ctgretzky9
Member
I guess only one pic per post...heres the other pic
calcium low, alkalinity high
- Thread starter ctgretzky9
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bang guy
Moderator
3.5Meq/L ~ 10dKH
Balanced Ca would be about 440ppm.
That's actually a good target because the PH will be more stable and when Calcium is used the ALK won't dip to dangerous levels.
The values I gave earlier are a shorter term goal. I just don't want you trying to bump levels up quickly. After a month try to raise levels a little more.
NSW is about 400ppm and 2.5Meq/L so we all know that those are adequate levels. The problem comes once you have a demanding tank with a lot of calcium consumers. ie. If they consume 50ppm of calcium you're left with 350ppm and an ALK of 1.5Meq/L. In this case the ALK is at a level where corals become stressed and will have trouble building skeleton.
That's why a full reef should be maintained at a level slightly higher than natural sea water.
Balanced Ca would be about 440ppm.
That's actually a good target because the PH will be more stable and when Calcium is used the ALK won't dip to dangerous levels.
The values I gave earlier are a shorter term goal. I just don't want you trying to bump levels up quickly. After a month try to raise levels a little more.
NSW is about 400ppm and 2.5Meq/L so we all know that those are adequate levels. The problem comes once you have a demanding tank with a lot of calcium consumers. ie. If they consume 50ppm of calcium you're left with 350ppm and an ALK of 1.5Meq/L. In this case the ALK is at a level where corals become stressed and will have trouble building skeleton.
That's why a full reef should be maintained at a level slightly higher than natural sea water.
ctgretzky9
Member
Bang-Thank you so much!
And I will do it very slowly and target your first goal, then reach for perfection later...
I am doing a water change now...is that the best way to get it under control?
Then shall i add the 2 components in a half dose?
Thank you!
And I will do it very slowly and target your first goal, then reach for perfection later...
I am doing a water change now...is that the best way to get it under control?
Then shall i add the 2 components in a half dose?
Thank you!
ctgretzky9
Member
Bang and thomas...
Thanks for the help, I am on my way I think. Tested last night and here are the results:
calc now at 380mg/l (was 340-360)
alk is now at 6.5meq/l (was at 7-7.5)
ph is steady at 8.2
temp 81
salinity .024
amm/trites 0
trates 40 (was 20, but i need to clean filters etc...doing another wc tonight with 5 gal cured water-damn canister and wet/dry filters!))
So I beleive I'm on the right track! I have been dosing according to instructions (15ml) of b-iionic part 2.
everything in the tank looks better!
Thanks for the help, I am on my way I think. Tested last night and here are the results:
calc now at 380mg/l (was 340-360)
alk is now at 6.5meq/l (was at 7-7.5)
ph is steady at 8.2
temp 81
salinity .024
amm/trites 0
trates 40 (was 20, but i need to clean filters etc...doing another wc tonight with 5 gal cured water-damn canister and wet/dry filters!))
So I beleive I'm on the right track! I have been dosing according to instructions (15ml) of b-iionic part 2.
everything in the tank looks better!
gonegofn
New Member
Hey,
Do you mind if I crash in here? I had some funny readings in the same area and decided to get things back on track with a water change. My problem is that my calcium is fine 450, ph is 8.4, but my alkalinity is 7.5. Based on what I've read here the alkalinity is a little high. I have my water made up and decided to test it before I put it in and found the ph and alkalinity to be the same as above. Like you I use Instant Ocean and b-ionic. I'm not sure where to go from here, but from reading this thread, I think the right people are on here to tell me.
Thanks for letting me intrude!!!
Do you mind if I crash in here? I had some funny readings in the same area and decided to get things back on track with a water change. My problem is that my calcium is fine 450, ph is 8.4, but my alkalinity is 7.5. Based on what I've read here the alkalinity is a little high. I have my water made up and decided to test it before I put it in and found the ph and alkalinity to be the same as above. Like you I use Instant Ocean and b-ionic. I'm not sure where to go from here, but from reading this thread, I think the right people are on here to tell me.
Thanks for letting me intrude!!!
T
thomas712
Guest
Originally posted by gonegofn
My problem is that my calcium is fine 450, ph is 8.4, but my alkalinity is 7.5. Based on what I've read here the alkalinity is a little high. .
Thanks for letting me intrude!!!
Those numbers really don't seem to bad. Your alkalinity is high for your calcium score though. At this point I would allow your system time to see what it is using. You don't need to dose anymore of the b-ionic until you see what your system is using and then dose accordingly.
I find it quite a suprise to find that you are getting those readings with instant ocean, very suprised.
