Evolution vs. Intelligent Design

pezenfuego

pezenfuego

Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by reefraff http:///t/392782/evolution-vs-intelligent-design/200#post_3491085
So what is wrong with telling students that different religions believe in a supreme being who created all life and the scientific community has a theory that attempts to explain a natural creation to life and delve into it? There's nothing wrong with respecting religion.
Religious tolerance is important, but there is a point where we have to step back and refuse to allow certain things. Religions beliefs involving martyrdom for example should not be tolerated. Sure, the morals taught from religion can have their benefits, but they are also potentially harmful and ultimately unnecessary. Don't hurt other people and don't hurt yourself. It's actually pretty simple. Sometimes there is something wrong with respecting religion, because respect is something that must be earned.
 
S

saltymac2012

Guest
When you ask for a dying relative to be healed as a child and are "ignored" that doesnt help his or your case. That was just one example, after years of nothing......what do you expect me, and others Im sure to do? Switch to your God?
 
bang guy

bang guy

Moderator
Flower and the other relious followers have not pushed their beliefs in this thread in my opinion. They have answered questions asked of them and communicated what they believe. I'm not sure why you ask what they expect of you. I don't see them expecting anything of you other than try to understand where they are coming from. If you want them to try to understand your point of view why is it beneath you to try to understand theirs?
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by saltymac2012 http:///t/392782/evolution-vs-intelligent-design/220#post_3491118
When you ask for a dying relative to be healed as a child and are "ignored" that doesnt help his or your case. That was just one example, after years of nothing......what do you expect me, and others Im sure to do? Switch to your God?
....I read what Bang Guy wrote and didn't know what he meant until I read this. My dear friend, not one of us wants to loose a loved one...we all want God to swoop down and save the day. I'm afraid it is apointed for man to die. God has his ways and his rules, it's not like you can stop him. Sometimes...SOMETIMES he will intervene, that's why we call them miracles.
Like Bang Guy said, I wasn't tryig to get you to switch to anything, I thought you got discouraged while seeking. I just answered questions asked.
LOL...There is no case argued for God...he is big enough to speak for himself. He doesn't need my help to prove he is, or isn't there. I can only give you my opinions and thoughts...we have our own minds to make up.
This is supposed to be a thread on being allowed to teach evolution and creation in the schools, not a preaching session....if you have more questions or aguments of this type maybe you can PM and not take the thread where it shouldn't. Religion is a very touchy subject and it's often best not brought up like this. Not everyone is interessed and many don't like it at all. Sometimes the aguments get very heated and that would be a shame...this is a nice thread to voice our opinions about the subject at hand.
 
snakeblitz33

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
Lets talk a little about Gods time.
In the Bible, it was said that God created eveything in seven days. But couldnt seven days for God be seven billion years for man? Wouldnt that explain evolution a little better?
 
beth

beth

Administrator
Staff member
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33 http:///t/392782/evolution-vs-intelligent-design/220#post_3491137
Lets talk a little about Gods time.
In the Bible, it was said that God created eveything in seven days. But couldnt seven days for God be seven billion years for man? Wouldnt that explain evolution a little better?
There is no way of knowing for sure, but many religious people will say yes; since you see some of the Bible's personalities living for hundreds of years.
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beth http:///t/392782/evolution-vs-intelligent-design/220#post_3491138
There is no way of knowing for sure, but many religious people will say yes; since you see some of the Bible's personalities living for hundreds of years.
I thought that here lately scientists are saying that the world is slowing it's spin....and has been for billions of years. (we have a long time to go before it stops) Anyway, isn't it also possible that the earth made it's way around the sun faster and so the years were counted, and the seasons were there, but the time was faster than now???? It's just a thought.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33 http:///t/392782/evolution-vs-intelligent-design/220#post_3491137
Lets talk a little about Gods time.
In the Bible, it was said that God created eveything in seven days. But couldnt seven days for God be seven billion years for man? Wouldnt that explain evolution a little better?
Very good Seth! Since the sun and the moon were not created until the 4th day. Obviously the time frame of one of God's days is not our concept at all, so I do think you nailed that small part right on the head.
 
