Question about calcium and other additives.

[chrisely24]

I only have a few easy to maintain corals in my 90 right now.
All my test levels, I.E Cal, Alk are at the bare minimums of what I read they should be. The few corals in the tank seem to be doing ok after 3 weeks.

Should I be adding anything to the tank to help nourish or help feed the filter feeding corals?

I am pretty sure I don't need any extensive dripping or dosing system at this point until I get in to the hard corals but, I was wondering about additives such as C-Balance and some of the Kent Marine additives.

My Calcium levels test at 400 on the API kit (Ordered a Hanna checker last night) Which API states is pretty much the minimum. This is 1 week after a 30 gallon water change using Reef Crystals.

i would like to see some coralline algae growth but after a month or so I am not seeing any.

Thanks.

 

[deejeff0442]

Get some better salt.get what ya pay for with it.a good salt should yield 550 calcium or better.

 

[lmforbis]

Along the same line. What is a good range for Alk? My test kit measures in meq/L. It says the target should be between 4 and 6 meq/L. The conversion factor is 2.8. When I do the math it seems that 4-6 meq/L is pretty high.

 

[deejeff0442]

A little higher if fine.it affects the ph of a tank so where is the ph at?

 

[mandy111]

Get some better salt.get what ya pay for with it.a good salt should yield 550 calcium or better.

Wow... 550 or higher, Thats crazy. I dont personally know anyone that runs cal at more than 450 and that's considered high,

The range for Cal 380 - 450
Alk 7 - 12 DKH
Mag 1200-1350

These are ideal parameters.
for steady coral skeleton growth, and good coraline growth.
Make sure you get your Mag right first then concentrate on the other 2

http://www.mrsaltwatertank.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Mr_Saltwater_Tank_Test_Kit_Recommended_list.pdf\\

Here is a link to a great print off guide to all paramaters that you should be aiming for, its what I have used since starting up.
Do no run at 550, thats just crazy advice.

 

[mandy111]

I only have a few easy to maintain corals in my 90 right now.
All my test levels, I.E Cal, Alk are at the bare minimums of what I read they should be. The few corals in the tank seem to be doing ok after 3 weeks.

Should I be adding anything to the tank to help nourish or help feed the filter feeding corals?

I am pretty sure I don't need any extensive dripping or dosing system at this point until I get in to the hard corals but, I was wondering about additives such as C-Balance and some of the Kent Marine additives.

My Calcium levels test at 400 on the API kit (Ordered a Hanna checker last night) Which API states is pretty much the minimum. This is 1 week after a 30 gallon water change using Reef Crystals.

i would like to see some coralline algae growth but after a month or so I am not seeing any.

Thanks.

Print off the above parameter guide, It is great because it had different table for diferent tanks and coral types.
Your cal is perfectly acceptable for the corals you have, I may bring it up to about 420ppm but you are still well within acceptable range
if you have any other questions please just ask. But do not get it to 550 it will cause all kinds of associated problems.
I don't test my PH and haven't done for years.Do not try to alter PH, no ups or downs, natural ups and downs will occur, you do not want to be upping and downing yourself And chasing numbers. worst thing you could possibly do. , ph is something that quite easily self regulates without too many issues at all.

 

[deejeff0442]

Oops sorry guys.i meant to write 450 on calcium at 1.026 .yea 550 would throw the wbole tank off.

 

[chrisely24]

Mandy111, that link is no longer there. Do you have a copy of the .pdf file we could get?

I know that Instant Ocean reef crystals are not the best out there but I am sure they work ok.

I just went by Petsmart and they had the 5 gallon buckets on sale for 32.00. I might go back and get one tomorrow.

 

[chrisely24]

So what makes the Coralline algae? My 65 fowlr tank has been set up since Nov 2014 and I only have a few small spots of it on my rocks.

I did purchase some Margarita snails from here that were encrusted with it to stimulate growth but, I am not really believing the hype lol.

 

[mandy111]

Get a knife & scrape it off the snails shells. Let it float around the tank it will spread. It needs good lighting , alk mag & cal. Google alk & calcium balance calculator & that will help you balance your tank completely. A balanced tank is a happy tank. That's is the only link I have. Google mr saltwater tank recommended parameters & it will be there. Just tember it's not just the numbers that have to be right it needs to be balance if things. Eg. Cal if 440 alk needs to be x. Hope this helps.

