Abortion...So here's your thread
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rudedog40
Member
Originally Posted by Clown Boy
When it comes to whether or not to kill your child, it is more than just your business. It's your child's business. And he/she has a right.
Uh, as far as I'm concerned, until it pops out and starts cryin, it's not mine. You want to save every 'baby' that's aborted? Go right ahead. You head down to Planned Parenthood right now and tell them that every woman that comes in to have an abortion, you'll pay for all their expenses to have that child. Once that baby is born, it's yours to adopt and raise. Just don't come asking for some of my tax dollars to help you take care of them.
Oh noooo, that's not your problem. If the woman didn't want a baby, she or her significant other should have used birth control. LOLOL. Go down tp the Southside and tell that to the 14 year old that just got knocked up AGAIN by her 17 year old boyfriend because 'wrapping' it isn't the machismo thing to do.
The truth of the matter is, women have unwanted pregnancies for whatever reason every day. The Pro-Lifers don't want these women to abort the babies, but provide no solution as to what to do with an unwanted child. You spout the 'there's plenty of people looking for adoptable babies' theory. But I don't see these people running down to the hospital where a crack baby was just born. Nooooo. We don't want 'those' babies. So you want the unwed, uneducated 14 year old to have the kid. Sure, let Mom and Dad raise it. Better yet, that's what Welfare is for. Look at the current history in San Antonio of unwanted children. In the last year, we've had at least 10 kids murdered by their parents because they didn't want them. If those kids would have been aborted, they never would have had to endure the physical and emotional violence they felt when the Mom or Dad hit them repeatedly until they died.
Is it a matter of convenience? Maybe. But it's their body, not the child's thats inside them. What you want to do is give a fetus that has no sense or logical mind, to have the same rights as a grown person. If that's the case, why not let a 1 year old vote for President? Let them drink! They can at least say yes and no. You don't let a child make any legal decisions for themselves in today's world until they turn 18. But you want a embryo that doesn't even know it's alive to have the right to tell it's Mother what to do. Sounds a little backwards to me.
When it comes to whether or not to kill your child, it is more than just your business. It's your child's business. And he/she has a right.
Uh, as far as I'm concerned, until it pops out and starts cryin, it's not mine. You want to save every 'baby' that's aborted? Go right ahead. You head down to Planned Parenthood right now and tell them that every woman that comes in to have an abortion, you'll pay for all their expenses to have that child. Once that baby is born, it's yours to adopt and raise. Just don't come asking for some of my tax dollars to help you take care of them.
Oh noooo, that's not your problem. If the woman didn't want a baby, she or her significant other should have used birth control. LOLOL. Go down tp the Southside and tell that to the 14 year old that just got knocked up AGAIN by her 17 year old boyfriend because 'wrapping' it isn't the machismo thing to do.
The truth of the matter is, women have unwanted pregnancies for whatever reason every day. The Pro-Lifers don't want these women to abort the babies, but provide no solution as to what to do with an unwanted child. You spout the 'there's plenty of people looking for adoptable babies' theory. But I don't see these people running down to the hospital where a crack baby was just born. Nooooo. We don't want 'those' babies. So you want the unwed, uneducated 14 year old to have the kid. Sure, let Mom and Dad raise it. Better yet, that's what Welfare is for. Look at the current history in San Antonio of unwanted children. In the last year, we've had at least 10 kids murdered by their parents because they didn't want them. If those kids would have been aborted, they never would have had to endure the physical and emotional violence they felt when the Mom or Dad hit them repeatedly until they died.
Is it a matter of convenience? Maybe. But it's their body, not the child's thats inside them. What you want to do is give a fetus that has no sense or logical mind, to have the same rights as a grown person. If that's the case, why not let a 1 year old vote for President? Let them drink! They can at least say yes and no. You don't let a child make any legal decisions for themselves in today's world until they turn 18. But you want a embryo that doesn't even know it's alive to have the right to tell it's Mother what to do. Sounds a little backwards to me.
clown boy
Active Member
Originally Posted by jonthefishguy
Obviously your statement confirmed what I had suspected which is you have absolutely NO IDEA what you are talking about and just rambling on and on. You missed the point he was trying to make which was that MORE PEOPLE DIE OF GUNS, CIGARS, CIGARETTES AND THE SUCH. Not to mention achohol. People die from side effects from these drugs everyday. Your 9/11 comment had NOTHING to do with this topic. So until you actually have something educational to say instead of just rambling nonsense, it might be better to just sit on the sideline and participate ONLY when you have something related to the topic instead.
