lead to higher pollution levels in the water from decomposition as well as the other byproducts of organic decomposition.
The slow and skinny of what I am saying is that IMO the juice is benificial BUT like any food you can put more in than can be used or its just pollution. so if you dont want to strain your frozen food I would start by partially draining them in the begginning adn over the next several months reducing the amount you drain off from the frozen foods so you are slowly increasing the amount so the benthic organisms and micro fauna can populate to appropriate levels. this will in fact over all increase the natural appearance of your liverock from more "hitchiker" sponges developing and spreading through the tankas well as tube style worms micro dusters etc. It will increase microfauna populations, copepods, and amphipods that scavenge the meaty bits, whome many fish love to hunt and eat. as well as other scavenger life forms like spaghetti worms and many more life forms that will grow more profuse and make the tank mor natural.
I don't know how many established tanks I have seen that the rock while encrusted with coraline has few visible signs of diverse life or other microfaunas because in my opinion the rock form the get go was underfed and many of the life forms that might have become prevalent in fact perished reducing the overall biodiversity and health (if you will) of the rock or rather reducing the quality of the rock.
pollution levels of ANY food BAD, availibility of ANY food in the right quantities or slightly over consumable levels GOOD it promotes biodiversity and population of you tank in more natural manner. (my disclaimer) I feed 5-7 times a day on a fully established reef with a medium/light fish load and maximum coral population, when starting new tanks I feed less and slowly build up to the high feeding levels to ensure bacterial growth and micro macro fauna populations are sufficient to handle the influx of foods. in the wild coral reefs are formed where nutrient rich water enables the growth of planktons to feed the food chain from plankton size and up. nutrient rich does not mean polluted. but more an availibility of foods in consumable or just over consumable levels to encourage growth.
if you just pound lot of food to your tank right off the bad or more food than your tank can handle of course you'll experience algal problems, you need the demand to be almost as high as the supply. if the supply far exceeds the demand dominant nuiscance forms will over take the slower developing populations of the critters we love. but if you at all time make sure just a little more than is "needed" goes in you can expand your diversity (or rather preserve) the diversity of your rock and critters.I have seen sponges of dozens of different colors devolop from/on rock that came to me second hand from a dead looking tank. I have seen tanks started with almost no live rock and mostly dead rock with abundant life visible on the rocks and in the sand in well fed tanks. well fed not polluted. I cant stress that enough there is no such thing as a non toxic material. ANYTHING in too great of quantity can be detrimental. and too little is also detrimental.
In MY opinion. starvation is the number 1 killer of diversity in a marine tank. followed closely by water quality issues (that covers a plethora of water issues salinity swings, ammonia levels while curing live rock, buffering problems etc etc etc.) most of the microfauna is more durable than we think. it can survive being shipped ina damp box over the course of a day experiencing temperature swings and partial drying to rebound in our tanks with sponges and worms and copepods and tons of other stuff. now imagine how much more divers your rock would be if we didnt starve it for food types when we first get it....
sorry I got torn on a rant there I could really discuss this all day long, and no evidence I have ever seen no matter what survey, report or documented experimant shows with out a doubt that food is bad. everything I have ever seen or read is about levels, amounts... if you are having algae problems from feeding the juice, your tank is either 1 of three things, not establised enough or lacks the biodiversity to handle the food, or isnt large enough in volume for the amount of food provided.. this is not the food fault. its the amount of food your supplying. start with little and increase and I gaurantee if done slowly you wont get excess nuisance algae or cyano from "the juice". if you do get the algae your exceeding the amount to much. obviously a small system cant handle as much for lack of growth space for bacteria and fauna so common sense is needed here.
 
Top