415 Gallon Plywood Tank Build

kzoobenjamin

New Member
Hopefully this drawing can illustrate a little better. It might not even be an issue at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by acrylic51 http:///forum/thread/376802/415-gallon-plywood-tank-build/720#post_3350086
Ben are you referring to not squaring the corner cuts of the dado cut square? I'm pretty sure I'm following you, since I advocate never doing corners in acrylic squared, but using a radius to relieve the stress from the corner, but I'm not totally sure if it would apply here in this case or not???? Hadn't really thought about it till you mentioned it though. I don't really see how it would be putting any unnecessary stress on the corner? It would be no different in my mind then building a tank out of acrylic. Your panels or ends aren't radius. Your bracing is???? Please elaborate a little more on your thinking????
 

acrylic51

Active Member
Very cool Ben.....I was following you to a degree, and will have to ask that question. The thought had crossed my mind about stress, just haven't been able to really determine if there would actually be any stress point in that area. I only question the "stress" because the panel lip will still have a support of almost 2" all the way around, same as using a straight panel where the "so called" stress in my mind would be on that 2" lip. Either way the acrylic panel would be overkill in the hope of going with thicker acrylic panel would reduce the stress load. The radius of the cutout would no way interfere with the installation of the panel. Either the glass or acrylic panel wouldn't technically make direct contact with the epoxied surface of the tank. It is sitting on tiny spacers to ensure the silicone or Dow 795 adhesive is equal all around the perimeter ensuring a proper seal. With the acrylic it would be a pressure seal vs being bonded to the tank as glass would be with the silicone.
As far the gelcoat "color pigment" your actually somewhat limited, but like I said I remembered the tech guy at West saying of another option they found to tint the epoxy. I did try finding it at the local craft stores around right after he told me about it, but the craft places didn't carry a wide range of colors. The bad thing about actually gelcoat pigment is that the color range is very limited, and the basic colors are white, black, red, green, yellow, brown, and dark blue......The dark blue is dark.......
I tossed and turned last night trying to decide what I want to do as far as the background.....I've come to a conclusion that to ease my mind that the background would be properly embedded within the epoxy coat, that the background would have to be cut short in several areas.....As Desertdawg pointed out and suggested cutting the background holes for the bulkheads bigger than the actually bulkheads to allow for the edges of the bulkhead holes to be sealed and blended with the rest of the epoxy......I'm planning on using 2" sched 80 bulkheads in the tank. I got use to using sched 80 bullkheads with my last build and love the way they are built and they are heavy duty and should be used when drilling the bottoms or for CL in a tank IMHO......With that being said the hole size needed just for the bulkhead is 3 1/4", so I would drill the initial bulkhead hole 3 1/2" to give me a 1/4" buildup of epoxy on the inside of the hole.....In my mind I'm thinking I should cut the holes in the background to 4"-5" to ensure myself plenty of area to bond and blend the epoxy to seal the background in place????
My other area of concern with the background is around the perimeter; where I wanted to run it right to the edges, I would feel better cutting it roughly 1 1/2" - 2" from the edges of the perimeter of the tank. I think were I have reservation is possibly the look of having the background shortened 2" on each end and 2" on the top and bottom.....I don't think it will be much of an issue with the background being shortened 2" on the top and bottom, because of rock work and everything else, but I think it might become a distraction on the sides of the background?????
So guys need your opinion or thoughts on cutting the background 2" short on top, bottoom and sides, and cutting the area of where the bulkheads will go as well...????? Thoughts/Opinions needed/wanted....getting anxious to get the back of the tank done....
 

acrylic51

Active Member
Ahhh, just got of the phone with tech's at West System Epoxy, and the idea of embedding the background is scrapped.....the chances of getting a perfectly water tight seal are slim, and I'm not willing to take that chance at this point of the project.....To much time and money invested to have background undermine or compromise my build, so the back will not incorporate the background material for peace of my own mind.....
On another note, he did refresh my mind on the pigment that can be used with epoxy other than gelcoat pigment. Tempura powder paint is another excellent choice and Chalkline Chalk powder is another good option for tinting epoxy.....So looks like I'll be hitting up the local craft stores again.....
 