You may want to check this out.
http://www.htmlbible.com/abortstats.htm
Obviously your statement confirmed what I had suspected which is you have absolutely NO IDEA what you are talking about and just rambling on and on. You missed the point he was trying to make which was that MORE PEOPLE DIE OF GUNS, CIGARS, CIGARETTES AND THE SUCH. Not to mention achohol. People die from side effects from these drugs everyday. Your 9/11 comment had NOTHING to do with this topic. So until you actually have something educational to say instead of just rambling nonsense, it might be better to just sit on the sideline and participate ONLY when you have something related to the topic instead.
You may want to check this out.
http://www.htmlbible.com/abortstats.htm
clown boy
Active Member
Originally Posted by rudedog40
You don't let a child make any legal decisions for themselves in today's world until they turn 18. But you want a embryo that doesn't even know it's alive to have the right to tell it's Mother what to do. Sounds a little backwards to me.
No, I don't think that I child should be able to tell it's mother what to do. But when it comes to life and death, the line is drawn.
You don't let a child make any legal decisions for themselves in today's world until they turn 18. But you want a embryo that doesn't even know it's alive to have the right to tell it's Mother what to do. Sounds a little backwards to me.
No, I don't think that I child should be able to tell it's mother what to do. But when it comes to life and death, the line is drawn.
clown boy
Active Member
Originally Posted by rudedog40
Uh, as far as I'm concerned, until it pops out and starts cryin, it's not mine. You want to save every 'baby' that's aborted? Go right ahead. You head down to Planned Parenthood right now and tell them that every woman that comes in to have an abortion, you'll pay for all their expenses to have that child. Once that baby is born, it's yours to adopt and raise. Just don't come asking for some of my tax dollars to help you take care of them.
Oh, but several friends of mine and I HAVE done that. Standing outside the abortion clinics with signs reading "Don't kill your child! Give it to us, and we will raise it!" A little girl was saved this way.
Uh, as far as I'm concerned, until it pops out and starts cryin, it's not mine. You want to save every 'baby' that's aborted? Go right ahead. You head down to Planned Parenthood right now and tell them that every woman that comes in to have an abortion, you'll pay for all their expenses to have that child. Once that baby is born, it's yours to adopt and raise. Just don't come asking for some of my tax dollars to help you take care of them.
Oh, but several friends of mine and I HAVE done that. Standing outside the abortion clinics with signs reading "Don't kill your child! Give it to us, and we will raise it!" A little girl was saved this way.
jonthefishguy
Active Member
Originally Posted by Clown Boy
You may want to check this out.
http://www.htmlbible.com/abortstats.htm
Sorry I dont read ANYTHING from bible beaters. It ALWAYS has a tendency of being biased in any and ALL topics relating to religion, life, and anything they feel strongly about.
You may want to check this out.
http://www.htmlbible.com/abortstats.htm
Sorry I dont read ANYTHING from bible beaters. It ALWAYS has a tendency of being biased in any and ALL topics relating to religion, life, and anything they feel strongly about.
jonthefishguy
Active Member
Originally Posted by Clown Boy
So who has a closed mind here?
Its not close mindedness. It would be close minded to not read or listen to it because I thought I was right and no other way. Meaning I am right you are wrong, nothing you can say will make it true. That is exactly what bible beaters do. They dont listen to reason and already sit on their side of the fence, waiving their black book of ficticious stories telling them they are sinners and how there are other ways but fall short of hading out financial help, mental help or anything for that matter other than a pamplet. Forgetting that their god gave those that are so called sinners the same choice as they do, which is free will. Even though this has sidetracked a bit, the point I was making is that I am not close minded. I see how it isnt the best choice for all, however if it really doesnt effect you..stay out of it. If you want to do something to save lives, start with something smaller and less controversial. When you succeed in that, then do something else, once you show you have a history of changing the world, come back and discuss a better solution.
