srfisher17
Active Member
Jstdv8;3272409 said:
Quarantine Tank question
- Thread starter pepito113
- Start date
florida joe
Well-Known Member
I personally think its very rare to transfer ick from my LFS in its divisional stage simply because they segregate their coral from their fish.
srfisher17
Active Member
You're probably right Joe. I just got into the habit of running everything through QT a long time ago; and my "teacher" said that ich isn't the only problem that can be caught in QT. All it takes is one use of a net, etc, used in a tank with fish and then used in the coral tank, to transfer parasites. I'll admit that this is one area I am really on the over-kill side of.
J
jstdv8
Guest
the LFS I buy most of my stuff from does not seperate coral from fish
florida joe
Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by Jstdv8
http:///forum/post/3272689
the LFS I buy most of my stuff from does not seperate coral from fish
so his coral and fish are in the same tank
http:///forum/post/3272689
the LFS I buy most of my stuff from does not seperate coral from fish
so his coral and fish are in the same tank
florida joe
Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by srfisher17
http:///forum/post/3272677
You're probably right Joe. I just got into the habit of running everything through QT a long time ago; and my "teacher" said that ich isn't the only problem that can be caught in QT. All it takes is one use of a net, etc, used in a tank with fish and then used in the coral tank, to transfer parasites. I'll admit that this is one area I am really on the over-kill side of.
Yes water is the great conduit for ick from one tank to another
http:///forum/post/3272677
You're probably right Joe. I just got into the habit of running everything through QT a long time ago; and my "teacher" said that ich isn't the only problem that can be caught in QT. All it takes is one use of a net, etc, used in a tank with fish and then used in the coral tank, to transfer parasites. I'll admit that this is one area I am really on the over-kill side of.
Yes water is the great conduit for ick from one tank to another
fishyscientist
Member
This is a really good thread. Gives me lots to think about!
Just curious...does everyone (or anyone) here keep their QT running between adding fish? Or do you clean it and start from scratch each time you add a new fish to it?
Just curious...does everyone (or anyone) here keep their QT running between adding fish? Or do you clean it and start from scratch each time you add a new fish to it?
florida joe
Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by FishyScientist
http:///forum/post/3272776
This is a really good thread. Gives me lots to think about!
Just curious...does everyone (or anyone) here keep their QT running between adding fish? Or do you clean it and start from scratch each time you add a new fish to it?
its not so much keeping the the tank up and running as it is keeping nitrification bacteria colony's on media available when needed
http:///forum/post/3272776
This is a really good thread. Gives me lots to think about!
Just curious...does everyone (or anyone) here keep their QT running between adding fish? Or do you clean it and start from scratch each time you add a new fish to it?
its not so much keeping the the tank up and running as it is keeping nitrification bacteria colony's on media available when needed
fishyscientist
Member
Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/3272780
its not so much keeping the the tank up and running as it is keeping nitrification bacteria colony's on media available when needed
So each time you QT a fish, you add a source of bacteria....like a sponge that's been sitting in your tank for instance? I did that when I quarantined my clowns. I want to get a fish to QT in the next few days, and I'm wondering what's the best way to keep the bacteria alive in the QT.
http:///forum/post/3272780
its not so much keeping the the tank up and running as it is keeping nitrification bacteria colony's on media available when needed
So each time you QT a fish, you add a source of bacteria....like a sponge that's been sitting in your tank for instance? I did that when I quarantined my clowns. I want to get a fish to QT in the next few days, and I'm wondering what's the best way to keep the bacteria alive in the QT.
florida joe
Well-Known Member
if you are using a filter with a bio wheel in your QT place a new one in an area of good flow in your DT or if you are using filter material (blue white) in your DT cut a piece of it and add it to your QT filter and ghost feed
fishyscientist
Member
Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/3272782
if you are using a filter with a bio wheel in your QT place a new one in an area of good flow in your DT or if you are using filter material (blue white) in your DT cut a piece of it and add it to your QT filter and ghost feed
ok thanks!
http:///forum/post/3272782
if you are using a filter with a bio wheel in your QT place a new one in an area of good flow in your DT or if you are using filter material (blue white) in your DT cut a piece of it and add it to your QT filter and ghost feed
ok thanks!