gemmy

Active Member
Aww, that bites about the background. I definitely would do the same thing, if someone told me that prognosis. It is truly going to be an amazing build.
 

desertdawg

Member
Thats why I asked about the chance of getting a leak into the void since it opened up so easily when you drilled the test piece.
Now, time to try a test pour fading from dark to light, maybe you can still achieve the same depth with a blend...
Something like this only blue top to black bottom.
 

1snapple

Active Member
That would look freaking amazing, Go light blue, then dark blue in the middle close to the bottom, then sandy off white.
 

2quills

Well-Known Member
Shawn would it be possible to paint the tinted coat on with a brush or roller to get a fade effect with two different colors and then pour one more coat on over that or does it all have to be poured?
 

acrylic51

Active Member
He didn't say I couldn't just the concept of the epoxy not adhering to the Backgroung increase the possibility of a leak!!!!
The plan before the background idea was to tint it black, I was just trying to be different and push the limits of another aspect that hasn't been done on this style tank to the best of my knowledge. As far as fading the epoxy, that is rather slim as well. The biggest obstacle is finding the tint. As I said earlier pigment is slim as far as choices. I checked the local craft places and they only carry the liquid Tempura paint. The problem arises with certain types of pigment; tint, is you don't really know how it will affect how the epoxy will setup and how long it delays it's cure. Mixing to much liquid pigment could also cause the epoxy to to completely cure, so that's another thought I have to keep in the back of my mind as far as pigment.
Gemmy I'm gonna have to get busy an dig those measurements up for the area.
 

acrylic51

Active Member
Josh the issue I finding the powder pigment..... You will usually find the liquid pigment, and don't want to use the liquid Tempura paint. Painting epoxy with a brush isn't easy and the epoxy has a self leveling tendency to getting it to stay and adequate coverage might be an issue. Your suppose to use special rollers designed for epoxy, and have heard great things as far as rolling the epoxy. The issue is injecting air bubbles into the mix, and we go back to the finish being undermined with tons of bubble possibilities!!!
 

kzoobenjamin

New Member
Tempera powder:
http://www.dickblick.com/products/rich-art-fresco-dry-tempera/
Since we're talking paint anyway, here is one of those "in for a penny, in for a pound" ideas. Pour the back to whatever thickness you normally would to be water tight using white. Have a local artist paint a seascape on the back, and then do a clear pour over the top of that, sealing it between the two layers. I don't know if tempera paint would work for that but you could easily test it.
Benjamin
 

2quills

Well-Known Member
Could spraying the epoxy be an option? I know some of the spray guns that I was looking at said they work with epoxies.
 

desertdawg

Member
So how about attaching 3 tubs to a stick, mix your epoxy in 3 equal amounts, 1/3 in each tub.
Now mix in the Turquoise, Blue, and Black from the link above in each tub and pour all the way across the back so they spread sort of equally...
What do ya think ????
 

acrylic51

Active Member
You know what???? If they put a few of us in the same room we could be dangerous.... Honestly I don't know if we'd be dangerous to the public or ourselves!!!!!:laughing:
Desertdawg your creativity is there, but what's limiting is color choices. The blues that are available are way to dark!!! That kind of is what's frustrating, because you have unlimited ideas, but color choices limit what you can do....with that being said I not totally down. I had all day at work to think an came up with the idea of scuffimg the background material on both sides to see if I canaletto the epoxy bite/bond with the background. Right now I have a small test piece working, and hopefully tomorrow I'll be able to report it works.
Corey you might know how the background felt. Kinda slippery; waxy feeling sorta..... What I did was try to scuff the gloss finish off of it. Didn't look to bad after taking 60 grit sandpaper to it....lost it's gloss, but once the epoxy hit it looked as good as new....
 
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