silverado61
Well-Known Member
Just put the shrimp in a piece of nylon to make it easy to remove when the spike hits. I wouldn't use ammonia unless your experienced.
Snake's Guide to Cycling
- Thread starter snakeblitz33
- Start date
bang guy
Moderator
I've always just used fish food. It's more precise than a large piece of shrimp. For me, the idea is to create a small steady supply of ammonia. As long as there is a measurable amount of ammonia the bacteria are not food limited.
snakeblitz33
Well-Known Member
When I say shrimp tail, I mean the portion of the tail that sometimes doesn't come out when your peeling it to eat. A small piece.
Then again, over the years, ghost feeding like Guy said may be the best alternative to the raw shrimp tail method.
Then again, over the years, ghost feeding like Guy said may be the best alternative to the raw shrimp tail method.
bang guy
Moderator
Shrimp tails seem perfect for medium to large tanks. I think most people plop in an entire shrimp though. I like the idea of shrimp tails. Just save a bunch & freeze them from a shrimp dinner. Plop on in once every day or two. That should work. It might be too much for the smaller tanks though.
Bryce E
Active Member
Yeah, like Snake said you just need the presence of ammonia to get everything started... there are multiple ways of doing this but the raw shrimp method is cheap, easy and used by a lot of people. I also like to add bottled bacteria to me new systems to speed things along. In my newest tank I'm using Microbacter7. I also use it in my established tanks if I'm doing a very large water change.
Good article snake-in-the-tank
Good article snake-in-the-tank
snakeblitz33
Well-Known Member
Lol.
MB7 is used by a lot of people these days. I've never really been a fan of bottled bacteria but I think I am going to try it with the new tank.
MB7 is used by a lot of people these days. I've never really been a fan of bottled bacteria but I think I am going to try it with the new tank.
2014FishKiller
Member
I have five fish (3 clowns and 2 tangs), seven corals, and few inverts, now my tank have brown algae for about a week, two days ago the brown algae starts to disappear, but this morning I get more brown algae on top of sands, rocks, and glass, some of the brown algae now start to change to green color, but my tank was cycling last April with shrimp format.
After read your article I tested my water again, it still prefect, the Nitrates is between 0 to 0.25 PPM. Question: Will brown or green algae will hurt my fish or corals. How can I take care of ALGAE.
After read your article I tested my water again, it still prefect, the Nitrates is between 0 to 0.25 PPM. Question: Will brown or green algae will hurt my fish or corals. How can I take care of ALGAE.
bang guy
Moderator
I'm not following the connection between a large water change and adding bottled bacteria. Can you elaborate a bit on that?
Bryce E
Active Member
Just that when I do a large water change (50% or more) every 6 months or so or when I clean the sand bed I think it helps to give the beneficial bacteria a boost after removing so much of the water. I have no scientific information to provide in order to back it up its just something that I do after adding that much new water to the system. Or anytime I'm adding a bunch of new livestock increasing the bio load rapidly on the tank. I haven't ever experienced any major re-cycling or spikes in my parameters after a major water change of 50% or even as high as 80% and that could be why... although I'm not certain.
But since we are on the topic of bottled bacteria I have recently come across a short video on the subject that those of you reading this thread may find interesting and it will likely be the next product that I try.
http://www.mrsaltwatertank.com/bacteria-in-a-bottle-snake-oil-or-worth-trusting/
But since we are on the topic of bottled bacteria I have recently come across a short video on the subject that those of you reading this thread may find interesting and it will likely be the next product that I try.
http://www.mrsaltwatertank.com/bacteria-in-a-bottle-snake-oil-or-worth-trusting/
silverado61
Well-Known Member
There are no beneficial bacteria in water. It's all in the rocks and sand. When you "clean" your sand, you're removing that beneficial bacteria. You should never have to clean your sand. The bacteria in sand and rock is what helps keep the natural balance. Only in freshwater tanks do you clean the sand. The link you posted to the 16min 23sec video is Dr. Tim selling his own product. How much money do you think "Mr. Saltwater Tank" is making off the sale of Dr. Tim's merchandise? Especially at $25 for a 4oz bottle?
