This makes me sick....

[reefraff]

I only personally saw one person abuse food stamps. He separated out his wine and smokes from the rest and when he paid for the non food stamp items he pulled a wad of cash out that had to be a few hundred bucks. I watched the guy walk out and get into a Lexus. I shook my head and said something like "our tax dollars at work" The cashier looked around and told me it happens quite a bit. This was in Northern Idaho.
My step dad's daughter and his other daughter's husband both received SS disability from the time they were in their 20's. The daughter smoked her mind doing drugs and the son in law was a chronic alcoholic. Right now there are a lot of people being moved from unemployment to SS disability for BS reasons like the "stress" of being unemployed being classified a disability. Most people know that the SS "trust fund" is going broke but what they don't know is there is a separate trust for disability that is projected to be depleted by 2016. Should be interesting to see what happens. I am on disability but happen to be really disabled. If I were to divorce my wife on paper I'd save a couple grand a year just on income taxes. I'd also qualify for some other assistance as well. When I hear some of these stories I think I should go ahead and scam the system too but I was raised better than that.
However, I suspect means testing is coming. When I got wiped out I got a decent settlement and we have been smart about what we do with our money. If I stand to lose payments because of our assets and the wife's salary I'll rethink that divorce thing.

 

[darthtang aw]

We are between a rock and a hard place in this area, because if you cut those people off completely, they would have two choices: 1) Go out and work for your money, or 2) Start doing illegal things like crime to make your money.  I think it's safe to say that there are already very few jobs available, and sadly there is more money in crime than an honest days work.  So what do you think most of these people would end up doing?  When they start to go that route, then crime jumps, the jails and legal system get even more taxed, and we end up spending even more money to keep these people in check, or house them in prisons than we would have spent on welfare in the first place.  And on top of that, we are living in a much more dangerous society.
You have the outlook all wrong. Sure a percentage of people would turn to crime, but that percentage is small. The grand scheme of things, these programs are to a degree keeping the unemployment levels where they are at. As a conservative, I hate to admit this. But there is truth in my statement. Cutting these programs most likely would jump unemployment. and NO PRESIDENT wants that.

 

[flower]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Siptang http:///t/390903/this-makes-me-sick#post_3464179
System exists for people like you and I have no problem with that. You need assistance and you need to read little bit more of what I wrote because in no way or form, I have called people legally using the system as parasites. To clarify, you are telling me that you are legitimately using the system that are made for people like you with conditions and again I have no problem with that. Problem that I have is people who are chasing the loopholes in the system, taking money when they are not qualified for it. They are the parasite of this society and that's what grinds my gear and apparently many people here. Look around you, our economy is going down the toilet, they are cutting down medical pays and benefits for our vets and for our soldiers for crying out aloud. These people are bleeding this country dry and if you have a legitimate reason, there's no reason for you to be so defensive.
Sip....How do I word this....????
These "parasites" are not draining the country dry. This country spends billions on other countries, they spend billions on top of billions to find out if the planet Mercury has water. Then you have government grants to professors to spend a year to find out why frogs have spots. Billions and billions of your tax dollars on some of the most ridicules things imaginable.
You see the poor and the uneducated everyday and you pick up on the waste of money the government spends by subsidizing their housing and food, but believe me...those people are not dragging down our country. The system itself is in trouble because more people are pulling out of the SS funds then those who pay in. Those who get SS because they have reached retirement age and have the mordacity to live too long, or retire early early because of disability, the children of dead folks who died too young, the young who claim drug addiction and can't work to care for themselves, the mentally unstable and retarded who can't take care of themselves, the young stupid girl who dosen't even know who the daddy of their child is...all these make up the people who are on SSI. The only ones paying into the kitty are the folks who work. So a portion of the government funds go to take up the slack.
The money the government wastes are far beyond the welfare system. The biggest drain on the country and your tax dollars is the wars we keep fighting in other countries..not only do we spend tribillions to bomb them...we spend the same to rebuild them afterward.

 

[darthtang aw]

 
Sip....How do I word this....????
These "parasites" are not draining the country dry. This country spends billions on other countries, they spend billions on top of billions to find out if the planet Mercury has water. Then you have government grants to professors to spend a year to find out why frogs have spots. Billions and billions of your tax dollars on some of the most ridicules things imaginable.
You see the poor and the uneducated everyday and you pick up on the waste of money the government spends by subsidizing their housing and food, but believe me...those people are not dragging down our country. The system itself is in trouble because more people are pulling out of the SS funds then those who pay in.   Those who get SS because they have reached retirement age and have the mordacity to live too long, or retire early early because of disability, the children of dead folks who died too young, the young who claim drug addiction and can't work to care for themselves, the mentally unstable and retarded who can't take care of themselves, the young stupid girl who dosen't even know who the daddy of their child is...all these make up the people who are on SSI. The only ones paying into the kitty are the folks who work. So a portion of the government funds go to take up the slack.
The money the government wastes are far beyond the welfare system. The biggest drain on the country and your tax dollars is the wars we keep fighting in other countries..not only do we spend tribillions to bomb them...we spend the same to rebuild them afterward.
Do me a favor. Stop speaking from an emotionally driven standpoint and actually look at a budget breakdown. Social services account for the majority of this country's costs.
http://www.usgovernmentdebt.us/year_spending_2012USbn_13bs1n_4010412030_605#usgs302
That site gives the most intense breakdown I have found.

