Queen Conch

shipwrecked

shipwrecked

Member
maybe taking some snails were wrong,at least you didnt do an oil change on the beach while you were collecting them...jk,anyways I guess it all depends on how you look at our hobby,minus one thing plus for another.example: when most people make RO water,do they save and reuse the waste water? just food for thought,back to topic,glad to hear that you learned from this mistake
 
renogaw

renogaw

Active Member
Originally Posted by Coral Keeper
Isn't everything else wild caught too? Where else do you think everything comes from?

more and more RESPONSIBLE hobbyists are fragging and breeding in captivity. yes, there is a lot that is COMMERCIALLY harvested out there. but they also are professional harvesters, with commercial liscences to do so, and won't harvest endangered species....
the problem is NOT harvesting per se. it is the harvesting of unknown animals, bringing them into a closed system that has it's own set of pathogens and bacteria that the animals in the tank have grown used to and have a biological system to deal with them, then finding out the animal should not have been harvested and then released. those pathogens or bacteria can now get into an open system, such as the ocean, and cause havoc.
think about it. If all your rock was from fiji, and you had all fish from the pacific, where are all the pathogens/bacteria from? the pacific. the animals and the rock and the ecosystem know how to deal with it.
now, you put those pathogens and bacteria into the atlantic. the fish/rock/corals don't have any natural defenses against them, so they can spread and multiply and kill everything until the animals do.
look at caleurpa in california. there are no natural predators to eat it in their shorlines. it is taking over to the point where it is illegal to ship calerupa to california.
 
buckster71

buckster71

Member
I just cringe even at the natural resource department releasing anything foriegn to teh land into the wild, even to combat and infestation, because even the thing released is not native and might do damage,
However, I disagree as the ocean has a way of taking care of itself and really doesn't need bunch of thoughtful humans watching out for it. It has survived over a billion years of parasite outbreaks and a handful of snails won't make a difference I would simply return them and watch out for Jim dogooder and the Ecopolice.
Now if we can get 5.5 billion humans from dumping sewage into the ocean, then we'll get somewhere.
 
cleanrshrmpfan

cleanrshrmpfan

Member
Originally Posted by buckster71
I just cringe even at the natural resource department releasing anything foriegn to teh land into the wild, even to combat and infestation, because even the thing released is not native and might do damage,
However, I disagree as the ocean has a way of taking care of itself and really doesn't need bunch of thoughtful humans watching out for it. It has survived over a billion years of parasite outbreaks and a handful of snails won't make a difference I would simply return them and watch out for Jim dogooder and the Ecopolice.
Now if we can get 5.5 billion humans from dumping sewage into the ocean, then we'll get somewhere.
that is so incredibly dumb. do not put anything in your tank into the wild no matter what. what if his tank has some odd disease. thats like saying well its only one person with small pox so what harm could he do... just go ahead and drop him off in the middle of NY city. no its dumb every step counts and if i can get just 1 person not to release tank animals into the wild, its helping
 
buckster71

buckster71

Member
Oh,
So I see. There was no bacteria in the oceans before people like you roamed the earth to save it?
I suppose that cleaner wrasses were genetically spliced at the Burnham institute in the 60's?
Maybe he should flush the snails down the toilet...oh WAIT!!!!
They'll still wind up back in the ocean!!!!!!!!!!
Oh...just to open your mind...ooo..just a smidgen...
MOST DISEASE FROM YOUR TANK COMES FROM THE OCEAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That comes from when you introduce fish...or rock or anything from a different evoirnment...such as....the OCEAN!
YIKES!
 
buckster71

buckster71

Member
Originally Posted by cleanrshrmpfan
that is so incredibly dumb. do not put anything in your tank into the wild no matter what. what if his tank has some odd disease. thats like saying well its only one person with small pox so what harm could he do... just go ahead and drop him off in the middle of NY city. no its dumb every step counts and if i can get just 1 person not to release tank animals into the wild, its helping
Before another post we better ask the question.
Was the person who has small pox caught it from an immigrant from Mexico who wasn't innoculated (meaning the wild) or injected by evil Halliburton?
 
