Squid ~Pump Question

coryherb

coryherb

Member
I see your point..that is a lot of random flow. So, to make sure I understand, your saying the entire closed loop should be under the waterline. So would essentially have 5 bulkheads on the closed loop. The only change that would make to the plan I was drawing is that I would need 90 degree angles on all the 4 outlets where they cross the tank. Not a big deal I don't think.
I think if I did that I would go with two 180 revs on the middle two and have the outside ones just point over the coral toward the middle of the tank. That sounds like I would need a rather large pump to give a decent amount of flow per outlet? However if I use one of the other diaphrams for the OM that do opposites or something it would give each nozel more flow. I think I see.
 
coryherb

coryherb

Member
actually...if you think it would be good to run a seaswirl on the sump return to the middle of the tank..I wouldn't need those revs. Just let the OM stagger the outflow to nozzels.
 
squidd

squidd

Active Member
That's a viable option as well...
My thought's would be save the bucks...let the sump return (Clean water/center) be "drawn" into the C/L intake (center lower) and then the C/L distributes "somewhat" cleaner water through 4 outlets "stratigicly placed" and then is drawn out to sump/fuge by two corner overflows...:thinking:
Either is fine...
 
coryherb

coryherb

Member
saving bucks is a good thing so very interested in what you mean..but rereading it a few times I am lost.
What do you mean let the sump return be drawn into. Are you saying the sump return drives the OM?
 
squidd

squidd

Active Member
Nope..the sump return "outlet" rather than blowing out into the tank with the Sea Swirl is placed "near" the C/L intake (two seperate systems) so the water "near" the C/L intake is "relatively" cleaner" and is distributed by the C/L system...
It's a very minor point because all the water will get mixed and rotated eventually with either set up...
 
squidd

squidd

Active Member
I would suggest the sump return be run OTT to gain an "anti-siphon" hole effect to keep from draining the tank in a power out situation..
 
coryherb

coryherb

Member
okay..yea I saw that picture in the other thread. So have the outlet to the closed loop under that somewhere. If I do that does the return still count toward the flow? And that brings us back to pump size, and Model I guess. Don't know much about the pumps. spmnarciso suggested a sequence hammerhead for the external because it is quiet. That is a bonus in my book. Leaning toward a mag 18 for the return pump. But I understand there is a balance to maintain between overflows and the return pump. I don't get how that works. Am I jumping ahead?
 
squidd

squidd

Active Member
If I do that does the return still count toward the flow?
Ohhhh..."Tricky" question, but technicly yes...because the same amount of water that enters in the "return" has to leave through the overflows...so it has to "travel" across the tank...
And not all the water from the return will be taking the "shortcut" to the C/L intake...
Am I jumping ahead?
Nope, but your looking at two different areas here so let's take one at a time...
Looking back through the threads here..we're looking at 1000-1200 through the sump...and the rest from the C/L...
As the sump number is rather "fixed" due to overflow restrictions, let's start with that...
Figuring the sump "under tank" (as opposed to basement or the next room....tell me if different) the pump will have to "lift" water about 4 1/2' to 5' (let's call it 5'...) and will go through a couple 90* elbows to get into the tank OTT...
You will want the "actual" amount of flow from the pump to be slightly less than the "actual" amount the overflow can take out, so you don't overfill your tank...
The "rating on the overflow and the "actual" amount it can take out is similar because it's a "drain"...
The "actual" amount the pump returns to the tank and the rating on the pump will be different , because we need to account for flow "losses" going uphill and through elbows...
So in your case the Mag 18 pumping through 1" line...5' up...with 2 -90* elbows will "actually" deliver ~1040pgh and a good match for your overflows...(1115 -4' still safe)
If you go to 1 1/4" line it will push 1174 and that's cutting it close, especially if your slightly less than 5' head...at 4' you'll get 1261 and a wet floor...
So I think the Mag 18 is a good choice for this application, and a very reliable pump... (although "some" may dissagree)
So there's 1000-1100 gph from the S/F return..
How much "more" do you want from the C/L and did you settle on the OM 4-Way, yes/no Revs for your system...?
 
coryherb

coryherb

Member
If shooting for 30x..that leaves ~3400. I am not sure on the revolutions now. If I go with one of the alternating drums for the 4 way it seems not as necessary to use the revolutions. But if you think I should..it is pretty easy to add them in.
 
squidd

squidd

Active Member
If shooting for 30x..that leaves ~3400.
180X30 = 5400...- 1100= 4300 to go...:thinking: :)
Let's shoot for that...Let's figure without the revs for now, and I'll get you a flow restriction if you add them later...
Give me a minute or two here to check out the Sequence pumps/ratings/flows/etc... and I'll get back to you...
 
coryherb

coryherb

Member
was also looking at the dophin aqua sea amps. Although sequence has some slightly used pumps with 3 year warranties that are a lot cheaper.
 
squidd

squidd

Active Member
That was a tough one to find the tech info I need for calcs...
But, (much will depend on your "actual" plumbing layout) I'm coming up with 4500-4700 gph through 1 1/2" line with 4-5 90* elbows to reach tank...
That would be an "average" flow through any one outlet and using "flex-line" to eliminate elbows would bring that up a "little"...
Still within reason for your "Goal Flow" from C/L system and would put you at ~31-32 X turnover...
And that gives you a little "playing" room if you want to add revs down the line...
 
coryherb

coryherb

Member
looks like the dolphin amp master 4700 or the sequence 5000/5800 would work. Wonder if that particular line of sequence pumps are as quiet. They look like for ponds.
 
coryherb

coryherb

Member
going to go with the dolphin amp master 4700 unless you say otherwise. Now I have a questions on the sump. Is the described set up as listed above okay? I don't get how to set up the overflow from the fuge to the middle return section of the sump. Doesn't seem like just a baffel would be the best way if I ever want to dump a picked on fish into it for a while.
thanks for all the help squidd.
 
coryherb

coryherb

Member
actually now that I think about it..a baffel wouldn't work at all. And anything that just flows over a wall would create bubbles. HELP!
 
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