 

[reefraff]

Welfare programs aren't a huge part of spending but they create nothing. Even a stupid frog study creates jobs. Yeah, it's a waste of money but at least you get something in return. With welfare you create attitudes that not only is it acceptable to play the lottery while taking public assistance but it's also OK to continue taking said assistance after winning the lottery. This scumbag woman isn't the only welfare recipient to win the lottery and continue taking the welfare money.

 

[beth]

Its not a matter of minding own business. Those on welfare make it our business because taxpayers are paying their way. Believe me, their grocery list or vehicle make would not matter to anyone if they were self supporting.
This is really what has gotten Rush Limbaugh in so much trouble this past week. A woman advocating for tax-payers to pay for her contraception (her sex life) and him lashing out in reaction. If people would just take responsibility instead of expecting the public at large to support them, then you would not have an irate tax paying public sticking their nose in other people's business.
People on SSDI are not free-loaders. They have put into the system, and are getting back what they deserve due to disability. And it is not easy going through all the hoops that the Social Security Adm. puts your through to get determined eligible for disability.

 

[reefraff]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flower http:///t/390903/this-makes-me-sick/20#post_3464268
Sip....How do I word this....????
These "parasites" are not draining the country dry. This country spends billions on other countries, they spend billions on top of billions to find out if the planet Mercury has water. Then you have government grants to professors to spend a year to find out why frogs have spots. Billions and billions of your tax dollars on some of the most ridicules things imaginable.
You see the poor and the uneducated everyday and you pick up on the waste of money the government spends by subsidizing their housing and food, but believe me...those people are not dragging down our country. The system itself is in trouble because more people are pulling out of the SS funds then those who pay in. Those who get SS because they have reached retirement age and have the mordacity to live too long, or retire early early because of disability, the children of dead folks who died too young, the young who claim drug addiction and can't work to care for themselves, the mentally unstable and retarded who can't take care of themselves, the young stupid girl who dosen't even know who the daddy of their child is...all these make up the people who are on SSI. The only ones paying into the kitty are the folks who work. So a portion of the government funds go to take up the slack.
The money the government wastes are far beyond the welfare system. The biggest drain on the country and your tax dollars is the wars we keep fighting in other countries..not only do we spend tribillions to bomb them...we spend the same to rebuild them afterward.
Those wars don't cost as much of the pink nazis would have you believe. Many of those salaries are still paid even if the soldiers were stateside. It's also a stimulus program when you think about it. All those bombs and vehicles need to be built and are built here in the good ol USA. Wait until 0bama starts throwing people out of the military and watch what happens to unemployment. My son has already been told his MOS is being done away with so when his hitch is up a few months after his next tour of Afghanistan he is not going to be allowed to re enlist.

 

[darthtang aw]

Welfare programs aren't a huge part of spending but they create nothing. Even a stupid frog study creates jobs. Yeah, it's a waste of money but at least you get something in return. With welfare you create attitudes that not only is it acceptable to play the lottery while taking public assistance but it's also OK to continue taking said assistance after winning the lottery. This scumbag woman isn't the only welfare recipient to win the lottery and continue taking the welfare money.
reef, take a look at the link i provided.....it will breakdown pretty good...i didnt realize how much we spend on "family nutrition assistance" alone. it also includes housing and other aspects. just click the various drop downs. it will break down everything pretty good.

 

[flower]

Okay I looked at the chart...If I read it correctly it has the total at the top then the break down under it..in the MILLIONS...I checked the pie chart to be sure I read it right.
Top line on Defense....902.3 and the last total reads 903.3
Education...941.0
Welfare...451.9 and last total reads...679.2
Somehow that just doesn't look like a majority to me. What really gets me is the "other spending" 584.0 it is nearly as high as welfare. Now welfare is all broken down on different sublevels so you can see exactly what certain areas get and how much...the defense and education is broken down too...but not "other spending"...could that be the paychecks for the esteemed leaders? Or maybe that's where the $10.000.00 toilet seat is accounted for....it is such a huge number with no explanation whatsoever.
And saying the wars make jobs is just dumb, or the frog scientists. The welfare caseworkers are jobs too. I do not freak out about the military, we need our defense, and our education, but we also need the welfare, but the people in charge need to regulate it better.
Not everyone you are all out of sorts with are what they appear to be. My mother once took a lady from our neighborhood to the food pantry for some food, she drove a Lincoln. She said people were giving here dirty looks. I drove a big new van and I ran to the store for a fellow dying of cancer and pay for his food with the card he gave me....yep welfare. I wonder how many of you would like to wring my neck since all the man wanted to eat were sweets..strong narcotics do that...all they want is junk foods. Yes I used to take my kids in tow when I ran those errends.

