speaking of lucky to be near the beach...

adee

Member
Tonight we set up a 10gal nano using ocean water and sand, my husband collected both on an incoming tide. We havnt had a nano in awhile and dont plan to really put any fish in it accept maybe one false percula clown, I plan to make it a coral tank with a nice clean up crew. We decided at 10pm tonight to make the drive, and i just removed some rock from our established 125, hehehe!! Pics to come tomorrow.
Water parameters in the fresh saltwater are:
1.023 salinity
ph 8.2
nitrate: 0
ammonia: 0
nitrite: 0
I really dont expect it to need to have a cycle as the tank literally is set up using everything established. There are some tiny thread like worms floating around in the water and a few little creatures (i have seen them for sale here will get technical name soon)
 

skate020

Member
why not get 2 false percs?
can still have as many CUC and as many corals and it makes the tank looks more, bright and so on.
 

btldreef

Moderator
Originally Posted by skate020
http:///forum/post/3175435
why not get 2 false percs?
can still have as many CUC and as many corals and it makes the tank looks more, bright and so on.
Okay, I have to say this because it's become a pet-peeve of mine. There is no such thing as a false percula. A False percula clownfish is an Ocellaris clownfish.
 

skate020

Member
yeh i know i just CBA to spell ocellaris wrong lols,
BTLD i got a clown today for the 10g:D:D:D:D:D:D
its a true perc, about 1.5" long and already has full black on it! i love it, only got one tho, gna wait for another one to be like that and come in then get it.
will make sure its smaller tho :D
sorry to jack the thread for that lil bit lols.
 

new2salt1

Member
Originally Posted by BTLDreef
http:///forum/post/3175436
Okay, I have to say this because it's become a pet-peeve of mine. There is no such thing as a false percula. A False percula clownfish is an Ocellaris clownfish.
From the ORA website:
"False Percula Clownfish- (Amphiprion ocellaris) - Generally, most False Perculas are bright orange with 3 complete white stripes. A black line borders these stripes. A.ocellaris does not have a thick black margin around the white bars like True Perculas usually do."
Whether you like the nomenclature is probably irrelevant since most people in the hobby distinguish perculas and ocellaris by the names "true perc" and "false perc," respectively.
 

new2salt1

Member
Originally Posted by skate020
http:///forum/post/3175435
why not get 2 false percs?
can still have as many CUC and as many corals and it makes the tank looks more, bright and so on.

why not get 2 false perc? I have a good reason! Because it's a 10 gallon tank! ding ding ding!
 

btldreef

Moderator
Originally Posted by New2Salt1
http:///forum/post/3175485
why not get 2 false perc? I have a good reason! Because it's a 10 gallon tank! ding ding ding!
It can be done if you're on top of your water quality and water changes and there are no other fish in the tank. It works better if they have an anemone as well. I definitely wouldn't recommend it for anyone completely new to this hobby (or people putting straight ocean water and sand in their tanks). I hate LFS's that tell people new to this hobby that they can put a clown in an 8G. That's just irresponsible. I've kept two in a 14G BioCube with just a baby green clown goby and I'm considering doing it again, this time with a yasha goby/pistol shrimp pair, although I might just do one B&W Ocellaris to be safe.
What people don't realize is with a reef, if you have a 10G tank, by the time you put sand, rock and corals in there, it's not 10G of water anymore. It's more like 7G if you're lucking and that's a lot for two fish that will grow to be 3-4" a piece. A fish only 10G tank can handle two clowns if you're on top of your water quality and don't add anything else and you lightly stock LR, if at all.
 

