why do i keep losing tangs??

[shawnd61]

i have a 46g bow, and i keep losing my tangs. my other fish--false perc, firefish, mandarin, and a dottyback--remain healthy. i had a kole tang for about a month until he kicked the bucket. and i recently bought a regal and it kealed over last night--at least i think.
the kole became introverted, and i think that may have been my sign to take him out, but i ignored it. the hippo i put in on weds after 1.5 hrs of acclimation and he was fine. yesterday he was swimming around the tank like he owned it. additionally, he had been eating since the initial acclimation.
now i cant find my hippo and i HOPE that he is doing his playing dead thing somewhere in the rockwork. it's just that i have yet to see him, and the lights have been on for 3 hrs.i even ripped up half of my tank trying to find him. as a result of my failed kole, im a little worried since it seems inevitable that i will see my new tang on the side of a carton of milk tomorrow.

i'd just like to know if there might be somekind of "Bug" or parasite that targets tangs and fish of that sort? at least if my regal is a gonner i can get even w/ what might be picking them off. then i could get another 1.
i'll keep ya posted if i see him later.

 

[slinger]

I am a n00b and dont know very much yet, but I suspect that the tank for your Tangs is a little on the small side. They need quite a bit of room for swimming or else they get stressed out. Just my 2 cents and I hope we get the expert advice you need here soon

 

[shawnd61]

i do thank you for the advice, but before i bought either tang i did take my tank size into consideration. the tangs that i was putting into the tank were young yet. once they had outgrown the tank i would have traded them in for something else.
besides, the hippo was only a little bigger then a quarter...i doubt that a 46g world would have been too small for a tang that tiny.

 

[bang guy]

The tank is just too small for a Tang.

 

[shawnd61]

even 1 as tiny as i mentioned??? if so what other "bigger" sw fish, that are reef safe, could go into my tank??

 

[crazyaqua]

Yeah i am suprised that more tang "police" havent shown up i have a yellow in a 55 and most people here dont advise it even when there young. some dwarf angels would nip maybe but are so so reef safe.

 

[ophiura]

How old is your tank? How much LR do you have and what are your specific water parameters?
The tank, as you seem to know, is too small for long term care of a tang. However, I have seen some of these small tangs (quite shockingly small - I found it upsetting actually) and would not want to put them in a large tank with large fish. But the mortality rate on these tiny fish has to be quite high.
I have a small Kole in my 45, and it is a trooper and fighter. It is the only tang, IMO, to even be remotely considered for tanks in this size range that is not effectively just a long term QT (meaning basically no other fish...just a room to graze, grow and not be bullied).
There are some tanks, that for whatever reason, just do not seem to be able to keep tangs, and you just have to accept that. It may never be known. Many of the smaller tangs will be doomed for no reason to do with your tank. But IMO, I wouldn't try unless there were fewer fish. I have two, a sixline and a Kole. I added a coral beauty recently and clearly the tang was stressed (though in part because it wouldn't "back off"). I took that third fish out and just don't know that I will add anything else. It may not look crowded but it may very well be to these fish.
Tangs have a high mortality rate, and IMO, when they get insanely small like some of these regals I've been seeing, the mortality has got to be very very high.

 

[shawnd61]

my tank is about 1 and a half months, but it was established for 8mnts b4 i moved it. all of my parameters check out. only nitrates are a little high--20-30ppm, and my sg is kept - 1.024 according to my hydrometer.
i have about 100lbs of lr in the tank, and it does occupy a lot of space.
thats too bad, i really do like the surgen family of fish. id really like to have 1 maybe for just awhile in the tank, but maybe things just arent ment to be.
anyway....if no tang, then what?? could i maybe keep something like a twin spot wrasse or something similar?? or am i limitd to smaller fish like chromis and what not?

 

[fishieness]

a twin spot wrasse will get two feet long and is not reef-safe. So that is a definate no. You cant put any big fish in your tank. Small to medium sized ones only. Why dont you give us some suggestions of fish you like, and people will say if they will go well in your tank based on their experiences and stories.
:happy:

 

[shawnd61]

im just a little disapointed. i really thought i could get away w/ something like a mimic tang or a regal. i'm thinking of maybe getting 4-5 chromis and having a little school of those instead. then again, i might just pack the tank w/ as much coral that will fit into it. i dont know. just had my heart set on a surgeonfish.

 

[jayc]

Sorry about your tang luck. I had the same promblem with my 29gal.

I wanted a blue hippo tang really bad but the tank was just to small for it. Know I'm upgrading to a 55gal, and I might try to keep a hippo or yellow tang in it for awile. I know it'll eventually outgrow the tank and I'll have to upgrade or trade it in. Hope you get it all worked out.

