Ripped off by my lfs!

[mikeyfishy]

I admit I allowed this to happen to me since I should have checked online prices before I went to my lfs. I knew my lfs was overpriced compared to others in the area but I had no idea it was this bad. On fish, it seemed like I was paying up to about a 50% premium over other lfs but I was willing to spend extra due to the quality of his stock and the advice he had given me. I needed a new skimmer because I dropped my SeaClone 100 and broke it, so I bought a new SeaClone 150 from him. I really liked the SeaClone 100 so I decided to go with the bigger model as I had luck with the 100 (please spare me the AquaC recommendations). I thought his price seemed too high, but I figured it was probably only a little high and I like giving him my business.
Later, I realized that the $179 he charged me was TWICE what you'd pay online. They sell for $95 to $100 max online and when I questioned him about that seeming a bit high, he just said that he's not able to get deep discounts because he only buys a couple at a time. When I realized later that *anyone* could get one for $95 just ordering single units, I realized how bad this guy is ripping people off. I know there is no way he payed more than $95 for that thing! I'm wondering if I'm the only one who thinks this is highway robbery!?!? Usually the lfs don't mark things up double do they? To give a comparison, here are some typical prices he charges for fish and compared to one other lfs in the area, these seem 2x inflated too. I'm wondering if it's just me or do you guys think he's drastically overpriced:
Oscellaras clown (small ~1.5 inch): $29.99.
True percula (small ~1.5 inch): $34.99
Hippo Tang (small ~2 inch): $89.
Cleaner shrimp (~3 inch): $30
Yellow tang (~2.5 inch): $59
These are inflated at least 50% over the other lfs in the area, some 2x. I know the price on that SeaClone was an absolute raping, but what do you guys think of the fish prices for a lfs? I lived with the higher fish prices just because his fish are so healthy, but I'm not sure they are 2x as healthy! I'm in the north/central Maryland area BTW.
Thanks,
Mike

 

[peter1215]

he's definitley ripping you off with those fish prices. I can get every fish on your list for 50% less or more. i can get 2.5' yellow tangs for $20 and 2 inch hippo tangs for $45 . I would continue but it would only make you feel worse. If thats the only decent shop you have near you , you might as well get them online. I hear this site has decent fish.

 

[julie853]

Are you sure your not in AZ???LOL
My lfs here is about the same in prices and it is VERY HIGH prices.I live in a small town where this is the only LFS so they can get away with it.
If I'm willing to drive 80 miles I can fo to other LFS and pay less than half of the price.Sooo about twice a month I drive the 80 miles and get everything I need to avoid those high pricees.

 

[scrapman]

Had the same sour experience with a LFS close to home.They helped me start in this hobby... but I soon realized that their expertise and prices were respectively below and above average.
I learned a lot through this site and by visiting countless LFS in my state and out of state.
Who said "the best customer is an educated customer"? It works.

 

[payton 350]

it costs a lot of money to run a sw shop,,,,,imagine the electric bill from just the coral tanks alone....they almost have to charge that high in order to stay in business......it sucks......but order online

 

[vicegrip]

My lfs recomended I buy my pumps and skimmers from wholesale sites. He was telling me the store can't get them from there distributor for what they are listed online.He said he gets a 15% discount and he still buys his hardware online

 

[vicegrip]

What I do like about a lfs is 1. I can see what I'm getting for a little more $ and 2. interacting with other sw lovers in person. :happyfish

 

[scsinet]

Your prices do not seem all that bad to me, you just have to have your expectations set right.
The prices you listed for both the equipment and the fish are right inline with what I see just about everywhere around me. To cover each one separately...
Equipment: Expect to pay roughly double what you do online. Why? Because any LFS owner knows that people buy equipment in pet stores for three reasons:
1) They have so much money that they don't care about what the equipment costs.
There are lots of people in this hobby who don't care about the fun of the hobby, but for the decoration. They are willing to pay top dollar, and don't care about the research or the best price. Don't flame them, to each their own.
2) They are desperate.
Supply and demand.
3) They want the extra knowledge, personal attention, and assistance that comes along with anything you purchase from a specialized retailer.
Livestock: Expect to pay 50% to 100% more than you would online. Why?
1. Because the shipping costs you pay when you order online (even here when you think about it) have already been absorbed by the owner.
2. Because LFSs generally have higher return rates on their guarantees because neophyte hobbiests buy locally and kill lots of fish, piling onto the overhead.
3. Because LFSs are generally more inland, driving the shipping costs from the importers up significantly
4. Because LFSs almost never can buy in as much quantity as a large online store such as this site, Please do not post other stores or links.
Overall, it also costs more to operate a brick and mortar store than it does to operate an online site. Fish stores are one of the most expensive to set up, riskiest, and most expensive to operate businesses out there. Generally, LFSs have to have at least several large show systems, costing sometimes tens of thousands each, plus lease, utilities, taxes, etc, all a consequence of the end-all-be-all factor, location, that online sites don't necessarily have to worry about. I know one major online site is based in Rhinelander, WI, and for those of us who have ever been there, it's not exactly the type of town where you'd expect to find an ritzy LFS, but it's certainly cheap to operate a business there. Bottom line, an LFS owner KNOWS he can't compete with online, so he isn't going to try. I know my closest LFS owner very well, and he knows I'll never buy equipment from him and almost never buy fish, he knows why, and he is cool with that.
Your LFS owner isn't ripping you off, he's just a guy selling you a product for what you were obviously willing to pay for it.

 

[yote]

Those prices are about average around here.I figure that by the time I pay for shipping that im still spending as much money,so why not just go to the LFS where I can actually see the fish or coral and make my own selection. Just my 2 cents worth.