With a 450 calcium reading your alk should be more like 4.50 or 12.60 dKH. So your out of whack but not in a really bad way. Just let he alk fall naturally and keep up with the calcium if it drops below 400 to 425. Then as your alk hits the above target range start to dose that.
Did you test the calcium when you made up a water change?
Lets see what Bang says.
Oh and welcome to the board
Thomas
gonegofn
New Member
Thanks Thomas!!! No I didn't think about the calcium until I had already added it to my wet/dry. I had laid off the b-ionic for a week and then tested my calcium. It had climbed to 480 and I was showing some deposits, so I dosed both 1 & 2 for the past two days to see if it would stablize things and it did level out my calcium at 450. I have been checking everyday at the same time, for the past 4 days. My Alkalinity has always been 6.5 to 7.0, from day one. My tank has been setup for almost 6 months and I'm getting ready to get adventurous with somehting other than shrooms and button polyps, that's what made me start really checking things, even though all current inhabitants are doing well.
I just checked things 2 hours after my water change and here it is, looks pretty good.
Calcium 375 a little low, but I will watch for the next few days
PH 8.3
Alkalinity 4.5 this I like
If my alkalinity and calcium once again begin to rapidlyclimb without me adding any buffering, what is the most likely contributer to that?
Thanks again for the advice and the welcome!!!!
I just checked things 2 hours after my water change and here it is, looks pretty good.
Calcium 375 a little low, but I will watch for the next few days
PH 8.3
Alkalinity 4.5 this I like
If my alkalinity and calcium once again begin to rapidlyclimb without me adding any buffering, what is the most likely contributer to that?
Thanks again for the advice and the welcome!!!!
T
thomas712
Guest
Well I have some wrinkled eyebrows right now.
Are you saying that you went from 480 to 450 calcium in just a couple of days, and then to 375? How fast did that happen and then from 6.5 or 7.0 alk to 4.5 alk?
I'll have to read this again.....
Ok adding Bionic you went from 480 calcium to 450? Alk was at 6.5 to 7.0.
Then you did a water change and things went from 450 calcium to 375? And the alk went from 6.5 or 7.0 down to 4.5?
This is a bit strange to fluxuate that rapidly unless it was the water change that did it. But you stated that the water changes were scoring your alk at 7.5, then another water change brought it down to 4.5?
Check again in the morning. Are you mixing these water changes for 24-48 hours before doing the change?
I think you had better have the LFS double check those test scores, something is odd here.
Thomas
Are you saying that you went from 480 to 450 calcium in just a couple of days, and then to 375? How fast did that happen and then from 6.5 or 7.0 alk to 4.5 alk?
I'll have to read this again.....
Ok adding Bionic you went from 480 calcium to 450? Alk was at 6.5 to 7.0.
Then you did a water change and things went from 450 calcium to 375? And the alk went from 6.5 or 7.0 down to 4.5?
This is a bit strange to fluxuate that rapidly unless it was the water change that did it. But you stated that the water changes were scoring your alk at 7.5, then another water change brought it down to 4.5?
Check again in the morning. Are you mixing these water changes for 24-48 hours before doing the change?
I think you had better have the LFS double check those test scores, something is odd here.
Thomas
gonegofn
New Member
All of the nubmers I mentioned applied mostly to the last 5 days. I had already decided to take in a sample tomorrow and let my lfs test it. Up until late yesterday, I had been using a test strip on the alkalinity. I just bought a real test and I can say that the readings went from 7.5 down to 4.5 with an 10 gallon water change this evening. I'm going to track things testing every morn and evening for the next 5 days and see what happens. I believe my data is flawed. Yes, the water was 24 hours old.
Thanks again for your help and patience!!
Thanks again for your help and patience!!
bang guy
Moderator
Originally posted by gonegofn
I just bought a real test and I can say that the readings went from 7.5 down to 4.5 with an 10 gallon water change this evening.
You really should get into the habit of posting the unit of measure.
7.5 could be dKH or Meq/L from the context. dKH would be a little low, Meq/L seems impossibly high for your Calcium level.
ctgretzky9
Member
Gone-
I use IO salt as well.
As I learned from Bang, thomas, izzo and some others, test your source water BEFORE you add anything and see what you get as far as ph, alk etc...
Mixing the salt in, as well I learned, is super super important.
This is what worked for me, and it seems is the correct way to do it:
1.Fill a 5 gal (or whatever size) bucket with your source water of correct quality
2. add salt little by little, stirring it all the while to the correct salinity
3. add a powerhead to the bucket and if you have one, possibly an airstone
4. let run about 24 hrs
5. add a heater to adjust temp a couple of hours before wc
6. test salinity, ph and alk of this water and adjust, let run for a little while longer
7. test tank water and then add whatever you have to to the bucket ( like i added my b-ionic calcium supplement to the bucket)
Change your water.
