Sump&Refuge Sump - Design Critique
- Thread starter foxthorn
- Start date
foxthorn
Member
Juggernaut... Yes, thanks for the ideas. BTW I used Viso to do this sketch.
Do you think it would be worth taking another 1.5" away from the fuge to add in another baffel??
My other thought is moving the skimmer out of the sump in order to make the refug portion larger. I haven't decided on a skimmer yet and some of them are quite large - not sure if 8" will be enough room.
Do you think it would be worth taking another 1.5" away from the fuge to add in another baffel??
My other thought is moving the skimmer out of the sump in order to make the refug portion larger. I haven't decided on a skimmer yet and some of them are quite large - not sure if 8" will be enough room.
johnnysalt
Member
foxthorn:
looks alot like mine too...
.....one thing I would not bother doing is putting a divider to the left of the skimmer....imo/e it is just not necessary. i agree with juggernaut......check out my diagram in my sig as to how I did the input to my fuge.....it's about 2/3 of the way up from the bottom....my output is a couple inches from the top of the sump.
looks good btw!
John
looks alot like mine too...
.....one thing I would not bother doing is putting a divider to the left of the skimmer....imo/e it is just not necessary. i agree with juggernaut......check out my diagram in my sig as to how I did the input to my fuge.....it's about 2/3 of the way up from the bottom....my output is a couple inches from the top of the sump.looks good btw!
John
foxthorn
Member
Designing this thing in 2D I forgot that I've got depth to work with too! I see what you mean about the first divider. I'm going to take it out and move the skimmer over. I can always put in a small container of some sort for the overflow line to run into.
Now my first chamber is bigger... Do I put in another baffel for bubbles or make the fuge larger? Or some other idea? I haven't picked out a skimmer yet - how much room do you think I need?
Now my first chamber is bigger... Do I put in another baffel for bubbles or make the fuge larger? Or some other idea? I haven't picked out a skimmer yet - how much room do you think I need?
johnnysalt
Member
yeah...i'd make the fuge bigger then...definitely.
i guess about 6 wide just to be sure.
i guess about 6 wide just to be sure.
krux
Member
if i was you, i would place an elbow from the refuge down into the sump area where your return is so that the falling water does not create bubbles (and noise) right before it hits your pump for return to the tank. this is shown in red
also be sure you have some sort of screen to keep algae and critters from plugging up your outflow... think similar to what is on your powerheads. this mesh/cage should extend above the level of where you want the water line, so that if something happens to slow down the flow, the water level can rise a bit and still flow out without the chance of damaging livestock. if you look online for resellers of bulkheads, many of them will hae this basket included in the package. this is illustrated in blue.
overall its a really nice setup, i wish i had the time and tools to make something like that for myself.... my setup is much more simplistic and not nearly as neat and tidy.
also be sure you have some sort of screen to keep algae and critters from plugging up your outflow... think similar to what is on your powerheads. this mesh/cage should extend above the level of where you want the water line, so that if something happens to slow down the flow, the water level can rise a bit and still flow out without the chance of damaging livestock. if you look online for resellers of bulkheads, many of them will hae this basket included in the package. this is illustrated in blue.
overall its a really nice setup, i wish i had the time and tools to make something like that for myself.... my setup is much more simplistic and not nearly as neat and tidy.
bang guy
Moderator
I have a few minor suggestions. I believe it will work great as designed but...
1 - I would split the line coming from the tank to create the input to the fuge. That way all of the water going into the fuge comes directly from the tank. The problem with your setup is that the refugium critters will not get any detritus from the tank. The way you have it some of the water leaving the fuge is just pumped back into the fuge. And, the circulation in the display tank is reduced directly by the water diverted to the refuge.
Add a ball valve after the split to the refugium on the leg going to the skimmer. All of the water will want to fall straight down. The valve will allow you to force some of the water all the way over to the refugium.
2 - I would put the input to the fuge against the glass in the corner closest to the overflow out of the fuge and put an elbow and the bottom of it. I would have the elbow placed almost at sand level and pointing along the glass on the long side. This will create a circular current and allow the sandbed infauna to capture detritus coming from the tank and remove it for you.
3 - I would have 1/2" - 1" of live sand at the bottom of the Refugium.