I'll admit, I used to watch all of mrsaltwatertank.com's videos. Till I noticed that in most of his videos he's trying to sell someone else's product. Or his own books.
Even though it's a closed system, saltwater aquariums should be kept as chemical free as possible. I think it's just playing with fire.
There are people here who could explain it better than I could. Snakblitz is one of them. People that have more years of experience than Mr. Saltwater Tank is old. Sorry Seth, you are not one of those.
Rule of thumb, 1 fish at a time, every couple of months. Not a bunch at a time. My 72g build has been up and running almost 6mths now and I've got a grand total of (drum roll please) 2 fish. It'll probably be a few more months before I add the last fish I'm going to add. I'm more into the oddball invert pets. The only chemicals I add are trace elements and those are replenished through water changes.
That's why cycling your tank should be kept chemical free. There is no "beat all cure in a bottle" to speed up the cycling process.
I'll admit, I used to watch all of mrsaltwatertank.com's videos. Till I noticed that in most of his videos he's trying to sell someone else's product. Or his own books.
Even though it's a closed system, saltwater aquariums should be kept as chemical free as possible. I think it's just playing with fire.
There are people here who could explain it better than I could. Snakblitz is one of them. People that have more years of experience than Mr. Saltwater Tank is old. Sorry Seth, you are not one of those.
Rule of thumb, 1 fish at a time, every couple of months. Not a bunch at a time. My 72g build has been up and running almost 6mths now and I've got a grand total of (drum roll please) 2 fish. It'll probably be a few more months before I add the last fish I'm going to add. I'm more into the oddball invert pets. The only chemicals I add are trace elements and those are replenished through water changes.
That's why cycling your tank should be kept chemical free. There is no "beat all cure in a bottle" to speed up the cycling process.
Last edited:
snakeblitz33
Well-Known Member
Not what,... Old? Lol
Anyhoo, no one person is right. No one knows it all. I still try to learn every day and ask questions.
Stirring up a shallow sandbed to shake loose some detritus may not be a bad thing. Bacteria are 1000x smaller then the smallest eukaryotic cell and you can't suck them all out during a water change. Lol. However, adding bacteria to a tank may add diversity and genetic diversity that your tank may lack without it. Increasing the diversity of primary organisms in the tank can only increase the stability of the system. As far as I know,...
Not every system is the same. Not every method is perfect. Not every aquarist has the same philosophy of fish/reef keeping. What matters to me is to understand the science behind the reason and then experiment to find the best method that suits my tanks personality.
What I'm saying is, it works for him and he has had a good experience with it. He has been testing it and found that his tank hasn't gone through any mini-cycles because he temporarily boosted the bacteria in the tank.
Anyhoo, no one person is right. No one knows it all. I still try to learn every day and ask questions.
Stirring up a shallow sandbed to shake loose some detritus may not be a bad thing. Bacteria are 1000x smaller then the smallest eukaryotic cell and you can't suck them all out during a water change. Lol. However, adding bacteria to a tank may add diversity and genetic diversity that your tank may lack without it. Increasing the diversity of primary organisms in the tank can only increase the stability of the system. As far as I know,...
Not every system is the same. Not every method is perfect. Not every aquarist has the same philosophy of fish/reef keeping. What matters to me is to understand the science behind the reason and then experiment to find the best method that suits my tanks personality.
What I'm saying is, it works for him and he has had a good experience with it. He has been testing it and found that his tank hasn't gone through any mini-cycles because he temporarily boosted the bacteria in the tank.
silverado61
Well-Known Member
Good point. And your right, there is no real right or wrong way unless it has adverse affects on your individual system. This hobby is one big learning curve that still has its growing pains. We learn by trial and error (experimenting) and we become aware of different methods by researching other hobbyists results and experiences and then deciding what to implement ourselves.
And I stand by my opinion of Mr. Saltwater Fish. In his early days it was all about making other aquarists aware of the options in the hobby. I liked him. I'd be lying if I said I didn't learn something from him. But these days he's become too commercialized by promoting companies products. I don't want to be sold something. I want to learn something.