 

[mikeyfishy]

Thanks for the input. I don't feel quite as bad I guess. I'm not really complaining about the fish prices because I'm willing to pay more for healthier stock and his "stay alive" guarantee. The thing that really hit me hard was him marking those SeaClone 150's up almost 2x! No amount of rambling here is going to convince me he paid more than $95 for those things and maybe $10 for shipping. He only keeps one or two in the store. He's no different than any of us who can order one just about anywhere online for less than 100 bucks. I searched online for the highest price I could find and it was $119 and there are at least a dozen places below $100. So why is he charging $179? He's only buying ones/twos so there's no excuse why he'd have to pay more than online prices (we don't, so he wouldn't either). With shipping, there's no way that thing cost him more than $120 to his door even if he paid for express shipping on one unit. Then he marks it up another 60 bucks? Doesn't seem right to me, and his lie about not being able to get them cheap doesn't cut it because anyone anywhere can order online. He's certainly not paying any more than we would if we ordered online: <$100.
Mike

 

[steelgluer]

Originally Posted by mikeyfishy
Thanks for the input. I don't feel quite as bad I guess. I'm not really complaining about the fish prices because I'm willing to pay more for healthier stock and his "stay alive" guarantee. The thing that really hit me hard was him marking those SeaClone 150's up almost 2x! No amount of rambling here is going to convince me he paid more than $95 for those things and maybe $10 for shipping. He only keeps one or two in the store. He's no different than any of us who can order one just about anywhere online for less than 100 bucks. I searched online for the highest price I could find and it was $119 and there are at least a dozen places below $100. So why is he charging $179? He's only buying ones/twos so there's no excuse why he'd have to pay more than online prices (we don't, so he wouldn't either). With shipping, there's no way that thing cost him more than $120 to his door even if he paid for express shipping on one unit. Then he marks it up another 60 bucks? Doesn't seem right to me, and his lie about not being able to get them cheap doesn't cut it because anyone anywhere can order online. He's certainly not paying any more than we would if we ordered online: <$100.
Mike
He charged you 179.00. He paid 59.00.

 

[jasonmarc]

Mike - many moons ago when I worked at a small mom-and-pop pet store, livestock was marked up 300% and dry goods were marked up 50% from distributor prices.
With that in mind, if he's paying around $120 for a skimmer and selling it for $179, it sounds about in line with what (at least used to be) industry-accepted practices.....
Jason

 

[peckhead]

***** has all that stuff much cheaper

 

[nailer]

Another advantage doing business with LSF, is that most will be more accountable for what they sell, equipment wise. I could have save nearly 700 on my entire setup online, however since i have dealt with the local guy he's there to replace it in a heartbeat.

 

[jeeperrs]

Before you get really upset with him you have to understand what it is to run a small business. Almost EVERY business marks their product up about double what they pay. It is just what has to be done to pay rent, electric, employees. Just think if he had only one employee who made 10,000 a year and he doubled what he bought for everything in the store it would take $10,000 in product sales just to pay for one employee to live in poverty and replace the product that was sold. Small business is hard so don't think he is ripping you off, he is just trying to stay in business and feed his family.
If we should be mad at anyone it is the places we eat out at. I know of several places that charge 15 bucks for a plate when it only cost them 3...... and those movie theaters.... ***) that is getting ripped off.

 

[vpotts28]

I am setting up my first salt FO tank, and was recommended by this forum, to purchase a coralife super skimmer 65. After looking at prices here (not in stock), and on the web, the price range seemed to be around $75-$85 for this product. I went into my lfs yesterday, and they were trying to sell it at $179. I quickly walked out of the store.

 

[mikeyfishy]

I hear you. I own a successful small business myself and have been in business for over 10 years. He has no employees. It's just he and his wife running the place. His problem is he doesn't get much foot traffic where he is and he has to mark things up (unreasonably IMO) to stay in business. If I were in his shoes, I'd take steps so that I don't have to overcharge to stay in business because eventually, his overpricing will run him out of business. One of the most difficult things to do in small business is to market your products properly, maximizing income based on number of customers and price. IMHO, he's got it wrong.
Mike

 

[acrylic51]

Around me here in PA those prices are way outta line......Shop and compare would be my best advice on equipment.........You'll usually find a little better deal on equipment, and what I do is compare what it would cost me local vs. ordering online, and what shipping would be......That's how I make my decision.....Fish and coral.......I'd pay more local since you get to see them first hand, but the clown prices and tang prices you listed are outrageous, but again it really depends on his buying power as well.

 

[stanlalee]

I must be lucky cause except for liverock which is 3x more expensive local even after shipping everything else is pretty much cheaper than buying online once you factor in shipping. powder brown tank $35 online $39 at the local "super" pet store (those huge independently owned ones everybody locally says "man you've got to check....put your mega store here.....out). Eibli Angel $28 online, I paid $21 at a local chain pet world where it sat for at least 3wks unsold (typical rinky dink pet store that has a branch in every town). Aqualine 175w MH bulbs $69 online $76 local aquarium specialist (store that does nothing but aquatics, is owned and run by marine biologist and have their own section of the store you cant see that is just for propogating their own corals). these are the last three things I've purchased from distinctly different types of pet stores and all cheaper than online once shipping is factored in (and sometimes before shipping). Basically I only use online for what I cant find locally.
Here I think its competition driven. If prices are off one place its never more than a 5-20 minute drive to the next pet store.

 

[cowfishrule]

Originally Posted by mikeyfishy
So why is he charging $179?

because he can you and bought it.
if everybody knew to buy equip online either A: he wouldnt sell it, or B: he wouldnt sell it for 179 because he knows he'll never move it.
hey- he's got to make a living too.