Guy
1 - I would split the line coming from the tank to create the input to the fuge. That way all of the water going into the fuge comes directly from the tank. The problem with your setup is that the refugium critters will not get any detritus from the tank. The way you have it some of the water leaving the fuge is just pumped back into the fuge. And, the circulation in the display tank is reduced directly by the water diverted to the refuge.
Add a ball valve after the split to the refugium on the leg going to the skimmer. All of the water will want to fall straight down. The valve will allow you to force some of the water all the way over to the refugium.
2 - I would put the input to the fuge against the glass in the corner closest to the overflow out of the fuge and put an elbow and the bottom of it. I would have the elbow placed almost at sand level and pointing along the glass on the long side. This will create a circular current and allow the sandbed infauna to capture detritus coming from the tank and remove it for you.
3 - I would have 1/2" - 1" of live sand at the bottom of the Refugium.
Guy
marinemarty
Member
Hi Guy, Great ideas. I just have 2 questions. How much flow would you want going into the refuge? I see how you controll it with the ball valve going to the skimmer,but how much flow is ideal? Second why such a shallow bed for the refuge? Is this more beneficial than a 4-5" DSB in the refuge? Thanks
Martin
Martin
bang guy
Moderator
Good questions!
1 - it looks to be about 10 gallons. I would put anywhere from 20 - 80 gph through there. You want to get nutrients to the bed and any algae that's growing but you don't want to stir up the sand.
2 - Looking at the footprint of the refuge I think a DSB would be ineffective. Many of the small critters needed to move water to the deeper parts of the sand bed prefer to be several inches away from objects like the glass walls. This just doesn't leave any space for them to live in a small refuge. There are still a lot of worms that prefer walls but I believe the center of the DSB would be void of anything except for the top 1/2 - 1". I don't believe it would harm anything but it would waste space better used for Caulerpa of some other harvestable algae.
1 - it looks to be about 10 gallons. I would put anywhere from 20 - 80 gph through there. You want to get nutrients to the bed and any algae that's growing but you don't want to stir up the sand.
2 - Looking at the footprint of the refuge I think a DSB would be ineffective. Many of the small critters needed to move water to the deeper parts of the sand bed prefer to be several inches away from objects like the glass walls. This just doesn't leave any space for them to live in a small refuge. There are still a lot of worms that prefer walls but I believe the center of the DSB would be void of anything except for the top 1/2 - 1". I don't believe it would harm anything but it would waste space better used for Caulerpa of some other harvestable algae.
reef fool
Active Member
Originally posted by Bang Guy
I have two minor suggestions. I believe it will work great as designed but...
1 - I would split the line coming from the tank to create the input to the fuge. That way all of the water going into the fuge came directly from the tank. The problem with your setup is that the refugium critters will not get any detritus from the tank. The way you have it some of the water leaving the fuge is just pumped back into the fuge. And, the way you have it will significantly reduce the water circulation in the display tank.
Add a ball valve after the split to the refugium on the leg going to the skimmer. All of the water will want to fall straight down. The valve will allow you to force some of the water all the way over to the refugium.
Guy
I had the same concern with my setup and tried to direct the water flowing out of my tank into my fuge, but I was getting tons of bubbles in the fuge which seemed to be causing some problems with my colerpa. and alot of splashing by the bubbles popping, resulting in salt everywhere.
Should this be a concern for me and maybe others?( the bubbles) Is there something that can be done to prevent this?
Thanks,
Frank
sadlit'lfish
Member
So bang,
At what size would a dsb become a benifit? Is the foot print that helps in deciding this? For example In my 55gal. the foot print is 16x48 I have aprox. 2" of small. ( not sugar sized) cc and the few times I've moved rocks I find 10+ brittle worms, and at night theres about 50+ pods out at any one time. So having that middle ... well.. pelum? I guess? Is what your looking at.
At what size would a dsb become a benifit? Is the foot print that helps in deciding this? For example In my 55gal. the foot print is 16x48 I have aprox. 2" of small. ( not sugar sized) cc and the few times I've moved rocks I find 10+ brittle worms, and at night theres about 50+ pods out at any one time. So having that middle ... well.. pelum? I guess? Is what your looking at.