And yes, you are young. But not too young to know what your talking about. Which is one of the reasons I like this site so much. The wealth of knowledge and experience that can be gleaned from the saltwater fish.com forums is awesome.
And I stand by my opinion of Mr. Saltwater Fish. In his early days it was all about making other aquarists aware of the options in the hobby. I liked him. I'd be lying if I said I didn't learn something from him. But these days he's become too commercialized by promoting companies products. I don't want to be sold something. I want to learn something.
And yes, you are young. But not too young to know what your talking about. Which is one of the reasons I like this site so much. The wealth of knowledge and experience that can be gleaned from the saltwater fish.com forums is awesome.
snakeblitz33
Well-Known Member
Yeah, I met the guy. He was actually very quiet and reserved from what I observed. I know he knows a lot about the hobby and have seen a few videos, but after you cover the basics and a lot of the advanced techniques, then your left with talking about different fish and corals and products. Unfortunately, advertising products pays more than discussing fish or corals in any scientific detail.
Bryce E
Active Member
I know that there's probably not much bacteria in the water column however I do believe there are some floating around. But I don't really consider it to be "adding chemicals" I do it to help aid in keeping the bacteria stable. I may be adding it unnecessarily... but if it's not doing me much good I also don't think it's causing any harm either. And I do not often mess with the sand beds in my tanks, just a couple of times a year or when the surface starts to get ugly I like to give it a stirring. I have heard/read that you can release gases into your tank so that's also why I do a large water change anytime I do that as well as trying to remove extra detritus and algae from my tank all in one shot. I do plan on getting sand sifters to do this work regularly like sand sifting stars and gobies but currently my hermit crabs, emerald crabs and snails don't do enough of the work for me not to want to touch it every once in a great while. And I totally agree with the endorsement stuff you touched on... Life is sales right? I don't believe everything that I read or watch or hear... mostly I like to experience things for myself. I liked a couple of the things I saw and heard in the video that I thought made sense which is why I'll be trying it out and seeing for myself. I also thought that him doing an actual experiment with the results was a nice touch... (endorsement or not). I'd like to thank you guys for talking about it though. And I'm glad I became a member here, I have gotten so much help over the years on forums like these. It's nice to talk to other people in the hobby and share with one another.
silverado61
Well-Known Member
Gobies are the best. Careful with sea stars. They're voracious eaters and could clean the sandbed so good they start to starve. I've heard they do best with a 150g and a 6 inch sandbed at least.
pegasus
Well-Known Member
Nitrifying (beneficial) bacteria lives in the substrate (rock and sand). Free floating bacteria gets removed by the skimmer (if used), so if there is any floating in the water column, it's miniscule. Unless the rocks and/or sand have been exposed to air or harsh chemicals, the bacteria is always present. Agitating the sand bed will release some into the water column, but the majority will be clinging to the grains of sand. Deep stirring of the sand bed is a different story if you have a deep sand bed. The anaerobic bacteria that consumes nitrate will be exposed to oxygen laden water, which will kill it. This can cause a problem in the tank, and then yes, a large water change would be needed. A light stirring in the upper layer of sand will release some detritus, and a small portion of the aerobic bacteria, but not enough to make an impact on the biofilter system. Adding a bacteria booster to a mature system will basically result in a lot of bacterial die-off, as the new bacteria won't have enough to eat to survive. Just my 2c...
pegasus
Well-Known Member
I have a 5" sand sifting sea star in my 125 with a 3" sand bed. It's been in the tank for well over 2 years, and it's fat as a horse. A very healthy horse. I also have one in my fairly young 40B. I monitor the sand in the 40B to make sure there are plenty of worms in the bed, and it's growing like a weed. This is in conjunction with a diamond goby and a pair of 9" engineer gobies. The sand is constantly turned over, but I still find lots of "tunnels" along the edges of the glass.
Nassarius snails are excellent sand sifters, and if you need something larger, the fighting conch is an excellent choice. They will keep the sandbed clean, as well as un-compacted. Cerith snails burrow under the sand during the day, so they help keep the sand loosened.