 

[dragonzim]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flower http:///t/390903/this-makes-me-sick/20#post_3464345
Okay I looked at the chart...If I read it correctly it has the total at the top then the break down under it..in the MILLIONS...I checked the pie chart to be sure I read it right.
Top line on Defense....902.3 and the last total reads 903.3
Education...941.0
Welfare...451.9 and last total reads...679.2
Somehow that just doesn't look like a majority to me. What really gets me is the "other spending" 584.0 it is nearly as high as welfare. Now welfare is all broken down on different sublevels so you can see exactly what certain areas get and how much...the defense and education is broken down too...but not "other spending"...could that be the paychecks for the esteemed leaders? Or maybe that's where the $10.000.00 toilet seat is accounted for....it is such a huge number with no explanation whatsoever.
And saying the wars make jobs is just dumb, or the frog scientists. The welfare caseworkers are jobs too. I do not freak out about the military, we need our defense, and our education, but we also need the welfare, but the people in charge need to regulate it better.
Not everyone you are all out of sorts with are what they appear to be. My mother once took a lady from our neighborhood to the food pantry for some food, she drove a Lincoln. She said people were giving here dirty looks. I drove a big new van and I ran to the store for a fellow dying of cancer and pay for his food with the card he gave me....yep welfare. I wonder how many of you would like to wring my neck since all the man wanted to eat were sweets..strong narcotics do that...all they want is junk foods. Yes I used to take my kids in tow when I ran those errends.
The link is showing dollar amounts in BILLIONS, not MILLIONS! 113.5 billion in Food and Nutrition Assistance. Even if only 1% of the people getting assistance are scamming the system (and its probably more than that), that is still over a BILLION wasted per year.

 

[flower]

Oh I see it now, I saw million on the population, it was bright red and I just glanced at it...thinking I was wrong on billions...
113 billion on food stamps and compared to 716 billion on defence...it still doesn't look like the majority to me, which is what I was accused of missing....and whatever a pink nazi is.
The people in charge have to step up and do their job. You know when welfare first started, a caseworker would come to the house and search for proof of others living in the home and cut the benifits.They would check the fridge for proper food. Then it became too much for the casewrokers and they stopped the constant searches. Now it's all paperwork. Also to date, the WIC program in Wisconsin has brands that their voucher pays for. My daughter used to get WIC assistance and she had a list of foods it would pay for. The goal was to teach young mothers about nutrition and feeding their children properly for heath and growth.
So it isn't like we don't have the technology to regulate what can be purchased with the swipe card they offer. However standing in the chckout line and glaring at the people will only make you mad, it won't solve a thing and you could misjudge the situation if you did say something. It isn't anybodies business at that point. We can write to our government and we can push for better regulations on such things. The system is abused and overused. It needs an overhaul, but there are people who really need that assistance and if it goes away, those people are in serious trouble. So getting rid of assistance is not the solution.
I don't like hearing and seeing people abuse the system, that includes taxes and shoplifting. I hate to see cheaters, users and abusers getting anything. However if you really want a change...there are ways of being heard and making a difference. I just disagree that the checkout line is the place.

 

[mantisman51]

Quote:
Originally Posted by DragonZim http:///t/390903/this-makes-me-sick/20#post_3464380
The link is showing dollar amounts in BILLIONS, not MILLIONS! 113.5 billion in Food and Nutrition Assistance. Even if only 1% of the people getting assistance are scamming the system (and its probably more than that), that is still over a BILLION wasted per year.
Arizona Economic Security Department has estimated there are as many as 100k Mexican citizens using American welfare and food stamps. Now imagine how many there are when you add Texas and California. $1 billion? I'd bet Mexico alone counts for $20-$30 billion in fraud to the welfare/food stamp system.