adee

Member
Were not *brand* new to this hobby and yes, I can show photos of the test kit that did show the water was perfect, the same test kit that tests my 125 and the very same kit my LFS's all use. Water when taken on an incoming tide (and sand when taken from deep enough) is safe to put in a tank, more than anything it was an experiment for our pleasure to see what the water quality would be. By the end of a month or so with frequent water changes the "natural" saltwater would be pretty diluted down to near none existant amounts anyway, where do you think they get our "natural" seawater down here? I know for a FACT the stores we use have their water collected from off our coasts by a boat, pumped in, transported to the store, lightly filtered (in some stores they dont even do that, its literally pumped into a holding chamber) and sold. We have had more problems purchasing synthetic saltwater from Big Al's then we have at mom and pop shops that have "natural" seawater. Besides its not like were throwing fish in it tonight anyway.
We have a 125 that has never seen sand collected off our coast but was filled using natural seawater with only occasional synthetic water changes and with the exception of a minor leak related to install, some diatoms that were corrected with light cycles being shortened and better water flow we have had literally no problems with that tank so please don't use an "irresponsible" tone on this thread as though Im being irresponsible or stupid with what were doing, again its a filtering tank with rock and thats it at this time. As for fish size, I could easily put a tiny hippo tang in it if I wanted to as I have the tank to put it in when it gets large enough but no where in my post did I say that was my plan for this tank.
The tank was sitting around collecting dust so we pulled it out and set it up, no harm no foul.
 

skate020

Member
95% of all fish stores use their own R/O water with salt and decent filtration?
they wouldnt risk putting in unknown diseases into their tanks
 

new2salt1

Member
ADEE, don't get me wrong, Im not saying ocean water is unhealthy or unfit for our tanks. Just because there are nitrates doesn't mean it's unhealthy. In fact, marinebiology.org says ALL ocean water has some amounts of nitrates.
And Im sure the brand of the test kit is good. Maybe the drops are old though? Or maybe the color chart is unclear? Im just saying...there is more concentrated die-off, decay, and pollution in coastal water than any other part of the ocean, so for a kit to read 0 amm, trite, and trates is hard to conceive. Here in Jersey we have gulls pooping up and down our beaches, people making messes, corporate pollution, skate/horseshoe crabs dying everywhere in the surf, baitballs caught in the shallows, predator fish eating, pooping...etc. I can't believe that our coastal waters are healthy enough to cycle all that death and decay in to zero readings.
 

adee

Member
Originally Posted by New2Salt1
http:///forum/post/3175706
ADEE, don't get me wrong, Im not saying ocean water is unhealthy or unfit for our tanks. Just because there are nitrates doesn't mean it's unhealthy. In fact, marinebiology.org says ALL ocean water has some amounts of nitrates.
And Im sure the brand of the test kit is good. Maybe the drops are old though? Or maybe the color chart is unclear? Im just saying...there is more concentrated die-off, decay, and pollution in coastal water than any other part of the ocean, so for a kit to read 0 amm, trite, and trates is hard to conceive. Here in Jersey we have gulls pooping up and down our beaches, people making messes, corporate pollution, skate/horseshoe crabs dying everywhere in the surf, baitballs caught in the shallows, predator fish eating, pooping...etc. I can't believe that our coastal waters are healthy enough to cycle all that death and decay in to zero readings.
The test kit is practically new, only about 3-4mos old. I dont doubt that the ocean is a mess, I believe you in that but what I will say is I do know for a fact we have plenty of stores (five of which i can think of off the top of my head) that use water right off our coasts with no problems, its gotten to a point when we walk in we ask what kind of water the stores use because we have found so many that do use local water. Im not sure if its because of cost (convenient its right here) or what but they do use it and sell it at around $0.60 a gallon, if it was *that* bad or caused that many problems/complaints multiple stores wouldnt do it... I dont suggest going to the beach while there are a million people swimming, urinating, exc and filling your buckets and come home.. what we did was slightly different. We did it on an incoming tide (best water by comparison) late at night and we went to an unpopulated beach, went waist deep and filled the jug. I certainly wouldnt recommend everyone do this by any stretch of the imagination but its a neat experiment to do on an otherwise empty tank, its not like im dooming an entire collection of fish/corals/inverts/ to execution via pollution... aside from the natural livestock that came in the water/sand and from my established live rock there is nothing else in it... to be completely honest with you there have been plenty of times I have caught little shrimp, hermit crabs, exc and dropped them in my tank when we got home and still have a good number of them. Its not the smartest thing to do but it can be done... and some places smarter than others to do it, such as cape lighthouse that doesnt have people swimming its not your "usual" beach that would be a wonderful place to collect, lord knows there are enough people snorkeling right there and collecting, even though its illegal! (for the record we do not collect there, we go further down the coast where its legal to do so) Our friend collects a TON of fish and various live stock throughout the year for the Miami Seaquarium collection and has brought me pork fish for my tank in the past.. its all in where you go I think.
I would happily take photos of the test kit and results off that tank without hesitation.
ETA: the miami seaquarium is on an OPEN SYSTEM and they arent even on an open ocean, they are on more of an intercoastal where there are boats, jet skies, exc passing by... want to talk about pollution! Their sharks, sea turtles, dolphins, exc are all on an open system, their water is pulled directly into their tanks.
http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/fo...ami+seaquarium
the photos in this link are one of the shark keepers at MSQ talking about their open system
http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/fo...&highlight=msq
perfect collection place
 

