Help me make a sump/refugium for this situation!

seecrabrun

seecrabrun

Active Member
I'm trying to create more room for pods to grow in tank for my dragonet. I was going to do a refugium in a 2 gallon glass jar on the table next to the tank, but then decided I should do a full blown sump to replace my canister.

The only area I have to work with is the area that the white drawers sit with the canister on top. I need to figure out how to make a sump work there. The space is actually just big enough for a standard 10 gallon tank, which I happen to have empty, but only if the long side is against the table the tank is on. So it would take up the same space as the drawers there now.

I was thinking of building a basic wooden stand to keep the sump off the floor, but maybe do a cabinet to help protect the sump from the kids.

I need to figure out the inside design of the sump. I am most concerned about encouraging pods to grow and being able to get the ground dwelling ones back up into the tank. So I'm thinking baffles between the refugium and return aren't a good idea? What do you think?

I'll need to figure out an overflow and plumbing that will work on the short side, as I don't have access to the back from this side.

I'd really love any input that you can give!

tank2.jpg
 
lmforbis

lmforbis

Well-Known Member
I have the refugium in the middle of my sump. All I have to do is shake up the chaeto every couple days and they flow over the baffles and into the display tank. there are enough coming through that I can see them crawling on the glass afterwards.
 
pegasus

pegasus

Well-Known Member
Another option would be to design a cabinet above the tank and use a gravity feed refugium. A small pump to push water into the fuge, and an overflow to drain back into the tank. This way, the pods won't have to enter the tank through a pump. Most copepods will survive the violent entry into a pump's impeller, but amphipods may not get so lucky. Gravity feed will insure that all make it to the tank alive and well. Those that try to get back may not fare so well... lol!

You might want to consider a sturdier cabinet to hold both tanks if you choose this option...
 
seecrabrun

seecrabrun

Active Member
Yeah that was an idea that was bounced around when trying to design the refugium but there isn't a way to put a cabinet above the tank without obstructing the window, which is not an option.

The situation is not ideal because I want the tank in this spot. It isn't the most ideal place functionally, but for us to enjoy it it is the best place aesthetically.

The idea I had was to put a sock on the intake that was fine enough to keep the large guys out but let the little guys in.

Or to have a sponge filter between the refugium and return and only send pods up on purpose by removing the sponge and shaking up the contents.
 
seecrabrun

seecrabrun

Active Member
Though I won't be relying on the tank solely for pod cultivation. I've got my farm set up and it seems as though it is going well. I've started seeing more on the glass, so I've been harvesting a little each day for the tank. I figure as long as I have him in the 20H I'll be culturing pods, especially as I plan to add more fish eventually, though not another that relies on pods.

The refugium/sump is just to allow me to go longer between harvests. Instead of every day, once a week. I am going to assume it will always be this much work, that way I will be prepared. It's very likely after a year it will be self sustaining, but I'm not going to consider it until it actually happens. That way I won't get lazy.

Things eventually will change as well. I have the plans for a 75 or 90 in the next couple of years. I was going to do it this year, but I decided to focus on what I have currently. It will need to happen, but doesn't have to be this year. I have 1 fish that will need the space as it grows. So I know I can put it off another year. When I do set up the 75/90 and it is old enough, I may move the dragonet to it. Which will make this setup a bit obsolete, but that's a far away option.
 
Last edited:
beaslbob

beaslbob

Well-Known Member
seecrabrun said:
What size tank is that on in the picture? Thing I worry about is space, as the overflow and return will both need to hang on the short side of the tank.
Click to expand...
That was my test setup and is a 10g tank. but the diameter of the pvc is setup for much larger tanks up to say 150-200 g or so. The overflow had not trouble keeping up with a mag 7 pump pumping against at 4' head (height). I think I used 1 1/2 diameter pvc.

You can size that down for small tanks to whatever you think is good. that is one thing good about diy. Plus the $3-$10-$20 costs allows for plenty of experimentation.

I recommend you setup a test unit using cheapy plastic storage containers in your garage and play with that until you can have no flood during power out, normal operation returns with power return, and no display flood when drain fails (blockage/siphon break).

my .02
 
seecrabrun

seecrabrun

Active Member
Looks like I may be redoing my 29g setup so I can use its stand for the 20 and have the sump in the bottom.

Then plumbing will be on back. Sump will still be the 10g but inside the stand.

This is that stand.
stand.jpg
 
pegasus

pegasus

Well-Known Member
Not sure why I didn't think of it sooner, but a shelf beside the tank could hold your 10 gallon tank... if you want to use a gravity-feed setup. Just another option thrown on the table... lol!
 
bang guy

bang guy

Moderator
seecrabrun said:
My head height will be pretty short. Probably 2' max.
Click to expand...
Just so everyone else understands what head height is: It's the difference between the water level in the display tank and the water level in the sump compartment the pump is in. Just remember it's the water levels that determine head height, not the location of the containers.
 
seecrabrun

seecrabrun

Active Member
Indeed. Head height will be different now though. I'll be putting it all on a stand I have with a cabinet and plumbing from the back down.

I need to figure out flow rate and decide on a pump. And also the overflow and build the baffles.
 
seecrabrun

seecrabrun

Active Member
Can anyone recommend a good flow rate for a refugium only?

I was thinking a 4x turnover, but that's only 100gph? The capacity of the refugium will likely be 6-7 gallons after everything is added. I believe the total volume of my tank is 17-18 gallons, so together that would be 23-24 gallons of water between the two. Should I aim for something higher?
 
seecrabrun

seecrabrun

Active Member
Nothing like breaking a tank and 2 sheets of glass and wasting time building an acrylic box... to then resize you could have just used a food storage container.........

Doh!!!
 
seecrabrun

seecrabrun

Active Member
I received my return pump today and I plan to use flexible hosing for it, but what do you use for the end to spray the water?
 
bang guy

bang guy

Moderator
I've done extensive (non-scientific) testing on refugiums, I can look at my notes on best results but I first need to know what you are protecting in your refugium.
 
bang guy

bang guy

Moderator
8X directly from the display with flow only across the refugium surface gave me the best results for Harpacticoid Copepods. If you have a free-swimming or non-benthic variety you will want a lower flow rate.

You might want some other animal in there to help clean up detritus like Hair Worms or a Black Sea Cucumber.
 
seecrabrun

seecrabrun

Active Member
Thank you. I will be focusing on tisbe pods, which are a small harpacticoid pod.

I had been thinking of doing 4-5x you say 8 would be better?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top