Texas man cleared of shooting neighbor's robber

[sepulatian]

Originally Posted by rebelprettyboy
http:///forum/post/2669822
But he knew he broke in...
Texas has one of the punishment systems. pretty interesting to learn about it so far in criminal justice classs
When did this law come into effect? It was clearly stated that he was told to stay inside and out of harms way. They heard the shells being loaded. These men died. His defense was fear for his life. How is this under the new law? What is the new law? Anyone have it? When was it put into effect?
The grand jury heard two weeks of testimony from witnesses, including Horn. They likely also heard his breathless 911 call, during which the increasingly frustrated retiree ignored a dispatcher's pleas to stay inside and out of harm's way. The Nov. 14 call ended with the sound of Horn racking a shell into his 12-gauge shotgun's chamber followed by three gunshots that killed Colombians Diego Ortiz, 30, and Hernando Riascos Torres, 38.
Each man was shot in the back. They had taken about $2,000 in the burglary.
Horn's defense hinged on his assertion that he fired out of fear for his life, making the shooting justifiable under Texas law. The law also permits the use of deadly force to protect property under some circumstances

 

[xtreeme]

hahahaha maybe thats why we dont get robbed here. Where I live we ALL have guns. They are for hunting but we still have them. Fist fights are more commen if someone is robbing/ threatening you they get hit. Personally I have a 7mm mag, 50cal revolver, 8mm and a 303 brit. We have a bear problem so the hand gun stays loaded.

 

[reefraff]

Originally Posted by xtreeme
http:///forum/post/2669823
ya, choosing the lesser of two evils method still leaves a bad feeling. I really wont vote this time..... I voted since old enough but what choice this time? NONE.

I mean were in Iraq how we got there was wrong BUT we cant just up and go. We have to do something or it will be same as when his dad started it and just took off (those who sided with us got murdered). Either way its a difficult thing. None of these people can handle it I think. We need a great leader and instead have a choice that is less than able to handle it. Its no longer about why, but what to do know. Were there we have to cope with it.
I'm voting for McCain hoping and assuming he would be a one term president. Be nice to see the Dems throw up someone like Jim Webb next time. He's pretty middle of the road from what I can find on him. At any rate I was hoping McCain had enough friends on the other side it would tone down the rhetoric but that hasn';t been the case. That jerk Kerry has already taken a few shots. Pretty low class seing as how McCain went out of his way to defend Kerry in the last election.

 

[sepulatian]

Originally Posted by TangMan99
http:///forum/post/2669825
Well, if you think he's a bad guy, sure. It a $100 bill today, someone's TV set coming out the window tomorrow.

Originally Posted by rebelprettyboy
http:///forum/post/2669829
Plus if he would have let them go they would have thought hmm this neighrhood was easy so lets go back again.
Cant remember the percentage of Burgalries by the same person within 3 blocks of the 1st break in occured was but it was pretty high.
Alright, this is pointless. Please don't come to NY and kill everyone that looks at you wrong

 

[tangman99]

Originally Posted by xtreeme
http:///forum/post/2669835
hahahaha maybe thats why we dont get robbed here. Where I live we ALL have guns. They are for hunting but we still have them. Fist fights are more commen if someone is robbing/ threatening you they get hit. Personally I have a 7mm mag, 50cal revolver, 8mm and a 303 brit.
And you have a problem with some old guy dusting off a couple of burglars? What about poor bambi just munching on a couple of leaves. That is much more tragic than a couple of thieves getting capped.

 

[xtreeme]

Originally Posted by sepulatian
http:///forum/post/2669832
When did this law come into effect? It was clearly stated that he was told to stay inside and out of harms way. They heard the shells being loaded. These men died. His defense was fear for his life. How is this under the new law? What is the new law? Anyone have it? When was it put into effect?
I agree, why call 911 then decide to take care of things yourself. It doesnt add up. Then he ignore their advice. So why call in first place just for a aliby?