J
jstdv8
Guest
Originally Posted by florida joe
http:///forum/post/3272713
so his coral and fish are in the same tank
yes, he recently just bought two 400 gallon rimless tanks for the corals, but before that fish and corals were all in a bunch of 10 gallon tanks and all of the tanks are connected to a single huge sump
http:///forum/post/3272713
so his coral and fish are in the same tank
yes, he recently just bought two 400 gallon rimless tanks for the corals, but before that fish and corals were all in a bunch of 10 gallon tanks and all of the tanks are connected to a single huge sump
srfisher17
Active Member
Originally Posted by Jstdv8
http:///forum/post/3272921
yes, he recently just bought two 400 gallon rimless tanks for the corals, but before that fish and corals were all in a bunch of 10 gallon tanks and all of the tanks are connected to a single huge sump
Stuff like this is very common and not always visible. The nearest decent LFS to me has the corals in their own rimless tanks; but when you follow the plumbing (you have to peek behind a curtain), you can see lines from the fish are merging with lines from the coral tanks. Then they go into a big common fractionator and sump area.
http:///forum/post/3272921
yes, he recently just bought two 400 gallon rimless tanks for the corals, but before that fish and corals were all in a bunch of 10 gallon tanks and all of the tanks are connected to a single huge sump
Stuff like this is very common and not always visible. The nearest decent LFS to me has the corals in their own rimless tanks; but when you follow the plumbing (you have to peek behind a curtain), you can see lines from the fish are merging with lines from the coral tanks. Then they go into a big common fractionator and sump area.
J
jstdv8
Guest
ok Joe, spanko, Sr, meo, so I was having an argument with my old man today about the ich life cycle. His side is that ich is always present and only shows it's self when he fish is weak.
I was telling him about QT, treatment and the life cycle and all of that but I ddint ahve an answer for him when it came to Quarantine time and why the ich shows up in that time.
He said my tank can go years and then all of a sudden i get a power outage or soemthinga nd my tank temp drops or soemthing and a few of my fish come down with ich. so its always in there it jsut doesnt show up all the time. I agreed that its always in there. But I couldnt tell him why it shows up in QT when it can got for a long period of time without showing in your DT. So what is the answer? if the QT tank is a relaxing place of solitude for the fish to get comfortable what makes the ich show up? does it have to show up for some reason? Seems the way to go is to just start treatment right off the bat in the QT.
I just don't have all the answers and I'm thirsting for knowlege.
I was telling him about QT, treatment and the life cycle and all of that but I ddint ahve an answer for him when it came to Quarantine time and why the ich shows up in that time.
He said my tank can go years and then all of a sudden i get a power outage or soemthinga nd my tank temp drops or soemthing and a few of my fish come down with ich. so its always in there it jsut doesnt show up all the time. I agreed that its always in there. But I couldnt tell him why it shows up in QT when it can got for a long period of time without showing in your DT. So what is the answer? if the QT tank is a relaxing place of solitude for the fish to get comfortable what makes the ich show up? does it have to show up for some reason? Seems the way to go is to just start treatment right off the bat in the QT.
I just don't have all the answers and I'm thirsting for knowlege.
J
jstdv8
Guest
ohh boy are you gonna hate me for this. But I was looking up julian sprung since joe mentioned him specifically. He is the co-founder of two little fishes which produces a bunch of stuff for our tanks. he also wrote a couple books on reef tanks. Anyways here is the link from a site that came up with his name on it about the overall life cycle of marine ich. very informative. http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issu...2003/mini2.htm
As you can see, allthough rare at the temperatures that we keep our reef tanks marine ich has been known to live in tomont stage for up to 72 days. Thats even longer than the 9 weeks I was mentioning before. So at least now you know I wasnt just making it up
reliable journal source.
Anyways, I still don't know why they have to show symptoms in 4-6 weeks of QT time when fish can live in an ich filled tank for months or even years without showing any signs until your tank has a failure or the fish gets stressed.
As you can see, allthough rare at the temperatures that we keep our reef tanks marine ich has been known to live in tomont stage for up to 72 days. Thats even longer than the 9 weeks I was mentioning before. So at least now you know I wasnt just making it up
reliable journal source.Anyways, I still don't know why they have to show symptoms in 4-6 weeks of QT time when fish can live in an ich filled tank for months or even years without showing any signs until your tank has a failure or the fish gets stressed.
florida joe
Well-Known Member
His side is that ich is always present and only shows it's self when he fish is weak.
