Another Introduced Species

hardcrab67

Member
Originally Posted by emmitt2
p.s.- any other board i'm on would have instantly banned you for this, so if nothing else that should show you are wrong about her!

Well if thats the case I wouldn't want to be on this forum anyway. I have only voiced my opinion and no obcene language. I live in the USA, not some third world country, and if boards are run like that count me out. No love lost
 

hardcrab67

Member
Originally Posted by MolaMola
Let me introduce you to my friend, the dolphin fish, otherwise known as mahimahi
Your funny, I don't see a smile on that fish and that wasn't the dolphin she was referring to. Read thread that we're talking about before putting your .02 in Thx.
 

tx reef

Active Member
Originally Posted by MolaMola
Let me introduce you to my friend, the dolphin fish, otherwise known as mahimahi

:hilarious

You beat me to it.
I was going to say the same thing.
A dolphin is a fish, a porpoise is a mammal...
 

mbrennan

Member
ANY introduced species can be a threat to the environment. They may be cute, beautiful a joy to have around, to you ... but to native wildlife are the harbinger of extinction. Florida has a tremendous problem with introduced species. Pythons are eating alligators in the Glades. Parrots are destroying fruit groves. Iguanas aren't that pleasent to be around when they are territorial, belligerant and not afraid of humans. It is against the law to introduce non-native species alive into the wild! Be it ocean, river, lake or field. It is evan against the law to remove an invasive species and release it live somewhwere else! I was on a jungle cruise the other day at Silver Springs. I was amazed at the lack of knowledge that our guide displayed about the native flora and fauna. To top it off a tourist asked if the introduced monkeys were protected. You name it hydrilla, monkeys, parakets, parrots, caimans, iguanas, nutria, pacas, peacocks, carp, snakeheads, walking catfish, oscars, iguanas, pythons, northerners, I could go on and on ... etc ... etc ... all are flourishing in sunny Florida. As a native Floridian I just wish that they would all go home! And thats all I'm saying about that.
 

ophiura

Active Member
Where...where did I put you in this bucket?
If you are aware of these issues, then kudos to you!
What are you doing to get the word out to others?
Three of MY quotes from that previous thread you reference (tang in a 55):
I don't quite understand though why are you are quoting me to some extent? From the sound of it, we are somewhat on the same page, though I do not assign "emotions" to fish because it is not my training to do so. If you wish to, then that is fine, but you won't win me over
. Note the smilie, because I am human and have human emotions. My current impression of your post is that its tone is a bit unfriendly at the least and that is not my intent at all. We are open to debate without demeaning each others perspective so if you took that from my post, well nothing personal was intended. :) Otherwise, I do believe we have a certain responsibility to care for these animals, and that may mean not keeping them in 55g tanks.
Look, it is the nature of debate....I can have my opinion, you can have yours, OK? I am FINE with your opinions...but I did NOT call you such names for yours, question your experience, etc, etc. In fact, I have apologized several times to you for nothing close to what you called me. I apologized, or tried to smooth things over, just IN CASE I offended you...("nothing personal was intended") even in this other thread.
You posted frankly HATEFUL things about someone you have NEVER met in the first post of this thread. I did NOTHING of the sort to you, so let's not equate the posts. Had you said what you said in your later post, first...without the personal insults...then we can debate. I appreciate your point of view.
The smiling fish is included because it is cute. very cute But, like the mouth of a dolpin, it may be nothing more than basic morphology and not the "happy dolphin" that we often think of.
(the question, BTW, was why this emoticon is offered --> :happyfish )
I know a dolphin is not a fish, I didn't feel the need to clarify the context. I didn't think it would be an issue...and if I did clarify it, well, I think it would have been a bit insulting, no?
I assume, regardless of your education, that you know it is not a fish, and that I do not have to explain that I was talking about a fish, but now I am talking about a dolphin in another sentence.
I, for example, would take one of those TINY regals and put it into a 30g reef to grow it up - but that is assuming it is THE fish and the intent is to grow it a bit to a bigger tank. I do not believe in the "no way no how" but I do believe that these are not fish that should be placed in a 4'tank for years on end. They should be a transient fish, and if your LFS does not take them back, or you will grow too attached to them, then I think it better that you NOT get one then to risk keeping it for years on end.
As for a tang in a 30g...I am not the tang police, and as I clearly stated in this quote, I believe that in some cases, with SUPER small tangs commonly sold (1-2"), that IMO (IN MY OPINION) it would be better to keep them as the only fish in a mature 30g to grow them larger, before putting them in with larger fish. You are taking some of my posts out of context. This does not mean LEAVE IT THERE. It means be responsible. I do not believe in "no way no how" tang keeping in small tanks EVER. I believe there are times it is appropriate, and I believe that we have to be responsible to know when to move them. And if we can't move them, can't appropriately care for them long term, then don't get them. And if the ultimate decision is forced on you, then kill it over releasing it.
There is a talk on this very topic at the upcoming Marine Aquarium Conference of North America.
Really, enjoy your opinions, let me be entitled to mine as well. You called me such names because of this disagreement? Well, I, as noted before DO have emotions...you said some extremely hurtful and nasty things when I did NOTHING of the sort to you. I don't believe fish have "emotions" You do, but I think we can agree that WE do...yet you don't seem to care about me?? Well, I hope your fish is happy :happyfish
...because you don't seem all that concerned about what you say to other people.