 

[sepulatian]

Originally Posted by xtreeme
http:///forum/post/2669745
Doesnt say they were armed? Did I miss it? They were shot in the back as they ran away. How did he feel threatend? Not self defense. Only in texas. I still think he over reacted and acted as judge and jurry. Possible they were so scared of this crazy texan old guy with a thick accent yelling at them they ran in fear rather then understanding him. Possible the jurry left him go, he was old. If he were younger I think he would face some kind of punishment.
If he shot them in the leg he would be sued? Your joking right.....I mean he got away with murder but you feel hurting them he would have been punished.
btw, I think its cool we can discuss this calmly. No flame wars nice and civil with nothing personal. I enjoy this kind of chat. It is all opinion of course if was simple as black and white there would be no need to discuss.

Originally Posted by xtreeme
http:///forum/post/2669835
hahahaha maybe thats why we dont get robbed here. Where I live we ALL have guns. They are for hunting but we still have them. Fist fights are more commen if someone is robbing/ threatening you they get hit. Personally I have a 7mm mag, 50cal revolver, 8mm and a 303 brit. We have a bear problem so the hand gun stays loaded.
I'm sorry, wasn't this you above arguing about this topic?

 

[xtreeme]

Originally Posted by TangMan99
http:///forum/post/2669840
And you have a problem with some old guy dusting off a couple of burglars? What about poor bambi just muching on a couple of leaves. That is much more tragic than a couple of thieves getting capped.

First my family eats what they kill its not sport. Second I dont hunt anymore I still have the guns as said we have bear that will attack. I stopped hunting when I became buddhist. My neighbors hunt, and they eat what they hunt. I kept the guns for sentimenal reasons. The 8mm was my dads since he hunted with it, and taught me how to shot since he died I have to keep it. Only been a year I just cant part with it. 50cal was his too. The 8mm is a WWII gun and had the mans name etched in it, was covered in blood took days to get out. Was in a millitary bunker and sold at a a u c t i o n (thats sensored? heh) has bayonette clip etc. The 303 brit was a present from dad to brother he doesnt use it since its old so I keep it. Personal not that I use them anymore.

 

[tangman99]

Originally Posted by sepulatian
http:///forum/post/2669839
Alright, this is pointless. Please don't come to NY and kill everyone that looks at you wrong

But what if he tries to take "MY" $100 bill? Can I empty a couple of clips in him? Obviously I'm joking, but it's real hard to feel bad for criminals when they get killed. We have a serious murder problem going on. You can't turn the news on at night without at least one murder. But 9 out of 10 times its drug dealers killing other drug dealers and most of the murders have taken place in the same small section of the city. I know many of the local police officers and they are helpless. Everyone in the area lives goes by the No Snitching stuff they hear so no one will say anything. It's the same old thing everytime. Someone shot to death and no one saw or heard a thing.

 

[tangman99]

Well now that we have about three topics going in unison, I have to go to bed. Work comes early in the morning. Good night all and play nice! I'll catch up tomorrow.

 

[sepulatian]

Originally Posted by TangMan99
http:///forum/post/2669849
But what if he tries to take "MY" $100 bill? Can I empty a couple of clips in him? Obviously I'm joking, but it's real hard to feel bad for criminals when they get killed. We have a serious murder problem going on. You can't turn the news on at night without at least one murder. But 9 out of 10 times its drug dealers killing other drug dealers and most of the murders have taken place in the same small section of the city. I know many of the local police officers and they are helpless. Everyone in the area lives goes by the No Snitching stuff they hear so no one will say anything. It's the same old thing everytime. Someone shot to death and no one saw or heard a thing.
We have crime here, lots of it. The difference is that we don't add to it by "emptying clips" into each other. The crime that happens here is for some reason. Let me explain. If a drug dealer is stiffed, then he will likely shoot that person. He is then arrested. There are certainly people that get mugged and whatever. There are people that do not get caught, though not many. We don't do the whole eye for an eye thing. I am curious, if your legal murder was added to the other crimes there, what our ratios would be.