Your father is correct yes i said he is CORRECT. BUT only in this situation. The tank has been infected with ick. The life cycle of ick was never broken, theoretically the ick parasite can be living in the tank in small enough numbers that it goes undetected until a full blown infestation appears
I too have also heard that ich can lay dorment and that a healthy fish can fight it for months or years
This is a contradiction please explain what you mean
Your father is correct yes i said he is CORRECT. BUT only in this situation. The tank has been infected with ick. The life cycle of ick was never broken, theoretically the ick parasite can be living in the tank in small enough numbers that it goes undetected until a full blown infestation appears
I too have also heard that ich can lay dorment and that a healthy fish can fight it for months or years
This is a contradiction please explain what you mean
fishyscientist
Member
If many LFSs or online sources treat fish with copper, then how can you assume that every fish always has ich? There would have to be a source somewhere.
According to that source, Jstvd8, the report of the tomont hatching taking 72 days was in cooler water. This stage is strain and temperature dependent. The article states that in marine aquarium temperatures that this hatching stage takes up to 28 days. If you add to it the trophont stage time where the parasite is attached to its host, then the total reasonable time to quarantine a fish would be 5-6 weeks. This makes the most scientific sense to me, anyway, based on that article, which seems to be referenced well.
According to that source, Jstvd8, the report of the tomont hatching taking 72 days was in cooler water. This stage is strain and temperature dependent. The article states that in marine aquarium temperatures that this hatching stage takes up to 28 days. If you add to it the trophont stage time where the parasite is attached to its host, then the total reasonable time to quarantine a fish would be 5-6 weeks. This makes the most scientific sense to me, anyway, based on that article, which seems to be referenced well.
florida joe
Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by FishyScientist
http:///forum/post/3274949
If many LFSs or online sources treat fish with copper, then how can you assume that every fish always has ich? There would have to be a source somewhere.
According to that source, Jstvd8, the report of the tomont hatching taking 72 days was in cooler water. This stage is strain and temperature dependent. The article states that in marine aquarium temperatures that this hatching stage takes up to 28 days. If you add to it the trophont stage time where the parasite is attached to its host, then the total reasonable time to quarantine a fish would be 5-6 weeks. This makes the most scientific sense to me, anyway, based on that article, which seems to be referenced well.
correct this is a copy of that statment
The time frame in which tomonts may hatch can vary greatly from 3 to 72 days (Noga, 2000). The life cycle of Cryptocaryon irritans is temperature dependant so an extended period of 72 days is highly unusual and can only occur in cooler waters. At “reef-type” temperatures the tomonts take from 3 to 28 days to excyst (hatch) with the peak between 4 and 8 days (Colorni, 1985). This variance may be a strategy for survival. However, after two weeks in the tomont stage the number of theronts produced and their ability to infect are greatly reduced (Colorni, 1992)
http:///forum/post/3274949
If many LFSs or online sources treat fish with copper, then how can you assume that every fish always has ich? There would have to be a source somewhere.
According to that source, Jstvd8, the report of the tomont hatching taking 72 days was in cooler water. This stage is strain and temperature dependent. The article states that in marine aquarium temperatures that this hatching stage takes up to 28 days. If you add to it the trophont stage time where the parasite is attached to its host, then the total reasonable time to quarantine a fish would be 5-6 weeks. This makes the most scientific sense to me, anyway, based on that article, which seems to be referenced well.
correct this is a copy of that statment
The time frame in which tomonts may hatch can vary greatly from 3 to 72 days (Noga, 2000). The life cycle of Cryptocaryon irritans is temperature dependant so an extended period of 72 days is highly unusual and can only occur in cooler waters. At “reef-type” temperatures the tomonts take from 3 to 28 days to excyst (hatch) with the peak between 4 and 8 days (Colorni, 1985). This variance may be a strategy for survival. However, after two weeks in the tomont stage the number of theronts produced and their ability to infect are greatly reduced (Colorni, 1992)
J
jstdv8
Guest
I only referenced that part becuase earlier in this thread I was called out (and rigthfully so) for posting unconfirmed information about marine ich going as long as 9 weeks.
Joe,
So the question is why are we guaranteed that the ich will show up in 6 weeks of quarantine if it may not show up on fish in your DT for a much longer period of time?
This is especially alarming when considering that the QT is supposed to be a place of solace for the newcommer.
Joe,
So the question is why are we guaranteed that the ich will show up in 6 weeks of quarantine if it may not show up on fish in your DT for a much longer period of time?
This is especially alarming when considering that the QT is supposed to be a place of solace for the newcommer.