So here, ONCE AGAIN, I apologize for ANY thing I said to YOU that may have set you off due to my opinions. But oddly enough I do not expect anything in return.
 

gexkko

Member
Originally Posted by TX Reef
:hilarious

You beat me to it.
I was going to say the same thing.
A dolphin is a fish, a porpoise is a mammal...

I'm sorry, but you are very wrong. The "dolphin fish" is a fish. The various species of dolphins (bottlenose, spotted, etc) are mammals. A porpoise is also a mammal, but is distinctly different from dolphins. I can't give the exact taxonomic differences, but they are quite major and distinct.
 

gexkko

Member
In the context used, she was referring to the morphology of the dolphin "smile" as being similar to the apparent "emotional" behavior of the fish. Its our human interpretation of the world and an attempt to personify everything around us. The more "human" things are, the more comfortable they are for us.
Sorry, the thread seems to have been majorly hijacked and sidetracked, but I had to throw my .02 in there :)
 

ophiura

Active Member
Originally Posted by Gexkko
In the context used, she was referring to the morphology of the dolphin "smile" as being similar to the apparent "emotional" behavior of the fish. Its our human interpretation of the world and an attempt to personify everything around us. The more "human" things are, the more comfortable they are for us.
Sorry, the thread seems to have been majorly hijacked and sidetracked, but I had to throw my .02 in there :)

YES YES YES
THANKS!!! Explained much better than I did at the time, though I guess I should have :scared:
 

molamola

Member
Your funny, I don't see a smile on that fish and that wasn't the dolphin she was referring to. Read thread that we're talking about before putting your .02 in Thx.
Actually, I have read that thread, and rather than dredging up the contents of another thread, to further escalate things, maybe take a moment to realize that this thread was not started as a personal attack against your character. We've all read the same words, and you seem to be the only one that has taken offense.
It's great that you don't make impulse purchases. You're a responsible aquarist or hobbyist or enthusiast, or whatever you want to call yourself. Unfortunately, those that do make impulse purchases will always be grouped with other hobbyists or aquarists or enthusiasts. If they're willing to continuously pump money into this hobby, then they are hobbyists.
Regardless, I guess you've accomplished what you've set out to do, which is to argue for the sake of agruing, so I'll just duck and hope that some great gigantic alien hobbyist from another planet plucks me out of my chair and drops me into a new planetary system before I witness anymore of your vitriolic sludge. :happyfish :happyfish :happyfish
 

ophiura

Active Member
Originally Posted by hardcrab67
Seriously how can anybody believe that we're superior in the great big universe. I seriously doubt it. We're not even close to top of the food chain, when a microscopic organism can take us out in an instant. At the top of the "Evolutionary Ladder", I think not! !

Don't freak out, but I totally agree with you.
I never implied or said otherwise. I'm trained as an evolutionary biologist.
Which will probably get me in even MORE hot water.
Darn it.
 

ophiura

Active Member
Originally Posted by Gexkko
I'm a student of behavioral neuroscience...it's what I do


Whoa. :scared:
 

reef diver

Active Member
You come off as a ranting little know-it-all

haven't read maybe 1 or 2 posts from you that were +, get a grip little girl. You constantly delete links, but have no problem plugging for where you work, when asked in your area, YOU should show some restraint and plug for SWF.com, especially since you're a MOD, rules should apply to everyone here. Now I will pass the soapbox to someone else. After all that bashing, I guess I have to go scrub algae now. And your "Welcome" fellow hobbyist! Note to fellow members- Sorry but I've had all of the "Holier than Thou" I can stand from this girl!