 

[reefraff]

Originally Posted by sepulatian
http:///forum/post/2669832
When did this law come into effect? It was clearly stated that he was told to stay inside and out of harms way. They heard the shells being loaded. These men died. His defense was fear for his life. How is this under the new law? What is the new law? Anyone have it? When was it put into effect?

Not sure when the law was passed. I know it's based on castle doctrine. As far as the 911 dispatchers they are not sworn officers so they have no real authority although it is usually a pretty good idea to listen to them.

 

[reefraff]

Originally Posted by sepulatian
http:///forum/post/2669853
We have crime here, lots of it. The difference is that we don't add to it by "emptying clips" into each other. The crime that happens here is for some reason. Let me explain. If a drug dealer is stiffed, then he will likely shoot that person. He is then arrested. There are certainly people that get mugged and whatever. There are people that do not get caught, though not many. We don't do the whole eye for an eye thing. I am curious, if your legal murder was added to the other crimes there, what our ratios would be.

You must not live anywhere near New York city

There aren't too many cases of "legal murder". Like I said before I don't know that I would cap someone for robbing a neighbors house. I guess if I pointed a gun at them and they ignored the order to stop I might.

 

[tizzo]

I don't think all humans are equal. I have no "compassion" for life at all. We have it, we take it for granted and we waste it. We justify our lives through our jobs for crying out loud. This whole "human life is precious" is a load of crap. If it's precious, you treat it as such.
Ya know we all use the analogy, "what if someone broke into YOUR house", and we all would agree we'd be pretty po'ed. But what if your kid broke into a neighbors house?
I have a 13 year old, and I am literally drilling the lessons of "is it worth it" into his head.
If he walks uninvited into someone else's house, and he gets shot, from the owner or the neighbor or whoever, then he's an idiot! Does he deserve to die? Of course I'd say no cause he's my kid, but I did teach him, before you act, consider..."Is it worth it" and if he did and still broke in, then he made his own choice. Not one I'd agree with, but his choice none the less.
If you are a thief, personally, I don't care that your human, your still not worth a squat of #@%^.
I jusat don't share the sympathy some of you bleeding hearts have. But I guess you are the majority, which is why crime goes unpunished so often.
I think we SHOULD be allowed to kill them for trespassing! Into our homes, our cars, our country! I don't care what their excuse, I don't care about their family or job scenario, I just don't care!
If they knock on my door, I will give them food, and gas, but if they try to take it from me, they deserve to die. No place for "humans" like that IMO.

 

[aw2x3]

Originally Posted by Tizzo
http:///forum/post/2669864
I think we SHOULD be allowed to kill them for trespassing! Into our homes, our cars, our country! I don't care what their excuse, I don't care about their family or job scenario, I just don't care!
Has anyone told you you're awesome? lol!
We're not even get this off topic on border patrol, but you mentioned that and it brought to mind my ideal system of border patrol. It involves a high powered rifle, for each person in BP and a good game of "whack a mole".

 

[tizzo]

Originally Posted by AW2x3
http:///forum/post/2669866
Has anyone told you you're awesome? lol!
".
Not for about 6 months now.

Sniff, sniff...
Ah I'm kidding. I think I remember a cop loosing his job for shooting a tresspasser on the border.

Why the hell would you give them a gun, let them waive it around but they are not allowed to use it. Yup, 'nother thread altogether.

 

[shogun323]

A few posts mention people playing the police. Alot of police work is reactive, not praoactive. You call the police and they get there after everything is over with and write a report. I am so glad I live in Florida. Break in my house and you'll catch 80 lumens from the Surefire followed by a double tap on the ole .40

