Po4- control in new tank?

[Shilpan]

I am currently setting up my new 400L reef tank with sump. Just designing the rockwork. Yes I have a skimmer. Will have live rock and a DSB in the sump.

I have been through hell and back reading about PO4- control mechanisms. NOPOX, vodka dosing, algae scrubbers, refugium with macro algae...
What on earth should I do?

I thought if I maintain a one inch sand bed. Siphon it biweekly. Only feed my marine fish sparingly every second day (had FW fish for years and finally learnt not to overfeed). And initially for the first 6 months I'm planning on only 4 fish total (2 clowns, Bengali Cardinal and a fire fish). I'll get soft corals after that.

I thought with that I wouldnt need any extra phosphate or nitrate removal tools except LR, siphoning and DSB in refugium. But it seems to me that everyone in the forums uses GFO or macro algae or something?? What am I not understanding correctly here? I'm trying to save money you see and not buy $100's worth of reactors and stuff.

 

[lmforbis]

I use GFO and macro algae. When I started I did have an algae issue and high phosphate and nitrates. The GFO eliminated the measurable phosphate. I'm sure the fuge helps. My chaeto is growing so there has to be something in the tank helping that along. I have had constant nitrate problems that so far only large water changes have helped. I did start using bio pellets a couple weeks ago, time will tell if that helps nitrates or not.

 

[geridoc]

IMHO algae scrubbing, whether via chaeto or a dedicated algae scrubber, is the best way to control not only phosphates and nitrates, but all kinds of contaminants in the water.

 

[bang guy]

Can't go wrong with an algae scrubber.

 

[Shilpan]

Awesome! I was already half convinced on the algae scrubber but you guys have convinced me. Now I just need to make sure I have to right size for a 105 gallon tank. Heard they don't work if too small.

Cheers guys

 

[Shilpan]

Any advice on Santa Monica ATS? Or a DIY ATS?

It seems like the DIY ones have to be a certain size, whereas Santa Monica sell based off of feeding amounts. 1 cube a day size = $150.

 

[2quills]

I spent a good deal of time and money designing my ATS and it worked great. After a while I got tired of cleaning the screen every other week. So now I have a big fat ball of chaeto in my sump that does just as well and is much easier to maintain and less messy.

But if you have your heart set on a scrubber it really comes down to how much space you have to implement one. If it isn't easy to get to clean I'd say just run algae in your sump.

Otherwise, Santa Monica has done a lot of research in this area and his size recommendations seem to be pretty spot on. Size them in relation to how much you plan to feed.

 

[Shilpan]

Ok the macro algae also sounds good.

Issue is I can't get chaeto here in NZ. Only caulerpa. And I've heard it has issues with going sexual etc and also it needs 24hr lighting.
But I'll ask my LFS if they'll give me some

If I'm willing to clean the algae scrubber every second week is it better? Or just equal?

 

[bang guy]

To prevent Caulerpa sporulation remove a percentage of the old growth every week. The percentage depends on the growth rate. It does not require 24 hour lighting. I would suggest reverse photo period lighting where the refugium lighting comes on when the display shuts off and goes off when the display comes on. This saves energy bills as well as help stabilize PH.

 

[Shilpan]

Ahh yes!

And how about size? I hear people say you need a very large sump compared to display tank size to achieve nitrate and phosphate reduction?

 

[bang guy]

Every system is different. Many people can't even keep a small bunch of algae because there's not enough nutrients to support the macro algae.

I had a 900 gallon refugium for my 155 gallon tank. Completely excessive but I loved it.

 

[2quills]

Ok the macro algae also sounds good.

Issue is I can't get chaeto here in NZ. Only caulerpa. And I've heard it has issues with going sexual etc and also it needs 24hr lighting.
But I'll ask my LFS if they'll give me some

If I'm willing to clean the algae scrubber every second week is it better? Or just equal?

Well, for me it works better. Mostly because of my own laziness.

But if you plan to maintain a ATS religiously then I think they have the potential to be more effective. Especially if space is an issue as long as you can get the good green turf algae to grow. Not every one has room for a decent sized refugium.

I like chaeto mostly for its lower maintenance qualities. I tear a rather large fist full off of it every couple of weeks or so and it grows right back. However, it isn't as aggressive a grower as certain species of caulerpa or hair algae. So you need to grow a pretty big ball of it for it to keep up with a heavy bio load.

Not sure about your import restrictions. But I believe Amazon ships to NZ and there are vendors selling chaeto on there.

 

[Shilpan]

Thanks for the suggestion yeah Amazon won't ship to my location due to import restrictions. Our country has crazy bio security.

A lot of people in NZ use reactors and things but I feel like it's much more expensive. And combined with light feeding and stocking, I think macro or a scrubber should be sufficient.

Will set up and cycle my tank as suggested in the other post. Wait till it's stable with first two clowns. And then try macro first since all I need to add is a light. And if that doesn't work THEN I'll fork out the extra money for a algae turf scrubber. Thank you very much guys I'm completely against buying GFO and stuff because I think it works out much more expensive.

You guys have been absolutely awesome I really really appreciate all your help and expertise