Hmm and this isn't bashing?
Ophiura has helped me more times than I can count in the scant 3 months that ive been here, and ive seen her help many people with their problems.
As to the debate, I may not see many introduced animals where I liove in the mountains but introduced plants, and small insects are wreaking havoc on our world renowned wild flowers. Many were introduced as beautiful specimens by gardeners, but soon spread.
 

2563

Member
Originally Posted by Reef Diver
Hmm and this isn't bashing?
That is exactly what I was thinking!
 

hardcrab67

Member
I said you come off as a ranting(your word) know-it-all(my word), for this I do not apologize, I'm not hateful or spiteful, just like you, I'm direct. You put "Thanks my fellow hobbyists" and proceeded to build your soapbox, you were in the mood. Well so was I. What you should do is distinguish between "True Hobbyists" who show restraint and dedication and the "Impulse Buyer" who does not. Hence same bucket. I was offended and let you know it, for this I do not apologize, but graciously accept yours. Now that I know a little about you, my opinion is the same, so what. You talk about "tone" of conversation, well I feel your tone was that my opinions were stupid for lack of better word and you don't know me, so maybe I read it wrong or took it wrong, again so what. Just opinions and I guess if our feelings are going to get hurt, than we'd be better off keeping quite, IMO. You may not be the tang police, but a few weeks ago you felt like you had to be the avatar police, that and the statements toward me in the other debate, set this off. For this I do not apologize either.
 

hardcrab67

Member
Originally Posted by MolaMola
Actually, I have read that thread, and rather than dredging up the contents of another thread, to further escalate things, maybe take a moment to realize that this thread was not started as a personal attack against your character. We've all read the same words, and you seem to be the only one that has taken offense.
It's great that you don't make impulse purchases. You're a responsible aquarist or hobbyist or enthusiast, or whatever you want to call yourself. Unfortunately, those that do make impulse purchases will always be grouped with other hobbyists or aquarists or enthusiasts. If they're willing to continuously pump money into this hobby, then they are hobbyists.
Regardless, I guess you've accomplished what you've set out to do, which is to argue for the sake of agruing, so I'll just duck and hope that some great gigantic alien hobbyist from another planet plucks me out of my chair and drops me into a new planetary system before I witness anymore of your vitriolic sludge. :happyfish :happyfish :happyfish
I don't agree, but thats my opinion!
 

gexkko

Member
The exact quote was thanks to fellow hobbyists, not my fellow hobbyists.
Since she was speaking directly to members of the board, "fellow hobbyists" implies hobbyists outside the confines of this message board. She did not state "you" in reference to members of the board, or "my fellow hobbyists" which would have been reference to those not her, including those on this board. As I stated above, her terminology was a clearly implied reference to those hobbyists (or impulse buyers as you choose to refer to them) not reading these boards.
However, it was not a reference to all hobbyists not reading these boards. It was a reference quite simply to those hobbyists who have, in fact, introduced non-native species, a reference she made using fewer words, apparently a mistake (hence my multi-paragraph explanation).
Now, your taking offense at the stated term was not due to any fault of Ophiura, but rather your own hypersensitivity and inability to grasp the nuances of written English. Do not attack Ophiura, an educated source and valued member of these boards, simply because you can't grasp the language she uses; language, I might add, which is quite clear to myself and many others it seems.
 

ophiura

Active Member
Originally Posted by hardcrab67
IYou may not be the tang police, but a few weeks ago you felt like you had to be the avatar police, that and the statements toward me in the other debate, set this off. For this I do not apologize either.

There were complains about the avatar in question. This site is not a "public" free speech board. The company has a right to decide what customers they want, and what they want people to see. And that is not what they generally want people to see on a fish board. I am sorry if you disagree, but it is part of my "job" to watch out for such things, nor is it a RIGHT for people to have such avatars on this board.
You have taken things very personally, and I do not know why. But it is a true waste of time, frankly, to continue on nit picky things like this.
 
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