 

[dragonzim]

Quote:
Originally Posted by mantisman51 http:///t/390903/this-makes-me-sick/20#post_3464390
Arizona Economic Security Department has estimated there are as many as 100k Mexican citizens using American welfare and food stamps. Now imagine how many there are when you add Texas and California. $1 billion? I'd bet Mexico alone counts for $20-$30 billion in fraud to the welfare/food stamp system.
NY, and especially Long Island has a massive illegal alien population as well. Our hospital emergency rooms are overrun with them and since they have no insurance they get free healthcare on the taxpayers dime. I've also seen many women with 5 or 6 kids in tow, who dont speak a lick of English using food stamps at the grocery store. I'm not going to outright say they are illegal, since I dont know for sure, but I certainly wouldn't bet against it.

 

[mantisman51]

I'm not even talking about illegals-though they do make up the bulk of the problem with welfare fraud outside the border states. I'm talking about Mexicans who cross the border only to file for, and then spend welfare and food stamps. I have spoke with a gal who was my wife's close friend and she called herself a "welfare baby". Mexicans drive across the border when they're in labor and give birth at American hospitals, then once they have the golden birth cert and SS card, welfare for life! She moved from Mexico and said she hated what her family and friends in Mexico were doing. She said growing up they would talk about how badly they hated "Anglos" and laugh that they were getting even by living on the "white man's" welfare. It is very disturbing. And that is really why I am so against illegal immigration and amnesty. This IS an invasion by a foreign nation and too many illegals see welfare and food stamps as their right because evil America stole the Southwest and I have met 3rd and 4th generation Hispanic Americans who STILL spout that garbage and STILL see themselves as "Mexicans" and not Americans and think the welfare lifestyle is payback for the white man's evil against "them". I wish we would end food stamps and go back to commodities. It would end a lot of the fraud.

 

[mantisman51]

p.s. Mexican is a nationality not a race. Hispanic is a race, like Caucasian and Asian.

 

[stdreb27]

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheClemsonKid http:///t/390903/this-makes-me-sick#post_3464173
I think we can all agree that there is a certain minority of the people on assistance who could certainly help themselves. Heck, it may even be a majority for all I know. But here is the problem. Let's say you up and take all people off welfare or assistance today, what do you think is going to happen tomorrow?
We are between a rock and a hard place in this area, because if you cut those people off completely, they would have two choices: 1) Go out and work for your money, or 2) Start doing illegal things like crime to make your money. I think it's safe to say that there are already very few jobs available, and sadly there is more money in crime than an honest days work. So what do you think most of these people would end up doing? When they start to go that route, then crime jumps, the jails and legal system get even more taxed, and we end up spending even more money to keep these people in check, or house them in prisons than we would have spent on welfare in the first place. And on top of that, we are living in a much more dangerous society.
This is the one and only thing about being a democrat that really irks me. Because I have heard firsthand people say they voted for Obama so they can keep that money coming. The sad reality is that both the D's and R's have let this go from a program that really did help people 50 years ago, to an out of control social free for all. The only way it's going to change is if you take a very, very slow approach to reverse this, by each year taking away more and more assistance (except to those who actually need it) from those who abuse the system, and at some point it would stop. But this is not something that any president or congress could do in 4 or even 8 years.
It is real simple, those morons who won't support themselves will starve or go get a job, and the people who can't take care of themselves will find a church...

 

[beth]

Quote:
Originally Posted by mantisman51 http:///t/390903/this-makes-me-sick/20#post_3464400
p.s. Mexican is a nationality not a race. Hispanic is a race, like Caucasian and Asian.
Hispanic is not a race at all. It is cultural designation to identify people of of Spanish-speaking orgin. A Hispanic person can be of any race. I have even seen Hispanics of Asian origin.

 

[beth]

Quote:
Originally Posted by mantisman51 http:///t/390903/this-makes-me-sick/20#post_3464390
Arizona Economic Security Department has estimated there are as many as 100k Mexican citizens using American welfare and food stamps. Now imagine how many there are when you add Texas and California. $1 billion? I'd bet Mexico alone counts for $20-$30 billion in fraud to the welfare/food stamp system.
You do not have to be an American citizen to qualify for welfare, or for other welfare types of assistance such as food stamps, Medicaid, HUD assistance, free or reduced cost school meals, free public ed., and Supplemental Security Income. You only need to be a legal resident. Illegal aliens receive welfare assistance through their American born children or fraudulent means. Government welfare agencies, knowing full well who is legal or illegal, do not report illegals receiving welfare through children.

 

[mantisman51]

In Arizona you do have to be a citizen-Prop 200. Also, look up racial categorization.

 

[reefraff]

Hispanic is such a bastardized term it get confusing at times. I remember in high school they did a survey and did a head count by race. When they got to Hispanic only about half of the "Mexicans" raised their hands. When the coach said "That includes Italians" the other half raised their hands LOL!. I don't think Italians have ever been considered hispanic but I couldn't tell the difference between them and the Mexican guys. They all hung in the same gang in my school.