jazztap10

Member
if the water was collected at low tide shouldn't it be quite low in nitrates?
maybe not if it was obtained during high tide, since there is so much decay on the intertidal zone from a day in the sun.
 

btldreef

Moderator
Well, firstly, you didn't exactly explain that you wouldn't recommend others doing this. You kind of made it sound like, "Hey, save some money, just go to the beach."
Anyways, what we're saying about your test kit is that it's off. Even if you only bought it three months ago, you have no idea how old the chemicals are. There's just NO WAY the nitrates are zero.
Secondly, if you're only waste deep in water, you're still in polluted water.
Even if the beach was deserted, coastal water is full of pollutants, its all the same, water travels around the coast so the people urinating in the beach water 1mile away, their urinating in the water you just put in your tank as well.
Not for nothing, it rained down there earlier this week (I have a ton of family and friends in Southern Florida) which means the coastal water should have been even more polluted from runoff. So again, nitrates being zero, no.
 

adee

Member
well, seeing that you don't personally live down here you cant tell me where it rained and where it didn't. I live down here and can tell you that it DID NOT rain this week. I'm not sure where your friends and family live but Florida is a pretty large state, south Florida still doesn't begin to narrow it down, which coast are they on, East or West? None the less even if they are in Okechobee that's a good distance away and their "run off" rain water (and i don't even know that it rained up there) would be much more diluted then if it had summer time poured right on our beach. We have no problem with purchasing water and sand at all so I don't appreciate your comment about saving money, no where in my post did it say we were saving money but rather doing an experiment on an EMPTY tank. Seeing as the last times I said I don't suggest taking water from the beach wasn't good enough.
I DO NOT SUGGEST TAKING WATER FROM YOUR BEACH FOR YOUR PERSONAL FISH TANK EVEN THOUGH LOCAL STORES SELL IT.
There, happy? Continue doubting me all you want, your opinion means nothing to me. and my husband was in *waist* deep water, not waste deep water... just saying. I know what the test says, I know that it has read my 125 accurately in the past and I don't doubt that it is reading it accurately now... would you doubt me even if the LFS tested it and said the water was fine? It still doesn't explain why the MSQ uses an OPEN system, meaning water is flowing directly into their tanks from the intercoastal, if its so bad why are their SHARKS, more delicate than most fish thriving?
 

btldreef

Moderator
Whatever. I would NOT do this, EVER, and I would never recommend someone else doing this, even if you had the prettiest tank in the world. It's just irresponsible to but animals through that. I don't even like purchasing wild fish.
 

evasquez

New Member
Get off the womans case! She is doing a fun experiment. My dad has done this with water from the nasty Texas gulf coast water. He lives in Corpus Christi, TX and has a gulf coast 29 gallon with 29 sump. He caught 2 sea horses in oso bay which is a gross bay we fish in and used sand, rock and water all from there. Got the water in the morning high tide and everything was fine... Fish do live in the ocean...no where in her first post did she say anything about suggesting any to do it or anything like that. she said she and her husband were doin a fun experiment. You do not have to try this experiment but you also do not have to poop on her parade. I came to this forum because another forum did this to me. Continue with you experiment! I wish I was back on the coast! Im stuck here in kansas with no fishing and limited LFS'
 
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