think twice halide people

[03]

not to burst anyones bubble here but why are we going crazy for halides on this board am i missing something here.people with fish only or live rock your looking for trouble
heat is a problem,energy consumption,HAIR ALGEA,CONSTANTLY RUNNING PHOSPHATE REMOVER TO GET RID OF ALGEA OVERGROTH!revamping your hood if you can use it at all been there it isn't worth the trouble in my oppinion!!
not with compact flouresents they comsume less energy do just as good a job and yes you will get reflections in the water with compacts my 2 cents.

 

[bobber]

I'm gonna have to disagree with you on some of the issues with MH. Phosphate remover has nothing to do with running MH lights. Using RO/Di water will keep that under control. Heat IS an issue with MH and most people that use MH understand that fans MUST be used when running MH. Hair algae is caused by poor water quality. Yes MH lighting is very expensive, but worth it if you plan to keep any coral that requires intense lighting. I agree for a FO or a FOWLR, MH is NOT needed. But eventually, most people you want to go reef tank, and that requires MH or at least VHO. PC are good for what they are worth, but do not meet the needs or the corals and inverts that we intend to keep. After all, it's all about keeping the things we keep happy. MH is not for everyone, one must plan accordingly and know what they are getting into before they leap. Just my .02--Bob

 

[mr . salty]

As most people know,I have a single MH over my FOWLR,And LOVE IT. I plan on adding one or two more soon. I truly believe that there is nothing that comes even close to MH.I also believe that no other system can produce the ripples of light that you get in the water like MH.I've seen lot's of tanks,with lots of diferent lighting,and nothing compares.......YES it is HOT,Expensive,and probably not needed in my fowlr tank.But I know all this going in.As for a waste of money,NO WAY,I like it and I can afford it,so I have it.
[ May 05, 2001: Message edited by: MR . SALTY ]

 

[beth]

What makes it so expensive? The price of the bulb, initial installation or the amt of electricity it uses? Also, when you use fans to cool the water, doesn't the fans cause a lot MORE evaporation? Will a regular wall recepticle handle all this high wattage lighting??
Disco ball! Now I've heard everything!! Stayin' Alive!!

 

[mr . salty]

The high cost of MH is a combination of all three thing you mention BETH.The bulbs and ballast themselves are more expensive than VHO or PC. And they also consume more electrucity,but they CAN be plugged into a reguler wall socket.

 

[salth2o]

03, Thanks for your opinion. Do you currently run MH? I kinda doubt it. I use PC on on my 55 gallon reef and its not bad. *BUT* I added (3) 250 Watt MH kits and (2) 96 watt atinic blue to my 150 gallon. The lighting in my 150 BLOWS away the PC only on my 55.
I agree 100% w/ Salty on the rippling effects - Its incredible. The colors the MH bring out are incredible! You would have to try them to believe it.
I added (2) 4" fans and have had NO, NONE, ZIP heat problems.
Algae - ZERO problems! (but, I do over skim my tank).
Side note on PC: I have NEVER had any problems supporting my corals under this light in the 55 just so people realize this is an option.
Price: decent 250 watt MH kits w/ 5500 K bulb and reflector were about $165 each. PC kits with reflectors and bulbs for 96 watts cost me $95 each... I guess its kind of a push when it comes to total cost!!
so ..

 

[ironreef]

water quality is the primary factor with hair alga, overfeeding overstocking is also. haldies produce more light will help it grow but in a well run tank hair isn't a prob. i run 4_110w vho and 2 250w halides I ran the vho first for a few yrs added halides corals growth 100x better hair had a bloom for a few mo but now not any diff than just vho

 

[03]

if you read all of your posts you are all just reinforseing my point that you don't need halides in a folr tank-you want them that is fine.that you do grow hair algea if your running the proper wattage per gallon .
that you do need to cool your tank and or make adjustments to the canopy or cover to operate them. ALSO THAT THY ARE ENERGY PIGS IN THIS DAY AND AGE WE DON'T NEED BECAUSE IT LOOKS GOOD OR YOU CAN AFFORD THEM.MAYBE THAT IS WHY THERE ARE ROLLING BLACK OUTS ON THE COAST EVERYONE THERE IS USEING HALIDES LOL.

 

[neko]

ya, MH are energy pigs!! BAN THEM, oh please!! Unless your "amish" quit *itchin' about energy consumption!JUST MY $.02

 

[marine qa]

I am dying to see this MH rippling effect. Especially if it would be an excuse to get a disco ball in my house.

 

[bobj]

The other day I was discussing buying a huge SUV that gets 5-10mpg with my uncle. He wondered why I wanted to buy such an expensive ineffecient machine that I did't really need.
I told him that I understood his point but that I wanted it and could afford it.
Then my uncle said to me,"Maybe you can afford it, but can the planet?"