nietzsche

nietzsche

Active Member
Originally Posted by buckster71
Before another post we better ask the question.
Was the person who has small pox caught it from an immigrant from Mexico who wasn't innoculated (meaning the wild) or injected by evil Halliburton?

are you now being racist and attacking mexican illegal immigrants?
its not a smart idea to start dumping things back into the ocean. you have no clue what parasite has attached to the snail from our tanks; like renogaw stated earlier, were bringing all these things into our tank from different regions in the world and just put them all in one tank. some are more prone to getting a disease than others would. it would not be a smart idea to just dump stuff back into the ocean and assume the ocean will take care of it. think of it this way: where did fire ants originate? how did they get here? did people think "oh no big deal, itll take care of itself," and look at how theyve spread throughout the south. go to "introduced species" of this link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fire_ant
its the same thing with the snails but on a scale you cant see and a scale many wont be able to track or measure
 
buckster71

buckster71

Member
No it is not a racist statement. It is a statement of fact that immigrants are reintroducing disease that we have irradicated. TB, bed bugs...ect. That is because all your racist crys fall on ears of non-logical thinking. Ellis Island turned back the diseased for good reason. It is easy to cry foul instead of THINK!
But in reality it is just that point. We irradicate every parasite in our tanks or as we think we are, but you people aren't reading the beginning post as he plucked them from the wild and wanted to put them back in the same spot.
NOW WHERE was it stated that he plopped them in his tank, he may even be holding them in the same water...sheesh!
So with that I DOUBT there will be a problem as he didn't pluck them from Zimba
e and decide to put them in the Bearing Staights, as that is what I stated in my first post about Department of Natural Resources from your state implementing all kinds of bugs for this and for that, and it spirals out of control.
Of course...do I have to design a logic flow diagram here?
Renogaw has his opinion proper trade. My point is what is the difference when developing countries of the world are dumping toxic sludge into the very same oceans? What is a bit of catch and release to the same spot? I catch a fish, put him off my hook and release him...OH NO! MY HANDS ARE DISEASED!!!!
Problem is that do-gooders miss the point thatt the world isn't pristine and never really was in the first place. Probably 98% of disease and bacteria form naturally and not 100% from your 75 gallon fish tank, where as the world is sterile
The oceans can survive. A protected species might not. I'm not saying put a turkish turtle in Lake Michigan here either
 
nietzsche

nietzsche

Active Member
do what you want. youre basically saying "people pollute the ocean, what's it to it if you throw stuff back in with parasites." great way of thinking. if you like to catch fish, not clean your hands, that's up to you. we all know people get sick by going around, touching things and then eating or rubbing their eyes
were talking about something else and you're very strong on this ocean pollution, that's for another topic.
as for your illegal immigrant comment, it's obvious you have some beef with mexican illegal immigrants since you specifically mentioned MEXICAN ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS. what about canadians? i'm tired of people like you and Lou Dobbs attacking mexican illegal immigrants instead of attacking all of the immigration from many other different countries. but that's for another topic
were talking about the possibility of introducing parasites that we cannot see with our eyes and having that possible parasaite destroying many other conchs or that can spread to other animals. Look at schistosomiasis and how it uses an alternate host in order to get into humans. Oh look at that, it uses snails. wow. although this is in developing countries im trying to show you that things can be transferred over to other animals even though we cannot see them
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:S...ife_Cycle.jpeg
 
cleanrshrmpfan

cleanrshrmpfan

Member
Originally Posted by buckster71
Before another post we better ask the question.
Was the person who has small pox caught it from an immigrant from Mexico who wasn't innoculated (meaning the wild) or injected by evil Halliburton?
actually alot of people in the united states dont have the inoculation because the disease is pretty much wiped out so what i am saying is ....... what is with the remark about the mexican i find it offensive for mexicans(me not being one but i still dont respect racism) so stop being rude.
 
buckster71

buckster71

Member
Originally Posted by cleanrshrmpfan
actually alot of people in the united states dont have the inoculation because the disease is pretty much wiped out so what i am saying is ....... what is with the remark about the mexican i find it offensive for mexicans(me not being one but i still dont respect racism) so stop being rude.