So who has a closed mind here?
Its not close mindedness. It would be close minded to not read or listen to it because I thought I was right and no other way. Meaning I am right you are wrong, nothing you can say will make it true. That is exactly what bible beaters do. They dont listen to reason and already sit on their side of the fence, waiving their black book of ficticious stories telling them they are sinners and how there are other ways but fall short of hading out financial help, mental help or anything for that matter other than a pamplet. Forgetting that their god gave those that are so called sinners the same choice as they do, which is free will. Even though this has sidetracked a bit, the point I was making is that I am not close minded. I see how it isnt the best choice for all, however if it really doesnt effect you..stay out of it. If you want to do something to save lives, start with something smaller and less controversial. When you succeed in that, then do something else, once you show you have a history of changing the world, come back and discuss a better solution.
rylan1
Active Member
I believe it to be wrong. I do in some ways feel that it is a pro-choice issue, I do however agree with a woman's body being a "harboring area or baby home" that was stated in an ealier thread. People that do it, are going to have to live with themselves and the decision they made. It is a mark on your soul. People must also think of the possible complications that come as a result of having this done. The motivation for the act is mostly selfish, and usually comes as a result of irresponsible behavior. There are many other options ... there are many families who would love to have a new addition to their family but can't because of medical reasons. Adoption is probably the best alternative. However, because people are selfish and don't want the guilt associated with giving a child up so they most often don't choose this option.
This is a moral issue which is why its so hard to come up with a common agreement. People are usually scared and not sure if they could raise a child and they don't want one interupting their life. But they have no idea of their potential or that child's potential. Children are gifts!
This is a moral issue which is why its so hard to come up with a common agreement. People are usually scared and not sure if they could raise a child and they don't want one interupting their life. But they have no idea of their potential or that child's potential. Children are gifts!
clown boy
Active Member
Originally Posted by jonthefishguy
Its not close mindedness. It would be close minded to not read or listen to it because I thought I was right and no other way. Meaning I am right you are wrong, nothing you can say will make it true. That is exactly what bible beaters do. They dont listen to reason and already sit on their side of the fence, waiving their black book of ficticious stories telling them they are sinners and how there are other ways but fall short of hading out financial help, mental help or anything for that matter other than a pamplet. Forgetting that their god gave those that are so called sinners the same choice as they do, which is free will. Even though this has sidetracked a bit, the point I was making is that I am not close minded. I see how it isnt the best choice for all, however if it really doesnt effect you..stay out of it. If you want to do something to save lives, start with something smaller and less controversial. When you succeed in that, then do something else, once you show you have a history of changing the world, come back and discuss a better solution.
Even if it means standing by and letting people plunge into hell (whether you believe in it or not)? Even if it means just standing by and letting people choose to kill their children? No man in his right mind would do that.
Have you ever heard of the story of the firefighter who just stood by listening to music and let innocent people be killed by flames in a burning building? He was charged with their murder. What is the difference between this and letting innocent children be killed without a fight?
Its not close mindedness. It would be close minded to not read or listen to it because I thought I was right and no other way. Meaning I am right you are wrong, nothing you can say will make it true. That is exactly what bible beaters do. They dont listen to reason and already sit on their side of the fence, waiving their black book of ficticious stories telling them they are sinners and how there are other ways but fall short of hading out financial help, mental help or anything for that matter other than a pamplet. Forgetting that their god gave those that are so called sinners the same choice as they do, which is free will. Even though this has sidetracked a bit, the point I was making is that I am not close minded. I see how it isnt the best choice for all, however if it really doesnt effect you..stay out of it. If you want to do something to save lives, start with something smaller and less controversial. When you succeed in that, then do something else, once you show you have a history of changing the world, come back and discuss a better solution.
Even if it means standing by and letting people plunge into hell (whether you believe in it or not)? Even if it means just standing by and letting people choose to kill their children? No man in his right mind would do that.
