Politics: Any comments?

J

jaytreason

Guest
better dead than red!
(and by red I mean republican)
j/k

Not to get into any debates here but personally I'm extreamely liberal on just about everything and politically I'm a pretty liberal far left socialist.
Pro Choice, Pro gay rights/marriage, pro secular government, and anti organised religion etc...
 
steelrain

steelrain

Member

Originally posted by knots
Democrats vs. Republicans
Liberal vs. Conservative vs. Moderates
Anybody have any comments on any side?
How about:
Abortion?
Gay rights?
Marriage?
Religion and Government in the same sentence?
Or anything else.
Just curious what people think.
I would call myself republican, although I'm middle of the road on most issues.
ABORTION : I'm for abortion for medical reasons, say the mother would be in danger of serious harm if the pregnacy went to term. Another instance would be criminal acts like ----. But on the other side of the fence, if abortion was illegal, just think of the harm that would come to so many children that were raised by unfit parents that now would have gotten an abortion.
GAY RIGHTS: Sure, I really have no arguement one way of the other, it has absolutely no impact on my life.
MARRIAGE : Same as above.
Religion and Government in the same sentence: I believe religion should remain separate from government.
Just for the record I am atheist, but not a fanatical atheist, I could care less if "in god we trust" remains on currency or "under god" remains in the pledge of allegiance. I believe in " to each his own" If practicing religion is what ne needs to do in order to be happy in life then so be it, But let me remind everyone that the NUMBER 1 reason for war throughout history has been religion...
enough for now
Later,
Tim
 
reefraff

reefraff

Active Member
I finally figured out what I am, an Anti-Establishment Conservative. Too laid back to be a Republican, Too traditional to be a Libertarian, Too smart to be a Democrat (sorry, couldn't resist)
I would legalize drugs. The illegal drug trade causes more harm to innocent people than the drugs ever will.
I would like to see a constitutional amendment created to make abortion legal so the supreme court can finally overturn it's flawed roe v Wade decision. The right to privacy doesn't allow me to smoke a joint in my own house or ask a doctor to help me end my life and it doesn't give a woman the right to abort a child. Abortions are going to happen and outlawing them solves nothing. All of the fuss over Bushes judicial appointees boils down to abortion. Once that is out of the court's hands we can get down to appointing people based on their ability to enforce the laws allowed under our constitution and it's amendments rather than which way they might vote if roe is revisited.
I don't believe in Gay/minority rights. I don't believe in Gay/minority wrongs either. Hate crime laws are a joke. It is illegal to beat someone with a bat. I don't think we should hand out different penalties based on the motive for the beating.
Marriage can be a good thing or bad. I am against Gay marriage but have no problem with civil unions. Being Gay is not a normal behavior. That doesn;t make it bad or wrong but we should keep the distinction between normal, or maybe a better word is typical and non typical lifestyles.
There is nothing wrong with having religous people in politics, placing a cross or manger scene on government property as long as other religions are permitted equal access. As long as the government doesn't say "you must or cannot teach this in your church" it in no way violates the first amendment. There is absolutly nothing in the constitution or any amendment seperating church from state other than "Congress shall make no law creating religion or prohibiting the free exercise of religion" rough translation.
 
lionkiller

lionkiller

Member
I would legalize drugs. The illegal drug trade causes more harm to innocent people than the drugs ever will
I disagree. Not all drugs should be legalized. Heroin for sure should stay illegal. People using this drug can't even function while high and even when not. Same for crack.
Steroids also should stay illegal. In the sporting world it would become abused and children would be more likely to start using this drug very early in hopes of the almighty sports scholarship. Hell I could see some parents even supply their kids.
Marijuana, sure. I see really no problem with this being legal. With one exception. You know damn well the GOVT. would place a limit on THC in blood while operating a vehicle. I could go to a bar or party and never smoke the stuff. Yet, because a good majority of people are smoking I could have my Bood THC level cross the line for "safely" driving a vehicle and go to jail for it. Very possible. I have received contact highs (when I was younger) before, so this is a high possibilty.
 