As opposed to you? Calling my post dumb?
 
buckster71

buckster71

Member
Originally Posted by cleanrshrmpfan
actually alot of people in the united states dont have the inoculation because the disease is pretty much wiped out so what i am saying is ....... what is with the remark about the mexican i find it offensive for mexicans(me not being one but i still dont respect racism) so stop being rude.

By the way IT IS LAW to have your kids innoculated.
Just as it was for you... You can't go anywhere without proof of innoculations. Which I had to do, for my wife to immigrate here.
 
nietzsche

nietzsche

Active Member
Originally Posted by buckster71
That is your opinon...yaY!
My wife is a latina...so don't go looking for hatemongering, when it is the truth!

tell your "latina" wife that you believe mexican illegal immigrants are the cause for all the diseases in the USA then. i have no idea what ethnicity she is or what her background is, but if her family were from mexico im sure she would take offense to such an ignorant comment. i take offense to such stupid comments. it's great you feel so strong about illegal immigrants, but what makes me angry is how you're attacking mexican illegal immigrants specifically. that's just racially motivated to me and using "immigrants" as an excuse to cover up your hatred for mexicans is just wrong.
 
buckster71

buckster71

Member
Now...did I say illegal?
Did I say that mexicans created all US disease? Nor did I say I hated Mexicans. Of all the 13 times I've been to Mexico and many times more south of there.
Those are your words, not mine.
For you to say that TB and other disease is not being transported one way or another through a pourous border is ludicous. If you are offended, so be it...be offended. Don't really care much about your offense That is your choice in the matter, much like it is the original guys choice to pluck some snails for the wild he can choose to put them back, whether anybody likes it.
My wife has her opinions too. She is not offended by such a comment, because she lived in latin america for 34 of 35 years, so she has seen life out of the US. SO have I.
 
nietzsche

nietzsche

Active Member
Originally Posted by buckster71
Now...did I say illegal?
Did I say that mexicans created all US disease?
Those are your words, not mine.
For you to say that TB and other disease is not being transported one way or another through a pourous border is ludicous. If you are offended, so be it...be offended. Don't really care much about your offense That is your choice in the matter, much like it is the original guys choice to pluck some snails for the wild he can choose to put them back, whether anybody likes it.
My wife has her opinions too. She is not offended by such a comment, because she lived in latin america for 34 of 35 years, so she has seen life out of the US. SO have I.
COOL.
 
cleanrshrmpfan

cleanrshrmpfan

Member
Originally Posted by buckster71
As opposed to you? Calling my post dumb?
I don't think that your post made that much sense, so maybe I didn't get the question to it's full potential?! Could you please verify what you had said?
 
buckster71

buckster71

Member
Why shut it down.
He was asking whether or not to put the snails back.
There are different views. If my analogy to your post was to be viewed as hatemongering, then it will get out of control.
Should he put them back or not? I say what's the difference, the ocean can take care of itself, while some (say you cleanershrimpfan) have a different opinion as nature is pristine and subject to being wrecked only by human hands, whereas I believe that nature continously destoys and rebuilds itself.
I just made a counterpoint to your small pox arguement to mine, whereas you called what I said DUMB..
NOW I agree I should have said immigrant other than legal from ...anywhere, but I didn't, then it got out of hand and I had to defend that I wasn't hatemongering, only talking truth that it actually is happening.....
So, that is where it is at. nybyrne is the one who will make the choice whether to put them back or not, based off of who he believes more.
But this shutdown the blog...that is nonsense.
 
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