Have you ever heard of the story of the firefighter who just stood by listening to music and let innocent people be killed by flames in a burning building? He was charged with their murder. What is the difference between this and letting innocent children be killed without a fight?
jonthefishguy
Active Member
Originally Posted by Clown Boy
What is the difference between this and letting innocent children be killed without a fight?
That isnt even the same thing, not even in the same ballpark. He got charged because he is legally required to respond and assist if he has the knowledge, training to do so. This is why nurses, drs, and all medical staff that are trained in saving lives HAVE to respond in a situation at hand if it is infront of them until those who can take over, do so. You are just pulling stuff out of your bottom and trying to fit it in here. By the way, failing to stop and render aid is a crime to all not just those who are trained. Just depends on the situation. However, you are neither a dr in this field nor are you a priest so.....
What is the difference between this and letting innocent children be killed without a fight?
That isnt even the same thing, not even in the same ballpark. He got charged because he is legally required to respond and assist if he has the knowledge, training to do so. This is why nurses, drs, and all medical staff that are trained in saving lives HAVE to respond in a situation at hand if it is infront of them until those who can take over, do so. You are just pulling stuff out of your bottom and trying to fit it in here. By the way, failing to stop and render aid is a crime to all not just those who are trained. Just depends on the situation. However, you are neither a dr in this field nor are you a priest so.....
jtrzerocool
Active Member
Originally Posted by Clown Boy
Even if it means standing by and letting people plunge into hell (whether you believe in it or not)? Even if it means just standing by and letting people choose to kill their children? No man in his right mind would do that.
Have you ever heard of the story of the firefighter who just stood by listening to music and let innocent people be killed by flames in a burning building? He was charged with their murder. What is the difference between this and letting innocent children be killed without a fight?
this still leads back to when you concider a fetus a child...i dont concider it a child until after birth...this thing is going round and round...
Even if it means standing by and letting people plunge into hell (whether you believe in it or not)? Even if it means just standing by and letting people choose to kill their children? No man in his right mind would do that.
Have you ever heard of the story of the firefighter who just stood by listening to music and let innocent people be killed by flames in a burning building? He was charged with their murder. What is the difference between this and letting innocent children be killed without a fight?
this still leads back to when you concider a fetus a child...i dont concider it a child until after birth...this thing is going round and round...
stdreb27
Active Member
Originally Posted by rudedog40
Vote another bible thumper into Office, and you may get your wish. Every Republican has the pro-life mentality. The law states when an embyro becomes a human life. The problem with the pro-choicers is they think life begins when the $perm enters the egg. The fanatic pro-lifers want to ban embryo storage for parents who may want a child later in life.
I also like stdreb27's answer to perfectdark. Where do you think those 'statistics' come from? Maybe from pro-lifers? Where are the independent studies from organizations that are not biased? All your facts come from data compiled by pro-lifers. Look at pro-choice data, and the numbers are completely different.
Keep the government out of MY business. Hey, why stop at abortion? Let's completely ban the ownership of guns and not allow ANY smoking -- cigars, pipes, or cigarettes. Those two kill more people than abortion. Don't see you getting on the crusade to stop those practices.
wow, sure I don't think I've seen anybody quote scripture on here, but sure try to insult some ones beliefs. Maybe I'll start calling evolutionists monkeythumper. maybe leave out the t... hehe sorry bad joke.
I'd also challenge you to show otherwise to my statement. I'll get back to you about the source of my numbers. The problem is I usually remember numbers not sources. So I'll have to go find it.
As far as your ban of cigars pipes and such, the libs are trying that all over the country, increased tobacco taxes, city wide smoking bans, in bars, restarants ect. I do see crusades how can you not?