reefraff

reefraff

Active Member
I should have been more clear on the drugs. Pot, Coke, Hash. That type of thing. Meth is garbage but maybe we should legalize it too. Anyone stupid enough to use that crap doesn't need to be contaminating the gene pool. None of it is really healthy but I see no difference between being drunk and being loaded on pot which I tried a couple times and didn't like. I know peole who have done coke and hash and they same it is pretty much the same situation with them, not really worse than being drunk, just different. Acid is also very bad news because 1 time is all it takes to blow your mind if your body doesn't react well to the drug.
My idea would be to have the government sell the stuff much like some states control the liquor business. Have severe laws against production or dealing (except for maybe growing pot for personal use). Add a tax to the cost of production to keep the price at current rates. That would mean the government would have about a 95% tax on the drugs. That money would be equally divided for education and rehabilitation. I would also have strict laws about being under the influence. DUI or commiting a crime while intoxicated on any substance would be a fine for first offence (anyone can make a dumb mistake) but for second offence in a given time period, like maybe 2 years would result in some kind of mandatory rehab and detox. Someone with a drug problem doesn't belong in jail, they need help and with the government making the profit from the drug trade there would be money to do it,
 
moray345

moray345

Active Member

Originally posted by lefty
- Against
- Against
- Man and woman
- Not a problem unless people are being forced to take part in a particular religion and/or its customs (last time I checked, forced prayer in school was stopped a few decades back)
*puts on flame suit*
:D
same as knots being a Christian I also have strong opinions but thats just my opinion
 
A

andretti

Guest
Oh yeah, this is the juicy stuff. Here we go. I'm a conservative democrat :notsure: and a teacher, so I have to be conservative, yet liberal at the same time. I belive marijuana should be legal I'm not pro drugs, I just believe that if alcohol, cigarettes, and coffee (caffeine is a mild cocaine) are legal, then why not marijuana? Look at how many problems alcohol causes our society. And when was the last time you saw someone "stoned" who wanted to fight or or do something stupid? When your stoned, you're too stupid to do anything, so mostly one just sits around being stoned. Granted, it's not a very productive day when one gets loaded, but again, I'm comparing it to booze and cigarettes. Why legalize two or three things and not the other? Medical marijuana is legal. Ever heard of "medical beer" or "medical cigarettes?" If the govt. regulated pot and put a tax on it, we'd be out of our debt in two days! Granted, they would find someway to screw it up and tax the hell out of it, but ??? Enough about that...I'm pro abortion, but I'm also pro life. It depends on the circumstance. :notsure: I believe in gay marriage and gay adoption and gay rights. No I'm not gay, I've been married for 13 years (to a woman, I think?) and have three wonderful kids. Trust me, if you've seen some of the so called "parents" as I have, you'd feel the same way too. Just as long as two people give a child love and nurture him/her, who cares if it's two women/men. Yes the child is going to be teased, but what child does not get teased in today's wonderful society? I would rather be teased then only have a mom or a dad. People (even myself) before I became a teacher, thought that homosexuals made a choice to go that route. Well, I teach jr. high and I can already tell the boys that will (probabaly) be gay and the same with the girls; it's not a choice, they are born that way. There are a lot more things in this world to worry about than someone's sexuality. I personally don't understand how a man cannot be attracted to a woman. They are such beautiful creatures, all soft and curvey :jumping: But I've learned that just because I don't understand it, doesn't make it wrong. I don't understand my wife of 13 years, but does that make her wrong? :notsure: I also believe in gun control. It has gotten way out of hand! :mad:
I believe in the death penality. Actually, I believe the killer(s) should be given to the victim's family and let the family torture The -%$&*$-#&*! when ever they feel sad or they miss their loved one. You know, like chaining him/her up and giving them paper cuts all day, or root canals W/ no anestetic (sp?) All right, there's my two & a half cents. I hope I opened someone's eyes and/or made them think differently.
 