 

[mandy111]

Oops sorry guys.i meant to write 450 on calcium at 1.026 .yea 550 would throw the wbole tank off.

I wondered if that was the case. Ooops. Lol

 

[pegasus]

************** dot com has a good calculator for dosing alk, cal, and mag. They recommend using up a gallon of alk and mag first, and then dosing about 50ml of mag. I just dose mag when needed. Just remember, when you add calcium to the tank, the alkalinity drops... and vice versa. Try to keep levels as stabile as possible, so there isn't any large swings with either. I don't worry about pH either. As long as Alk is within range, the pH is usually close to where it needs to be. Stable alk levels typically result in stabile pH levels... which is more desirable than a specific number.

Just tember it's not just the numbers that have to be right it needs to be balance if things. Eg. Cal if 440 alk needs to be x. Hope this helps.

I may be wrong, but it almost sounds like you're saying that is Cal is 440, then Alk needs to be 7.3... and if Cal is 450, Alk needs to be 8.0. Those are just random numbers used as examples, but I think you get the gist. Nowhere have I read, or heard, that a specific Alk number that needs to be tied to a specific Cal number. NSW has a calcium level of 360ppm, with higher levels at depth. Yet most hobbyists try to maintain calcium somewhere between 425-450ppm. NSW has an alkalinity of 7-8dKH, while most hobbyists try to maintain it between 9-12dKH. As long as you stay within range, corals will use what they need... and no more. Higher levels will not result in faster growth or healthier specimens, but lower levels will significantly slow growth and likely result in poor health. Again, more important than a specific number, stability within a specific range is what you should try to achieve. Every tank is different, and it can be a bit of a juggling act to get parameters where you want them to be, and it takes a good bit of dosing and testing to find the right balance. Once you've found the balance, maintaining it is the easy part...

 

[mandy111]

************** dot com has a good calculator for dosing alk, cal, and mag. They recommend using up a gallon of alk and mag first, and then dosing about 50ml of mag. I just dose mag when needed. Just remember, when you add calcium to the tank, the alkalinity drops... and vice versa. Try to keep levels as stabile as possible, so there isn't any large swings with either. I don't worry about pH either. As long as Alk is within range, the pH is usually close to where it needs to be. Stable alk levels typically result in stabile pH levels... which is more desirable than a specific number.

I may be wrong, but it almost sounds like you're saying that is Cal is 440, then Alk needs to be 7.3... and if Cal is 450, Alk needs to be 8.0. Those are just random numbers used as examples, but I think you get the gist. Nowhere have I read, or heard, that a specific Alk number that needs to be tied to a specific Cal number. NSW has a calcium level of 360ppm, with higher levels at depth. Yet most hobbyists try to maintain calcium somewhere between 425-450ppm. NSW has an alkalinity of 7-8dKH, while most hobbyists try to maintain it between 9-12dKH. As long as you stay within range, corals will use what they need... and no more. Higher levels will not result in faster growth or healthier specimens, but lower levels will significantly slow growth and likely result in poor health. Again, more important than a specific number, stability within a specific range is what you should try to achieve. Every tank is different, and it can be a bit of a juggling act to get parameters where you want them to be, and it takes a good bit of dosing and testing to find the right balance. Once you've found the balance, maintaining it is the easy part...

ok. get what your saying, but I have to disagree. A tank has to be balanced, mag , cal and alk all tie into that balance.
I have used and swear by this calculator that I have used since day one. corals, water quality and coraline algae has flourished.
I am not saying its the only way but it works for me, I 100% follow this balance calculator at all times.

 

[mandy111]

So what makes the Coralline algae? My 65 fowlr tank has been set up since Nov 2014 and I only have a few small spots of it on my rocks.

I did purchase some Margarita snails from here that were encrusted with it to stimulate growth but, I am not really believing the hype lol.

here are some pics and dates they were taken.
This will show you the coraline growth that can be achieved with a balanced tank.

This taken on the 12 may 2015
Notice the right had rock change and black weir wall.

This one taken 17th may 2015 after placing corals on new rock.

