Tell me what you think!! No water changes!!

[acrylic51]

Originally Posted by TrebleHook
the only thing that is ever slightly is the nitrates around 40. I am a throwback.....i run a eheim 2217....and two penguin 400's. Overfiltration is the key imho. There is enough filtration and chemipure to run a 300 gallon tank in my 75 gallon. It's all trial and error and stick what works for you.
And again my point is "your running a fish only system......" try that with corals with trates at 40........... :thinking:

 

[ruaround]

Originally Posted by acrylic51
By your earlier comment it makes it appear or sound as if you condone or practice the theory of "no water changes". Honestly you believe doing regular water changes are going to set things back......
i didnt say i never did a water change... and gave a hypathetical to the other side...
The original poster will probably find that the corals are stunned at first, but the tank will be better with the regular water changes....
perhaps...
Again he didn't post any numbers as far as parameters, and just can't believe he has no build up of anything....there is nothing that is totally maintenance free....
agreed...

 

[scsinet]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
He states that he has "out of control" plant in his refugium. I'm guessing that is where much of the pollutant is going. That, and a very light bio load.
True enough, but what I'm saying is that I seriously doubt that absolutely everything being generated is being consumed, but we'll suppose that it is.
Even if it is, you still have to consider that failing to do water changes fails to eliminate the stuff from the water that A) was introduced to begin with and B) is introduced from the environment.
It's practically impossible to start with water that is perfect. The best RODI or distilled water is still going to have tiny amounts of impurities. The additives that are used also contain tiny amounts of impurities. As water evaporates and leaves this stuff behind, then is replaced by more "essentially perfect" water and more "essentially perfect" additives, it will cause an ever escalating amount of impurities. During this time, the environment is also introducing a tremendous amount of contaminates: Dust, pet dander, household chemicals suspended in the air, fumes, etc, all of which remain in that water. Since the change is so gradual, the fish and animals become used to the degraded water quality, but new fish may die shortly after being introduced, "old tank syndrome."
I have a huge freshwater planted system that needs very few water changes, perhaps 50% every 6 months or so, but if I don't do them, the water quality continues to degrade over time. Just a random example.

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by SCSInet
True enough, but what I'm saying is that I seriously doubt that absolutely everything being generated is being consumed, but we'll suppose that it is.
Even if it is, you still have to consider that failing to do water changes fails to eliminate the stuff from the water that A) was introduced to begin with and B) is introduced from the environment.
......
Agreed.
Can we all agree that there is no reason not to do a water change?

 

[ruaround]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
Agreed.
Can we all agree that there is no reason not to do a water change?
yup... but also there is not set in stone frequency???

 

[tuna dan]

Hey Subvillian I live in Baton Rouge also. Trying to get my tank up again.

 

[psusocr1]

no water changes will always bit you in the you know what in the long run!

 

[805puffer]

Hey SubVillian, how did you get your calurpa or whatever plant you have in your refuge to grow so good?

 

[scsinet]

Originally Posted by ruaround
yup... but also there is not set in stone frequency???
I'd agree to that, but I'd add that there are general practice minimums that should be adhered to. I personally wouldn't recommend any less than 10-20% per month or so.

 

[fender]

Wow... this got me to thinking about some old threads around here....
From 08-31-2003, 02:25 AM
Originally Posted by sammystingray
Incase any of you guys read the post that I have deleted, I agree with what I said, but it was just a little too negative. Truth is, and you new folks believe this....I went a year without doing water changes or feeding my tank at all....the fish ate pods and algae, the algae ate fish poop, and the pods ate fish poop and algae...it was my attempt at a self sustaining tank, and it worked.....nothing died. When I finially decided to do a water change.....it was unbelievable the difference.....everything, and I mean everything looked ten times better within hours. Seriously, water changes are an extremely smart thing to do for most tanks. Of course they aren't all that fun, but well worth the effort. I have been keeping SW for about ten years now, and I suspect most folks who set up tanks are looking to keep them for years....not months.....long term tanks benefit greatly from water changes in my opinion..... very important to use good clean water such as RO water when doing changes.....in a way, using water from the tap and doing frequent water changes may actually add more nastys than not doing water changes at all. Do you want folks to say "hey you got a fish tank" and then move on, or do you want a centerpiece that will spark hours of conversation and wonder?? I prefer folks to say "WOW, no wonder you are always talking about your tank!! what is this and that?" Use good water and do water changes in my opinion. If Beaslbob is happy with his tank...more power to him, but I suspect most folks are looking for something a little.........shall we say..... "cleaner".