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by TangMan99
http:///forum/post/2669493
Ex from over 15 years ago. But I still say the shotgun was key. Now if it had been a cop did this, they would have crucified him. An old man with a shotgun protecting his neighbors property, yelling for them to stop and they run toward him; easy for him to get scared and fire off a couple of rounds. I still don't see a problem.
There has been a ruckus down here about that, from the "community activist" he went and tried to protest in front of the poor old guys house. All these black guys in suits saying how the guy was a racist. Then a motorcycle gang heard about it, drove up and reved their engines so the racebaters couldn't be heard it was pretty dang funny. The guy Quanell X was soo ticked off.
Originally Posted by reefreak29
http:///forum/post/2669542
they didnt try to attack they were shot in the back
One of the robbers did charge Joe Horn. And what is really messed up there was a plain clothes cop sitting across the street.
Originally Posted by xtreeme
http:///forum/post/2669627
If he wants to be a hero he should get rock salt or bean gun. Better get a security camera. He has to live with what he did. I just hope he must face their relatives and see ALL the people effected.

I hope the though of seeing the business end of a gun will make a amature robber think twice about robbing my house.
Originally Posted by xtreeme
http:///forum/post/2669674
He wasnt protecting himself. He was stepping in. They werent home and criminals ran from him. He gunned them down. Animals? Arent we all animals....
Defense can be done without death. Um shot in the leg etc. He just went all out.
Whats odd is one of my friends got robbed week ago. Criminal is in jail he wont be out for long time. See how that worked and he is still alive.
Dude, if you've ever delt with cops, you most likely NEVER going to see your stuff again. And they most likely aren't going to follow up unless they happen to see the guy before they go to the next call. They just don't have the time or the energy to follow up on everthing.
Criminals will go house to house, apartment to apartment. It is very likely that after one easy score they will go back.
Originally Posted by TangMan99
http:///forum/post/2669782
And don't forget they were Mexicans.
They were colombians not mexicans.
Originally Posted by sepulatian
http:///forum/post/2669796
How is this justifiable???? A few excerpts:
He was in no harm. He was inside the house.
Again, it had nothing to do with him nor his home.
Yet again.
How is this justifiable? He was told to stay inside, it was not his house being burglarized and the perpetrators merely passed through his yard. He shot them both in the back.

This argument reminds me of sienfeld. Remember the last episode. Sit there and do nothing, while someone does harm to another person.
Originally Posted by sepulatian
http:///forum/post/2669806
Alright, if you say so. I am not going to argue. I saw someone mention that this is why there is less crime in Texas. What constitutes crime though? In NY murder is a severe crime. Apparently not in Texas. If you didn't include murder in crime then other states would have a lot less "crime". JMO
umm, I don't see how stopping a criminal is a crime.

 

[bronco300]

Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/2670084
There has been a ruckus down here about that, from the "community activist" he went and tried to protest in front of the poor old guys house. All these black guys in suits saying how the guy was a racist. Then a motorcycle gang heard about it, drove up and reved their engines so the racebaters couldn't be heard it was pretty dang funny. The guy Quanell X was soo ticked off.
One of the robbers did charge Joe Horn. And what is really messed up there was a plain clothes cop sitting across the street.
I hope the though of seeing the business end of a gun will make a amature robber think twice about robbing my house.
Dude, if you've ever delt with cops, you most likely NEVER going to see your stuff again. And they most likely aren't going to follow up unless they happen to see the guy before they go to the next call. They just don't have the time or the energy to follow up on everthing.
Criminals will go house to house, apartment to apartment. It is very likely that after one easy score they will go back.
They were colombians not mexicans.
This argument reminds me of sienfeld. Remember the last episode. Sit there and do nothing, while someone does harm to another person.
umm, I don't see how stopping a criminal is a crime.
haha, the good samaritan law!!

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by digitydash
http:///forum/post/2669404
Thats is texas law you can protect your property.They should pass it every where we would have less crime.
Ya, too bad it was his neighbor's property... This guy should face charges... I watched the story yesterday on his aquittal. I thought he'd should get some penalty.
If you listen to the 911 tape... He basically tells the dispatcher he is going to go over there and shoot someone. The men also were both shot in the back. And there is question whether they were even on his property (in his yard). I think the case turned out the way it did is because he was an older man... and the men were illegals.
IMO he got off.
Another thing... as soon as he shot them and came back in the house... the police were on the scene.