 

[ironreef]

maybe not in a fo but i had 4-110w vho had a green sinulara for 5 yrs have pic of the growth. when I added the halides in one year I equal the growth from 5yrs. for corals some do alot better with halides =sps and clams. The alga bloom was just diatoms. your post suggest alga problems which is not true. Now watt for wat if you have 500w of pc or 500w of halide you use the same power but halides produce supieror lighting. The heat would be minor a simple fan takes care of that. So you are accually using almost the same power excluding the small fan. now it may not be needed in a fo but in a reef equal lighting halide is supiro so if you were only to have one kind. But most reefers use alot more light than just halides also. So you can compare heat or power if you are comparing 200w to 1000w. 1000w of pc will cost the same as 1000 w halide. But you maynot need this much light it just depends on what you keep.

 

[03]

Originally posted by Ironreef:
<STRONG>maybe not in a fo but i had 4-110w vho had a green sinulara for 5 yrs have pic of the growth. when I added the halides in one year I equal the growth from 5yrs. for corals some do alot better with halides =sps and clams. The alga bloom was just diatoms. your post suggest alga problems which is not true. Now watt for wat if you have 500w of pc or 500w of halide you use the same power but halides produce supieror lighting. The heat would be minor a simple fan takes care of that. So you are accually using almost the same power excluding the small fan. now it may not be needed in a fo but in a reef equal lighting halide is supiro so if you were only to have one kind. But most reefers use alot more light than just halides also. So you can compare heat or power if you are comparing 200w to 1000w. 1000w of pc will cost the same as 1000 w halide. But you maynot need this much light it just depends on what you keep.</STRONG>
sorry but your wrong the whole thing with pc is to get more light with less wattage!

 

[ironreef]

explain how you get more light=par with pc?I've had pc equal watts to haldies already been proven with the proper equipment. wheres your links to prove your theory. i've seen it done with simple lux meters also. even thought they maynot be accurae they are enought for the hobby to tell what puts out more lux. if your theory was correct there would be alot more pc users. Iseen them when they first got popular pc this pc that. every one dumped vho and halides . Most ppl when back to vho. halides put out the more par to question but I'm not sure what your saying? 250w of pc will not put out more par than 250watts of halide. 500w of pc will not put out more par than 250 watt halide or more in any depth of the tank. wheres your link or book to prove your theory? Otherwise your are saying 500 w of pc will put out more light than a 400w halide. pc puts out more par with less watts so if you have 500w of pc it should blow away a 400w halide. I seriously doubt it.

 

[mr . salty]

Well said IRONREEF.I have tried to argue that point before,but much like the watt per gallon rule there are actually people out there that believe it.... Hey I gotta bridge for sale cheap....MH,without a doubt,blows away PC...I cant remember the last tank I saw in a reputable store that was powered by PC. They all use MH and VHO.In my opinion PC is for smaller tanks that don't have enough room for MH,or VHO.This is where PC's stand alone.Alot of wattage in a small space.I just wish they could make a half way decent looking blue in a PC.

 

[beth]

So what about the electronic ballasts for VHO or MH. Lots of bucks, but is it worth the extra $$$ in terms of energy efficiency and heat reduction, or is it hype? I have read some posts here on the matter, and there is positive feedback in favor of the e-ballasts.
Opinions?

 

[jond]

All I know is the icecap I have hardly even gets warm. I have put my hand on old tar ballests and they are hot.
And if you get an icecap ballest, there is a dimmer that is made for it. Now that's cool.

 

[ironreef]

Icecap can run vho ,pc and no lights. this is the best in savings and long life no disbut. but as far as halides there alot of disbute and proven link @=http://www.personal.psu.edu/faculty/s/b/sbj4/aquarium/ballast%20comparison/ballastcomparison.html I just ask if you wanna deabate have links of books of referance of even books that include referance to show your findings on any topic. I just wish to learn if it's not what i already know. Just for my own benifit. I'm nit saying pc is bad it has its use but saying it blows away halide with less power sounds like you are selling/marketing pc. Not a true statemant.

 

[twoods71]

The best fish store I have ever been too, and believe me I've been to many, only has PC or VHO for all there coral displays. The look is fantastic and the corals are the healthiest i've seen in the south FL area.
Also if you want a somewhat of a shimmering effect with PC or VHO make sure you have lots of surface disturbance and use a white gloss background, the look is nice.

 

[bobber]

Look, bottom line is, personal preferance. MH is by far the best you can have. With that comes the amount of money to be spent replacing bulbs, higher electric bill, and added heat(slightly depending on the size of the tank and how many MH bulbs). VHO still rule and have many options available to the hobbyist. VHO and MH combos are readily available and most people wish to have this type of lighting on their tanks because the look is the best around. PC's are great as well. Their look isn't as good because of the color they produce, but one can have a healthy tank with the use of PCs.
That being said, it's what you, as the hobbyist, want to acheive. Your inhabitants are restricted to the type of lighting that you have. There is not one person in SW keeping a T.Maxima clam under PC lighting! Lighting has been an difficult topic for everyone because the wpg rule doesn't work or make any sense. For someone new to the hobby, lighting can generally frustrate the hobbyist, thus making the SW hobby that much harder. Reading books, talking to other hobbyists, and having a reliable lfs are some of the most important aspects of the hobby. The idea is sharing information. Yes, I understand what you are saying, MH are NOT required for fowlr systems, but what you want to keep under the correct lighting IS REQUIRED for whatever livestock in the tank. I hope this clears up my thoughts on the subject. --Bob