Syphons and Sand

[darkslide820]

Hey all. I have a small tank running now with live sand. I've had fish swimming about for a little more than a week now, and figuring it's prob time for first water change soon.
But then I got to thinking. If I use a syphon, that's gonna suck out all the sand. Right? What should I do?

 

[hunt]

What i do is just use a siphon and suck out about 15-20% of the water and fill it back up with fresh saltwater. I dont touch the sand. How big iss the tank?

 

[rlablan]

you don't want to touch the sand. That is not necessary. that would make it "un-live sand" I also do what hunt does with the syphon.
messing with a sand bed can cause serious problems.

 

[florida joe]

you don't want to touch the sand. That is not necessary. that would make it "un-live sand" I also do what hunt does with the syphon.
messing with a sand bed can cause serious problems.
please elaborate on your reasoning

 

[darkslide820]

But what about the fish poo??
It's a 20 gallon hex tank. If my living room would ever get finished being redecorated, the 55 gallon I have sitting idle would be the main tank (in the living room) and the 20 gallon hex (in my basement) would be the quarantine tank.
But for the time being I'm using it to get the water cycled and also get the live rock/sand nice and ... live. Then I'm gonna transport some of it to the 55 gallon, eventually, to help that cycle along quicker. Hopefully.

 

[florida joe]

i am to lazy right now to get into it but vacuum a section of your tank at each water change

 

[flower]

I "vacuumed" my substrate when I had a freshwater tank, but with saltwater I purchase critters to do that work for me. A sand sifting goby or starfish works great. Certain snails too, they are part of the Clean up crew (CUC)

 

[darkslide820]

I've kept that in mind (having the crabs, etc. clean for me). But isn't 10 days a little early in the cycle to start throwing in those guys?

 

[hunt]

If your water parameters are all safe it should be fine. If it is still cycleing you shouldnt have anything in it.

 

[geoj]

Originally Posted by Darkslide820
http:///forum/post/3231668
Hey all. I have a small tank running now with live sand. I've had fish swimming about for a little more than a week now, and figuring it's prob time for first water change soon.
But then I got to thinking. If I use a syphon, that's gonna suck out all the sand. Right? What should I do?
You have fish poo remove the poo

 

[rlablan]

Joe- I have found that vacuuming a VERY SMALL little tiny tiny part is okay if it is done like almost never, But IME, I have had nitrate spikes, diatom break outs and even bouts of Cyano, which I believe were due to stirring that patch of sand bed.
Once I stopped doing that, and got few different CUC critters (depending on the tank... I have a conch, hermits, various snails, bristle worms, maybe a SS goby if the tank permits) I never had to vacuum the sand. There just isn't a need.
I believe that the process of regularly vacuuming out sand beds will lead to vacuuming out important micro faunas that we all work hard to introduce to the tank. I think suggesting this would be along the same lines as telling someone to remove a small piece of LR and scrub it down every time they did a water change?

Again, this is just my experience and I have had a few tanks and a few substrates as well. The only one I vacuumed out was CC in a swim tank.
That is just me though. OP- You are certainly welcome to take all of the opinions on here and disregard them all, or try each one...

 

[florida joe]

My reasoning for vacuuming is this. Detritus in our aquarium is for the most part uneaten food and fecal matter
CUC of detritivores such as cerith snails, spaghetti , bristleworms, (yes bristleworms) amphipods, copepods, certain starfish and lots more that will pick up what your fish, leave behind work great. Just not as fast as vacuuming will

 

[rlablan]

so I guess if you are careful about it, then it can go either way??
I also found that I was losing a lot of sand when I was vacuuming.

 

[xcali1985]

I personally siphon about 1/4 inch of my sand bed once a month. Just a small tap on the surface to get what's sitting on it. Tank does good. Although I have a sump rated for two times my tank size so lots of micro organisms in there to help keep the tank seeded.

 

[darkslide820]

Originally Posted by rlablan
http:///forum/post/3232078
I was losing a lot of sand when I was vacuuming.
That's why I brought it up. I didn't want to have to keep buying new sand.

 

[rlablan]

I mean if you only do it every once in a while... also depends on the sand. Something a little bigger and chunkier, you would lose less. don't get sugar fine if you are going to vacuum.

 

[florida joe]

what are you using Siphon the tank

 

[darkslide820]

I don't know the company off hand, but its one of those with the bell bottom on the side that goes in the tank and a skinny little tube where the water comes out of and into the bucket. You shake it up and down in the water to start it, no pumps or automatic stuff like that.
Again, I haven't used it in the sw tank yet, but that's what I've used in the fw tank for months. Gravel floats a little but sinks down fine, I'm just pretty sure that the sand would float right away though.

 

[rlablan]

That is the same thing I use, I just hold it away from the sand to avoid the sand getting sucked in . If there is a lot of stuff on the sand, I gently stir it and then suck it out of the water column. Seems to work well and I only loose I tiny bit of sand. I also don't do it often.
If you find that there is a lot of stuff on your sand, are you sure that you have enough flow and that it is properly directed?

 

[darkslide820]

Good point. Now the sand don't look too messy, but I'm just asking for when I do have to start cleaning. This small tank (20 gallon hex) doesn't really have enough room for powerheads, I tried fitting them in when I got it started but they looked like they took up a lot of the space. I have 2 powerheads that I'm gonna use when I get the big 55 gallon tank running. As advised by someone at the local store, I'll put one near the bottom, so I guess that would help with what you're saying about water flow around the sand.