Trouble Keeping Flame Angel

[richl]

I have tried to keep a Flame Angel in my tank twice and both times the fish died after a couple of months for reasons I cannot determine. In both cases, I planned for the Flame Angel to be the last fish added since they are supposed to be more aggressive than the other inhabitants. I have a 125 gal FOWLR set-up with a Fluval canister filter and plenty of power heads for circulation. My water parameters are always perfect except for Nitrates of 20 and I change 30 gal new SW every 2 weeks at which time I also clean the filter. The other inhabitants are 2 Heniochus Butterfies, 1 Klienii Butterfly, 2 Ocellaris Clownfish, 1 Yellow Tang and 1 Blue Reef Chromis. The 3 butterflies have been in the tank about 1 1/2 years and have grown a lot and are very voracious eaters. The Tang is smaller and somewhat timid, but is healthy.The Clowns are just playful. In both cases, I had the Flame Angel in QT for over a month including 3 full weeks hyposalinity which they seemed to tolerate well. After transferring to the DT, the first Flame lasted a couple of months and the second only lasted about 3 weeks. The first Flame had a color change (more Orange than Red) right before it died, but the second had perfect red and black color when it died suddenly. Although I did not see any evidence of abuse by other fish, the 3 butterflies are all 2-3 times larger than the Flame Angels, so I'm wondering if they might have been harassed to death. I never saw them being chased, but the Flames seemed to stay away from the butterflies and were definitely reluctant to join the frenzy at feeding time. Agelfish are supposede to be a bit aggressive, but I never saw that with mine. Is it possible that the Flame Angel is just too small to be kept with larger butterflies? Any thoughts on what happened?
Thanks

 

[deejeff442]

i know angels need a more specific diet.spone especially.maybe a factor?

 

[srfisher17]

Flames are omnivores and don't need sponge like many larger Angels. I'm convinced that Flames need a lot of mature LR to graze on, if they are to thrive. These fish are collected from many places and I think cyanide collection could still be a problem with some of them. Flames are also extremely sensitive to copper and many shippers and other facilities routinely use it.I'd be careful where I purchased a Flame (same goes for all fish) and ask questions about collection site, etc. These are usually very hardy fish, once acclimated, but the losses in newer fish has always seemed high to me. However, fish do die, and two losses could be nothing more than coincidence. BTW; nitrates of 20 ppm in a FOWLR is perfectly fine and nothing to be concerned about, IMO&IME.

 

[flower]

Please believe me, until my tank was like 2 years mature I could not keep a dwarf angelfish to save my life.

 

[bgbdwlf2500]

it took me 3 coral beauties to get one to survive and i tried to flame angels twice.. the 2 coral beauties and the 2 flames all died in a week...
The third coral was never sick, never a problem...i think its plain and simple, the quality of the fish

 

[btldreef]

I agree that they need a lot of mature live rock to thrive. I usually don't see flames thrive unless they are in reef tanks.
Just out of curiosity, what were you feeding? I know they don't "need" sponge, but my CB and Flame do much better with sponge in their diets.

 

[flower]

I feed the fish Mysis and sometimes a chunk of raw shrimp to tear at. I also offer algae sheets. There is a sponge in the tank, I think he nips it when he wants, it is getting smaller. I was giving them some of that new gel food from Instant ocean but not regularly.
I don’t like the sponge diet, it got under rocks and just sat there even the CUC didn’t like it.

 

[richl]

I feed SanFrancisco Bay "Frozen Angel & Butterfly Diet" which has some sponge in it, OC Formula Two Marine Pellets, Mysis Shrimp, Brine Shrimp with Spirulina, Spirulina Flakes and algae sheets. Any frozen food I soak in VitaChem or Selcon. I try to mix it up and feed something different daily. It has been discouraging to loose two Flames in a row, especially since it takes a lot of time with quarantine and hypo. I have been thinking about maybe a juvenile French Angelfish. Would a larger angel have a better chance of long term survival? Some books say a French is ok in >100 gal while others say you need 135+. I only have 7 fish in a 125,so I'm thinking about it. Does anyone have any recommendations for a nice 'final' fish given those I have?

 

[clown-keeper99]

The FA (in my experince) is not as aggressive as its made out to be
With these fish it is more likly to be picked on then picking on other fish

 

[btldreef]

Quote:
Originally Posted by clown-keeper99 http:///forum/thread/382650/trouble-keeping-flame-angel#post_3341287
The FA (in my experince) is not as aggressive as its made out to be
With these fish it is more likly to be picked on then picking on other fish
I honest think it depends on the fish, what order it is added to the tank and what else is in the tank with it. I have owned three, two out of the three were very aggressive and the third became more aggressive over time.

 

[meowzer]

Quote:
Originally Posted by BTLDreef http:///forum/thread/382650/trouble-keeping-flame-angel#post_3341323
I honest think it depends on the fish, what order it is added to the tank and what else is in the tank with it. I have owned three, two out of the three were very aggressive and the third became more aggressive over time.
I agree on it depends on the fish.....I set up my tank 7/08.....got a bunch of fish including my coral beauty by end of August, 2008....the the flame angel a couple months later....never had an issue, and I have added many fish since

 

[srfisher17]

Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL http:///forum/thread/382650/trouble-keeping-flame-angel#post_3341084
I feed SanFrancisco Bay "Frozen Angel & Butterfly Diet" which has some sponge in it, OC Formula Two Marine Pellets, Mysis Shrimp, Brine Shrimp with Spirulina, Spirulina Flakes and algae sheets. Any frozen food I soak in VitaChem or Selcon. I try to mix it up and feed something different daily. It has been discouraging to loose two Flames in a row, especially since it takes a lot of time with quarantine and hypo. I have been thinking about maybe a juvenile French Angelfish. Would a larger angel have a better chance of long term survival? Some books say a French is ok in >100 gal while others say you need 135+. I only have 7 fish in a 125,so I'm thinking about it. Does anyone have any recommendations for a nice 'final' fish given those I have?
An adult French Angel is a big, dominate, and often aggressive fish. This is the type of fish I'd defiantly avoid (along with other large angels) with your butterfly fish---they don't do well with bossy fish. "Only' 7 fish in a 125 is not a light load, especially with the fish you have. I'd stick to a dwarf angel or similar fish; check out some of the appropriate size wrasse; a Scotts Fairy Wrasse would be ideal, IMO.