As far as stats to (I have a econ degree stats heavy major) I agree I'd say most stats are going to be skewed either way you look at it as you can see and experience this is usually a very heated debate leaves very little room for objectivity. But according to the FBI there were 94,635 rapes in the US. So oppose that to 1.6 million abortions (planned parenthood) The numbers just don't add up. Even if every case resulted in conception. Throw in the genetic birth defects according to march of dimes 1 in 33 babies have birth defects from cleft lips to more serious problems. There were a little more than 6 million pregancies in the us each year. Multiply that our your still only looking at about 200,000 babies. So add those numbers together we are talking about 300,000 dead babies due to ---- or genetic defect including miscarrages. So I don't know. it is just math and people can do whatever they want to skew it to fit their point of view.
Vote another bible thumper into Office, and you may get your wish. Every Republican has the pro-life mentality. The law states when an embyro becomes a human life. The problem with the pro-choicers is they think life begins when the $perm enters the egg. The fanatic pro-lifers want to ban embryo storage for parents who may want a child later in life.
I also like stdreb27's answer to perfectdark. Where do you think those 'statistics' come from? Maybe from pro-lifers? Where are the independent studies from organizations that are not biased? All your facts come from data compiled by pro-lifers. Look at pro-choice data, and the numbers are completely different.
Keep the government out of MY business. Hey, why stop at abortion? Let's completely ban the ownership of guns and not allow ANY smoking -- cigars, pipes, or cigarettes. Those two kill more people than abortion. Don't see you getting on the crusade to stop those practices.
wow, sure I don't think I've seen anybody quote scripture on here, but sure try to insult some ones beliefs. Maybe I'll start calling evolutionists monkeythumper. maybe leave out the t... hehe sorry bad joke.
I'd also challenge you to show otherwise to my statement. I'll get back to you about the source of my numbers. The problem is I usually remember numbers not sources. So I'll have to go find it.
As far as your ban of cigars pipes and such, the libs are trying that all over the country, increased tobacco taxes, city wide smoking bans, in bars, restarants ect. I do see crusades how can you not?
As far as stats to (I have a econ degree stats heavy major) I agree I'd say most stats are going to be skewed either way you look at it as you can see and experience this is usually a very heated debate leaves very little room for objectivity. But according to the FBI there were 94,635 rapes in the US. So oppose that to 1.6 million abortions (planned parenthood) The numbers just don't add up. Even if every case resulted in conception. Throw in the genetic birth defects according to march of dimes 1 in 33 babies have birth defects from cleft lips to more serious problems. There were a little more than 6 million pregancies in the us each year. Multiply that our your still only looking at about 200,000 babies. So add those numbers together we are talking about 300,000 dead babies due to ---- or genetic defect including miscarrages. So I don't know. it is just math and people can do whatever they want to skew it to fit their point of view.
rylan1
Active Member
Originally Posted by rudedog40
Uh, as far as I'm concerned, until it pops out and starts cryin, it's not mine. You want to save every 'baby' that's aborted? Go right ahead. You head down to Planned Parenthood right now and tell them that every woman that comes in to have an abortion, you'll pay for all their expenses to have that child. Once that baby is born, it's yours to adopt and raise. Just don't come asking for some of my tax dollars to help you take care of them.
Oh noooo, that's not your problem. If the woman didn't want a baby, she or her significant other should have used birth control. LOLOL. Go down tp the Southside and tell that to the 14 year old that just got knocked up AGAIN by her 17 year old boyfriend because 'wrapping' it isn't the machismo thing to do.
The truth of the matter is, women have unwanted pregnancies for whatever reason every day. The Pro-Lifers don't want these women to abort the babies, but provide no solution as to what to do with an unwanted child. You spout the 'there's plenty of people looking for adoptable babies' theory. But I don't see these people running down to the hospital where a crack baby was just born. Nooooo. We don't want 'those' babies. So you want the unwed, uneducated 14 year old to have the kid. Sure, let Mom and Dad raise it. Better yet, that's what Welfare is for. Look at the current history in San Antonio of unwanted children. In the last year, we've had at least 10 kids murdered by their parents because they didn't want them. If those kids would have been aborted, they never would have had to endure the physical and emotional violence they felt when the Mom or Dad hit them repeatedly until they died.