 

[dutch06]

Jumping on the topic of water changes. I have never done a water change in my 120. I have 250lbs of sand and 180lbs of rock. It's been up since April 1st of last year (going on 11 months).
I have a Euroreef 180, a 6-8 inch sand bed, and five small fish. I dose B-Ionic A+B everyday. I have never registered any nitrate, nitrite or ammonia. With dosing, I stay at alk 160-180 and calc 440-480. No phosphates. I use RO/DI faithfully.
I have tons of corals and plan on adding 2 more small fish and that's it. Your welcome to search my posts for pictures of my tank.
What are my long term issues that you think I might have to deal with?
And what exactly is the definition of long term?

 

[ruaround]

Originally Posted by SCSInet
I'd agree to that, but I'd add that there are general practice minimums that should be adhered to. I personally wouldn't recommend any less than 10-20% per month or so.
i would agree with that in most cases...

 

[maxsmart]

We used to do water changes, and occasionally still will... but not very often. And the 72+15 tank has been fine for a year. (~2 x 5-gal water changes in that time) I'd give you a picture but to be honest, it looks terrible - between the out-of-control coraline on the glass and flatworms (I intend to buy a nudi to take care of the latter once we are out of a financial crunch), you can't see the liverock. But that's not a sign of an unhealthy tank - the frogspawn coral is doing great, it has gone from 2 heads to about 20 in the past year. I also have an out-of-control mushroom population. I do have to trim the algaes about once a month - that's our method of removing nitrates. (the algae is awesome for housing pods and other scavengers, which are an important part of a balanced ecosystem as well as a tasty snack for the sixline and damsel)
The only thing unorthodox is my own design sump/fuge, which I have posted about in the past. Everyone poo-pooed the design, but I think it's a big reason for my success.

 

[lesleybird]

I think you are really lazy not to do any water changes. Why are you in this hobby if you are not responsible enough to do routine maintence like water changes?

 

[psusocr1]

its only a matter of time....

 

[rainbowsix]

Acryllic51 he said he fills the tank back up with RO water, so I am assuming he uses a salt mix. That would replace some of the elements.
I am not one to never do a water change, but there are some times that I am so busy that I just don't get to it like I should, I think sometimes we fool with our tanks too much and mess stuff up. Once the cycle is complete as long as you are not overfeeding and overstocking, everything should run perfect.

 

[clown boy]

This is an ooollldd thread, folks.

 

[mr. limpid]

If I may chime in on a diff. note water change or no water change is not the issue here. It is what is really happening with our fish tanks. The ocean, largest body of water on the plant; tides, surf, rain, minerals dissolving, etc., largest fish tank ever. Our tanks, pumps, top off, minerals "?" . Ocean population is like a pin on an elephants back. Our tanks is like an elephant sitting on a pin. So without constant care and maintenance they will fail, and the result lose of fish lives and corals lives. And none of us wants that or we wouldn't be doing this. So I say do everything in your power to keep your tank alive. Because if I loose the smallest creature in my tank I feel hurt and that I let it down, because it would of had a better chance in the ocean. Wow got to stop I getting to sappy even for me!

 

[maxsmart]

Originally Posted by Lesleybird
I think you are really lazy not to do any water changes. Why are you in this hobby if you are not responsible enough to do routine maintence like water changes?
It's not a matter of maintenance, it's a matter of doing a better job replicating a balanced ecosystem.
Some people spend all their time testing and chemically treating ammonia, nitrates, nitrites, everything - others create the means for an effective nitrogen cycle in their tank instead. Others (us included) go one step further and allow for natural ways of removing nitrates instead of throwing out water all the time.

 

[1journeyman]

Water changes add crucial trace elements.