This one taken on the 26th may. tonight to show the growth of coraline

I would expect the new rock to be covered in coraline withing the next 4 to 6 weeks or so.
If the right balance of alk and cal is not kept it is not impossible to get that growth but it certainly makes it significantly harder.

 

[mandy111]

@pegasus

I don't know everything about tanks and reefing, but I do know some. I still learn every day. Thats one thing I really enjoy about this hobby, I have some amazing mentors that have got me to were I and my tank is now. I am not saying its the best or the right way but it certainly has worked for me over the 2 yrs I have been in this hobby.

It just honestly feel that every single time I comment or offer an opinion on something you strongly disagree. with what I say. I don't think i have manged to post once without you disagreeing with what I say.
I totally understand that all tanks are different, that new things come into this hobby all the time, I am very willing to learn from you and anyone else that I can learn from, but you seem to battle me every single bloody time.
Let me ask you honestly, are your ears open ?
Is your mind open to things that change ?
EG this balance calculator has been around for ever and a ton of aussie reefers swear by it, but you once again say you've never heard of it and don't believe it instead of "wow never knew that, let me take a look and research and get back to you with my thoughts"

I know that stability is the key, I keep stable as I possibly can with daily dosing but I also keep it in balance at all times.So maybe I have actually taught you something today.

I thank you for teaching me to always have an open mind and learn, and not always think I am right.

This is not an attack, this is just my point of view. Your obviously very experience and know your stuff, but like everyone else you don't know everything. Just like me. lol

 

[bang guy]

I have, for the past 35 years, attempted to maintain a balance between Calcium and Alkalinity for reef tanks. Here are my thoughts:

Corals and other Calcium carbonate builders use Calcium and Carbonate in nearly the same proportion. So when 100ppm of Calcium is used, about 100ppm of Carbonate is used.

It just makes sense to me to keep them balanced or one could drop too low for the corals. As a starting point let's just say that 280ppm Calcium is where corals stop growing and start dissolving and 25ppm carbonate (Bicarb counts) is the level for Alkalinity.

If you keep your tank at near NSW levels (let's say 300ppm Calcium and 125ppm Carbonate) and you have a good coral load then the tank could easily consume 10ppm Calcium a day. That also means that Carbonate is going to drop 10ppm a day. After a week both levels are going to be in the death zone. Well, probably not because the corals would stop growing so the consumption rate would be drastically reduced. If you keep Calcium higher but not Carbonate it doesn't help at all. Carbonate still drops to the death zone before a week is up.

 

[pegasus]

Dear Mandy, if I appear to be attacking you... I am honestly sorry. It has never been my intention to do so. I'm always glad to see how well you've done with your tank, and have, to be honest, been quite impressed. I may have even mentioned that on occasion. I, too often, have a way of coming across a bit harsh. It's not that I completely disagree, or think that you're wrong, it's just my poor way of communicating a difference of opinion. I know I am not always right. Quite the contrary. Thank you for putting me in my place, and I will work on presenting different views/opinions in a better, less combative way. Truce?

 

[mandy111]

Dear Mandy, if I appear to be attacking you... I am honestly sorry. It has never been my intention to do so. I'm always glad to see how well you've done with your tank, and have, to be honest, been quite impressed. I may have even mentioned that on occasion. I, too often, have a way of coming across a bit harsh. It's not that I completely disagree, or think that you're wrong, it's just my poor way of communicating a difference of opinion. I know I am not always right. Quite the contrary. Thank you for putting me in my place, and I will work on presenting different views/opinions in a better, less combative way. Truce?

yeah all good.
Don't need a Truce ? as I don't believe we are fighting, just difference of opinion is all. I am afraid I sometimes call it as I see it. must be the Irish in me.
I do respect you as a reefer and your clearly a well respected and knowledgeable member. just its how you come across.
NO problem my end.

 

[beaslbob]

In case it hasn't been mentioned already I recommend you look up and read an article- Dr Randy Homes-Farley improved diy 2 part

 

[mandy111]

In case is hasn't been mentioned already I recommend you look up and read an article- Dr Randy Homes-Farley improved diy 2 part

Dose Randy's. Very affordable but sooo messy. Thanks for link will take a look