lefty

lefty

Active Member
*still has flame suit on* :D
In regards to homosexuals...my view on that is that they aren't born that way. It is not the result of a gene (if homosexuality was a gene, it would've died out because gay people can't reproduce). I believe it CAN be a result of their environment, but more so than that, I believe it is in their mind. How it got there, I don't know. Ultimately I would say it is the result of a sinful world. One must remember that temptations aren't sins...but depending on how you respond to them, they could become one. In many cases, I don't think people choose to become attracted to their own gender. As with murderers, I don't think these people choose to become fascinated by the thought of taking the life of another human being. But the temptations may be there and it is their duty as a person to resist those temptations. Why do you think society is so awful today? Scantily clad women gracing the covers of every magazine and the word "---" used in almost every headline. Why is that? Because the media has given into the temptations of people. The media has their own motive for that, and it's obviously money. The people desire to be exposed to that kind of thing. The desire in itself is not the problem, but the fact that they act upon that desire IS a problem. Obviously, I am a Christian, and many times throughout the Bible does it mention that homosexuality is a sin. I honestly believe that even if I wasn't a Christian, I would still believe that homosexuality is not to be accepted as normal. It can be helped. People just choose to give in to their temptations.
I hope that made sense. Just voicing my opinion here. :)
-lefty
 
broncofish

broncofish

Active Member
Originally Posted by lefty
*still has flame suit on* :D
(if homosexuality was a gene, it would've died out because gay people can't reproduce).
Not true, it could be a recessive trait, a genetic mutation made probably by the combination of other factors etc...One question...well actually two. If you think that homosexuality is caused by a sinful world...how do you explain it's presence in animlas, monkeys sheep(especially big horn sheep) and many many other breeds? and second question, if it was beyond a reasonable doubt proven that homosexuality was indeed not a choice but a genetic factor...than would you abandon all of your christian beliefs, or just choose to ignore that part of christianity that views it as a sin, or just deny all the evidence and go on believing as you do? Just wondering...not intending to flame
 
lefty

lefty

Active Member
I still do not believe it is a gene, recessive or mutated. I should've made myself clearer about the "dying out" factor. Theoretically, if it WERE a gene, we would see a gradual decline in its presence. We do not see that. Also, many studies have been done with twins, where one of them was homosexual and the other wasn't. If it were a genetic trait, they would both be that way.
Concerning the "homosexual" behavior in animals...I believe this to be a common misconception. For example, some animals will seem to engage in homosexual acts when it is actually just a way for them to express dominance. Their motivations for doing so are not a well thought out attraction to the same gender as with homosexual humans.
If scientists somehow came up with a reason to explain homosexuality as a result of a gene, I would not abandon my Christian beliefs nor refuse to ignore that part of it. It is in the Bible, so it is so and will always be so. Scientists also claim that the earth is some 15 billion years old. That is not fact to me and nor will it ever be. I will take God's wisdom above man's supposed acquired knowledge anyday because, while humans can make mistakes, God is perfect. =)
I hope that answers your questions!
-lefty
 