 

[shawnd61]

jay, what is there to work out?? from what ive heard, i cant keep a tang in my tank. i need to either:
1. lessen the amount of lr in the tank so it has more room
2.have it be the only fish in my tank
3.get a bigger tank
none of which are going to happen. i love my lr scaping. i enjoy different kinds of fish in my tank--thats why i only have community fish. and i dont have the room for a larger tank. so for the time i have to sleep in the bed that i made and deal w/ what i have to work w/.
i just figured that 46g was much better than any living condition in a lfs. i mean, there was an adult clown trigger in a 50g cube@ the lfs for about 6mnths until it either died or it was sold. if a fish that large can fit in that tank, i thought for sure that i could have a juvy tang in mine for a couple of yrs unitl it grew to be larger.
if any1 has any more ideas about how i can pull it off, or anything else that i might be doint wrong let me know. i surely dont want to maek the same mistake 3 times.

 

[jayc]

What I meant by "all worked out" was you found some kind of fish that would work. Have you thought about a dwarf angel? They are really perty and dont get really big. Maybe you could try one of them.

 

[shawnd61]

i had a cherub and he nipped at my feather duster. so i think those are a no unless there are others that dont do that.

 

[dskidmore]

a) Do you have a grounding probe? If not, do you have a voltmeter to measure the voltage in your tank? (Measure between tank water and grounding screw on an electrial socket.)
b) What were you feeding them?
c) Were they showing signs of ick or HLLE before death? (See Disease forum sticky for details.)

 

[ophiura]

I understand what your saying. There are a whole lot of fish I really want to keep, and a whole lot that would probably be relatively better off under my care than in an LFS tank. But with that logic, I can get away with anything. The key to true success in the hobby is to know and respect the limitations of your tank. :yes: IMO, you can add another fish, but not a school of chromis. Maybe a dwarf angel, maybe a small species of wrasse, but you already have quite a lot and in, I might add, a young tank. IMO, anything under a year is still a pretty young tank.

 

[stone]

Ok, Im not sure I understand. Im not tring to be a smart guy or anything. Your telling me that a tang the size of a quarter died from 46 gallon tank?
mike

 

[vwbortoni]

Ok.... I'm going to get flamed big time... but anyway here it goes...
Over a year ago I bought an established 55g (4 foot long) tank from someone in the area. It was my first SW tank. It came with 1 fish, 2 shrimp, some snails etc...
The fish was a ... Blue Hippo. <I now get ready for your attacks> The guy had had him for over 4 years. Heck he was even using tap water to replace evaporated water, he was using silica sand... etc... bad.
I took it over, added more LR now have about 70lbs. Added live sand, got a skimmer, added more circulation....
I've since added a Yellow Tang, 2 false percs, and a chromie. Hippo is happy as a clam (of which I have 2 --- the cleaner variety).
I know that everyone frowns on this... and I understand. She eats a ton, recognizes when I approach and all is well. Tang now going on 5+ years in a 55.
That's my story... some day in the future I'll get a 6 foot tank, when I do I expect my hippo to be happy there too.
Don't get me wrong... I don't advocate this, in fact I would advise against it to anyone thinking of trying this. I do believe that, since just like people are all different, I got a tang that does well in this setup. I think it is the exception rather than the rule.
So my advice is ... that tank is way too small for a tang. Maybe a Yellow maybe... but not a hippo.

 

[ophiura]

IMO, no it did not. However, the mortality rate on them is high, and thrown in with other fish in a small tank, if can have issues with trying to get food, or aggression, stress, etc. I don't believe the tang died specifically from being in that size tank. But there are some tanks - especially young tanks - that just seem to be unable to sustain tangs. IMO, if you want a tang in that size tank, it is basically "the" fish in the tank. You don't fill it with a bunch of other fish.
There can be any number of reasons the tang died, but the question is how many do you want to keep trying before you give it a pass? It is not like it is a fish that everyone agrees would be fine in that size tank. A Kole tang is, IME, one of the more adaptable tangs so long as their mouth is in good shape. So a Kole and a Regal are dead...how many to keep trying?
If it were me, and I really wanted a Kole tang (IMO, not a regal though), I would perhaps get rid of a fish or two, let the tank mature several more months, make sure water quality is top notch (also check the stray voltage FWIW)...and give it a go with the clear understanding that the tank is not suitable long term (after a couple of years at most) and you are not going to get a bunch of fish in there. That is the definite trade off.

 

[bang guy]

Originally Posted by Stone
Ok, Im not sure I understand. Im not tring to be a smart guy or anything. Your telling me that a tang the size of a quarter died from 46 gallon tank?
mike
The chances of keeping an open water swimmer in a 3 foot tank are slim. It happens occationally but fails usually.
I have never ever seen an old Tang in anything shorter than a 6 foot tank. 5 - 6 years and something gets them. Disease, stress, whatever, it just doesn't work long term.