Is it a matter of convenience? Maybe. But it's their body, not the child's thats inside them. What you want to do is give a fetus that has no sense or logical mind, to have the same rights as a grown person. If that's the case, why not let a 1 year old vote for President? Let them drink! They can at least say yes and no. You don't let a child make any legal decisions for themselves in today's world until they turn 18. But you want a embryo that doesn't even know it's alive to have the right to tell it's Mother what to do. Sounds a little backwards to me.
The parents already made the decision. Its not the baby's fault. What you are doing is stipping the parents of any accountablility. People treat this as if its a get out of jail free card, and its not... They may think it is.. but in time they will find out that they will be held accountable.
Babies/Children are unable to make decisions ... thats why we have rules and laws that tell them what they can and can't do.
The problem with your logic is that if a child had the ability to choose than they would choose life. We however are their caretakers and their ability to survive is based on us.
The problem I have with your logic is that this choice has nothing to do with the well being or the best intrests for the child, as the the things you mentioned above do. Its actually the complete opposite with someone willing to sacrifice a life so that they can keep the status quo or gain an advantage. In other scenarios this would be considered criminal.
Uh, as far as I'm concerned, until it pops out and starts cryin, it's not mine. You want to save every 'baby' that's aborted? Go right ahead. You head down to Planned Parenthood right now and tell them that every woman that comes in to have an abortion, you'll pay for all their expenses to have that child. Once that baby is born, it's yours to adopt and raise. Just don't come asking for some of my tax dollars to help you take care of them.
Oh noooo, that's not your problem. If the woman didn't want a baby, she or her significant other should have used birth control. LOLOL. Go down tp the Southside and tell that to the 14 year old that just got knocked up AGAIN by her 17 year old boyfriend because 'wrapping' it isn't the machismo thing to do.
The truth of the matter is, women have unwanted pregnancies for whatever reason every day. The Pro-Lifers don't want these women to abort the babies, but provide no solution as to what to do with an unwanted child. You spout the 'there's plenty of people looking for adoptable babies' theory. But I don't see these people running down to the hospital where a crack baby was just born. Nooooo. We don't want 'those' babies. So you want the unwed, uneducated 14 year old to have the kid. Sure, let Mom and Dad raise it. Better yet, that's what Welfare is for. Look at the current history in San Antonio of unwanted children. In the last year, we've had at least 10 kids murdered by their parents because they didn't want them. If those kids would have been aborted, they never would have had to endure the physical and emotional violence they felt when the Mom or Dad hit them repeatedly until they died.
Is it a matter of convenience? Maybe. But it's their body, not the child's thats inside them. What you want to do is give a fetus that has no sense or logical mind, to have the same rights as a grown person. If that's the case, why not let a 1 year old vote for President? Let them drink! They can at least say yes and no. You don't let a child make any legal decisions for themselves in today's world until they turn 18. But you want a embryo that doesn't even know it's alive to have the right to tell it's Mother what to do. Sounds a little backwards to me.
The parents already made the decision. Its not the baby's fault. What you are doing is stipping the parents of any accountablility. People treat this as if its a get out of jail free card, and its not... They may think it is.. but in time they will find out that they will be held accountable.
Babies/Children are unable to make decisions ... thats why we have rules and laws that tell them what they can and can't do.
The problem with your logic is that if a child had the ability to choose than they would choose life. We however are their caretakers and their ability to survive is based on us.
The problem I have with your logic is that this choice has nothing to do with the well being or the best intrests for the child, as the the things you mentioned above do. Its actually the complete opposite with someone willing to sacrifice a life so that they can keep the status quo or gain an advantage. In other scenarios this would be considered criminal.
clown boy
Active Member
Originally Posted by jtrzerocool
this still leads back to when you concider a fetus a child...i dont concider it a child until after birth...this thing is going round and round...
So you want me to convince you that it's a child in there and not a lump of tissue? Ask the government. When a pregnant woman is killed, the murderer is charged with two murders.
But then, I've said that before...
this still leads back to when you concider a fetus a child...i dont concider it a child until after birth...this thing is going round and round...
So you want me to convince you that it's a child in there and not a lump of tissue? Ask the government. When a pregnant woman is killed, the murderer is charged with two murders.
But then, I've said that before...