broncofish

broncofish

Active Member
Originally Posted by lefty
I still do not believe it is a gene, recessive or mutated. I should've made myself clearer about the "dying out" factor. Theoretically, if it WERE a gene, we would see a gradual decline in its presence. We do not see that. Also, many studies have been done with twins, where one of them was homosexual and the other wasn't. If it were a genetic trait, they would both be that way.
Concerning the "homosexual" behavior in animals...I believe this to be a common misconception. For example, some animals will seem to engage in homosexual acts when it is actually just a way for them to express dominance. Their motivations for doing so are not a well thought out attraction to the same gender as with homosexual humans.
If scientists somehow came up with a reason to explain homosexuality as a result of a gene, I would not abandon my Christian beliefs nor refuse to ignore that part of it. It is in the Bible, so it is so and will always be so. Scientists also claim that the earth is some 15 billion years old. That is not fact to me and nor will it ever be. I will take God's wisdom above man's supposed acquired knowledge anyday because, while humans can make mistakes, God is perfect. =)
I hope that answers your questions!
-lefty
OK I just have to correct a couple points, there is no reason why the gene would die out, especially if it is recessive, nor if it were several gene markers needig to be present (I'm not saying i believe there is "one Gene"anyway)
When you say many studies it is interesting, because the most solid study ever done(I can't link to it or else i would, but it is on webMD) was done using twins, and genetic markers on many different genes, and it shows a rather interesting resuly quite contrary to what you believe. It also being done "double blind" and the second part of the study is underway right now
The wildlife thing, there are several that engage in straight out homosexual activity, all of their sexual activity is related to dominance so dismiss the homosexual part just does not wash with me. I know there are some well anti gay groups that try to dismiss it, but naturalist and biological scientists who have zero stake in the choice not choice argument have came out and said yup, there are homosexuals in other animals besides humans. There is even a pair of mated gay penguins at a new york zoo that have raised a chic...interesting
As far as answering my question yes it does.....now before you or anybody goes flaming me, let me state what I believe.
I believe that there is a genetic reason for it, now do I think that it is the only reason for it....nope. I think the genetics have to be there, and probably something enviromental sets it off as well. I'm just not sure. If science proves me wrong I'll accept it. If it is ever shown to me that it is a choice, I'll believe it, but as it leans right now, the studies have shown it to be geneticly linked, until I see a scientific study to suggest otherwise I see no reason to believe otherwise.
 
knots

knots

Member
There is absolutely no proof that homosexuality is genetic. The gay lifestyle leaders know it is not genetic but they want to convince people that it is so they can further their own agenda. And if they can convince the gay population that it is genetic then the gay population doesn't have to take responsibility for their own actions. I believe in some people it is an illness like any other mental illness and it can be corrected but the person has to want to be helped. Many people have been freed from the bondage of this lifestyle and they don't take medicine for life to keep the "gene" from acting up again. In the majority of people they have chosen this lifestyle for a variety of reasons such as poor relationships with parents (usually the Father), rejected by the opposite ---, abused by the opposite ---, just want to try something different or many other reasons.
And even if it is a gene that causes homosexuality it is still wrong and is unacceptible in God's eyes. It is a sin that has to be dealt with like any other sin and if they would turn to God he will help them.
If someone chooses to be gay that is between them and God. But don't ask me to agree with them or give them special rights. And don't ask me to put God's word aside and let them do what they want such as teaching our public school kids that their lifestyle is normal or allowing them to get married. This lifestyle is a sin and like any other sin will tear down a society if it is ignored or justified.
Just remember scientists can think and say whatever they want to fit a groups agenda so we really need to look at all sides and take what they say with great caution. Look what scientists have said and some still say about evolution even though they have proved that wrong. But it is still taught in schools. But that's another subject.
 
reefraff

reefraff

Active Member
I have seen many try to explain homosexuality through the actions of animals. There are species of animals that do mate for life yet there has never been a single example of a homosexual bond demonstrated in them in any credible study. Besides, it is a bogus argument. Animals will engage in instinctive behavior that will demonstrate everything from dominance to adolecent confusion.
I think abnormal sexual behavior is learned. I don't think there is a child molestor gene, an S & M gene or a beastiality gene. Do you think the early Mormans learned polygamy through a gene or through necessity? (most of the men were killed off leaving a high population on women)
I think we have certain freedoms which extend to sexual behavior to a point but i for one am against removing the destinction between normal and abnormal behavior. I think if a gay couple wish to enter into an agreement granting each other next of kin rights that is fine but not marriage.
I think I made my point without mentioning anything about religion. I guess I am just a homophobe instead of a right wing religous nutcase. :joy:
 
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