Worked awesome! Been doing that, and little by little everything is coming into the correct parameters!
I use IO salt as well.
As I learned from Bang, thomas, izzo and some others, test your source water BEFORE you add anything and see what you get as far as ph, alk etc...
Mixing the salt in, as well I learned, is super super important.
This is what worked for me, and it seems is the correct way to do it:
1.Fill a 5 gal (or whatever size) bucket with your source water of correct quality
2. add salt little by little, stirring it all the while to the correct salinity
3. add a powerhead to the bucket and if you have one, possibly an airstone
4. let run about 24 hrs
5. add a heater to adjust temp a couple of hours before wc
6. test salinity, ph and alk of this water and adjust, let run for a little while longer
7. test tank water and then add whatever you have to to the bucket ( like i added my b-ionic calcium supplement to the bucket)
Change your water.
Worked awesome! Been doing that, and little by little everything is coming into the correct parameters!
bang guy
Moderator
Everything sounds perfect up to step 7.
Adding supplements actually works a lot better in the display tank because of the volume.
Addin calcium to a 5 gallon bucket could actually trigger a precipitation event so my only suggestion is to do the dosing in the larger water volume preferable in a turbulent area like a sump.
That's great that things are under control now. Congrats
Adding supplements actually works a lot better in the display tank because of the volume.
Addin calcium to a 5 gallon bucket could actually trigger a precipitation event so my only suggestion is to do the dosing in the larger water volume preferable in a turbulent area like a sump.
That's great that things are under control now. Congrats
ctgretzky9
Member
Got it Bang!
I will dose in the tank itself then for now on, thanks for the tip! I have a very high current area where surge from the powerhead and canister filter outlet both come together, and anything I have dosed in the past, even the 15 ml of b-ionic, I kinda drip it in.
I will resume that activity instead of the bucket.
I will post my next results from testing next week probably on tuesday before then after my next water change.
Thanks again!!!!
I will dose in the tank itself then for now on, thanks for the tip! I have a very high current area where surge from the powerhead and canister filter outlet both come together, and anything I have dosed in the past, even the 15 ml of b-ionic, I kinda drip it in.
I will resume that activity instead of the bucket.
I will post my next results from testing next week probably on tuesday before then after my next water change.
Thanks again!!!!
gonegofn
New Member
Hey Guys, I'll give that a try. Here is the history of my parameters since my water change yesterday.
Last Night:
Calcium - 375 mg/l
PH - 8.3
Alkalinity - 4.5 meq/l
This Morning:
Calcium - 375 mg/l
PH - 8.2
Alkalinity - 4.5 meq/l
This Evening :
Calcium - 403 mg/l
PH - 8.3
Alkalinity - 5.5 meq/l
I have added no chemicals to the tank. This looks pretty good, I guess we will see how long it lasts.
Thanks Again!!!
Last Night:
Calcium - 375 mg/l
PH - 8.3
Alkalinity - 4.5 meq/l
This Morning:
Calcium - 375 mg/l
PH - 8.2
Alkalinity - 4.5 meq/l
This Evening :
Calcium - 403 mg/l
PH - 8.3
Alkalinity - 5.5 meq/l
I have added no chemicals to the tank. This looks pretty good, I guess we will see how long it lasts.
Thanks Again!!!
T
thomas712
Guest
Unless your still dosing I can't see how it can jump like that! Something isn't right here. Natural tendancy is for the tank to use calcium and alkalinity, how can it just jump up in numbers like that?
Thomas
Thomas
gonegofn
New Member
Hey Thomas,
I hear you, but that has been my problem. I'll keep watching it and I didn't get to lfs with some water today, hopefully tomorrow. Since my calcium and alkalinity are a mater of counting the number of drops before the color changes, it's not like trying to match a certain shade of color, so it is less likely that I'm interpreting the test wrong.
Thanks for you time!!!
I hear you, but that has been my problem. I'll keep watching it and I didn't get to lfs with some water today, hopefully tomorrow. Since my calcium and alkalinity are a mater of counting the number of drops before the color changes, it's not like trying to match a certain shade of color, so it is less likely that I'm interpreting the test wrong.
Thanks for you time!!!
T
thomas712
Guest
Originally posted by bostonPro
Thomas, my water is always cloudy when I add it to my tank. Is this bad? If so, what should I do?
What salt mix are you using?
How long are you mixing it for?
What type of water are you using?