S

saltymac2012

Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bang Guy http:///t/392782/evolution-vs-intelligent-design/220#post_3491124
Flower and the other relious followers have not pushed their beliefs in this thread in my opinion. They have answered questions asked of them and communicated what they believe. I'm not sure why you ask what they expect of you. I don't them expecting anything of you other than try to understand where they are coming from. If you want them to try to understand your point of view why is it beneath you to try to understand theirs?
Its not beneath me. I understand exactly where they are coming from. I have 99% of my family that feel the same way as flower and the others. The death of my father, who was one of the most religious people in the world, and who taught me more than sunday school or the church about God , was a crushing blow. Lets just say that the seed of doubt was planted there.
But as I keep being reminded this is off topic, I'll say that if you want your children to be taught about God in school then send them to the school of your religion. If you think evolution is the "truth" then send them to public school. Hows that? Ive said all Ive had to say sticking on topic.
 
beth

beth

Administrator
Staff member
The moon is moving away from Earth, so you can count on that having a big effect on our planet. Our big moon is the one thing that made planet earth what it is today---a breeding ground for countless forms of life.
Is it a coincidence that this little planet just happened to acquire the biggest moon in the solar system? The one thing that sets us apart from the other planets is that Earth can support an environment teaming with life? Thanks to our moon. Here is God miracle, and no hocus-pocus needed.
 
S

saltymac2012

Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beth http:///t/392782/evolution-vs-intelligent-design/220#post_3491149
The moon is moving away from Earth, so you can count on that having a big effect on our planet. Our big moon is the one thing that made planet earth what it is today---a breeding ground for countless forms of life.
Is it a coincidence that this little planet just happened to acquire the biggest moon in the solar system? The one thing that sets us apart from the other planets is that Earth can support an environment teaming with life? Thanks to our moon. Here is God miracle, and no hocus-pocus needed.
The eskimos have a verbal history handed down from generation to generation. And one of the stories was that their people were put there from a ship, before the moon was put into place. Why doesnt our moon rotate? Why is it getting further away from our planet? O, sorry off topic again. Bad MAC (slaps knuckles with ruler)
 
pezenfuego

pezenfuego

Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by saltymac2012 http:///t/392782/evolution-vs-intelligent-design/220#post_3491152
The eskimos have a verbal history handed down from generation to generation. And one of the stories was that their people were put there from a ship, before the moon was put into place. Why doesnt our moon rotate? Why is it getting further away from our planet? O, sorry off topic again. Bad MAC (slaps knuckles with ruler)
Why doesn't the moon rotate? The moon does rotate. It has a 28 day rotation (actually it is a smidge closer to 27) and it's orbital period (the time it takes revolve around the earth) is exactly the same, which is why we only see one side (we can actually observe about 60% of it. MIRACLE! Well, not really. In fact this is not uncommon and does not make the Earth very special. Once, the moon rotated much more quickly. Anyway, the reason it synced up like this has to do with tides. Think of it this way, where does the energy for the production of tides come from? Energy cannot be created or destroyed. Well, obviously it comes from the moon. If it comes from the moon, then that means that the moon is losing energy. What happens when the moon loses energy? Simple, the rotation rate slows. This causes the moon to lock into the position it is in. Now the moon doesn't have any more energy to give up, so what happens? Well, the earth still has tides and the moon is still being stretched, so the energy causing this to happen comes from Earth's rotation. That means that eventually only one side of the earth will be visible from the moon. But Earth is more massive, so give a few billion years. This also explains why the moon is getting further from earth. Of course the moon gets less than two inches away every year and the Earth loses a few millionths of a second in its rotation.
Sorry, that is extremely off topic. But this illustrates the trap people fall into. It is important to look for the best explanation, not the simplest.
 
beaslbob

beaslbob

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33 http:///t/392782/evolution-vs-intelligent-design/220#post_3491137
Lets talk a little about Gods time.
In the Bible, it was said that God created eveything in seven days. But couldnt seven days for God be seven billion years for man? Wouldnt that explain evolution a little better?
Perhaps already answered but
NO!!!!!!!!!!!
Again the basic differences between science and religion apply. If you accept that things are/can be/were created that is religious. If you accept that everything came from somethign else that is scientific.
still just my .02
 
beth

beth

Administrator
Staff member
Quote:
Originally Posted by PEZenfuego http:///t/392782/evolution-vs-intelligent-design/220#post_3491155
Sorry, that is extremely off topic. But this illustrates the trap people fall into. It is important to look for the best explanation, not the simplest.
Not completely off topic, since we are talking about literal Bible creation vs evolution. The simplicity is in human understanding, or not understanding enough. Thus, we get simple explanations handed down by humans, inspired by God, but who wrote the documents with a human's ability to understand and express in text.
 
kiefers

kiefers

Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beth http:///t/392782/evolution-vs-intelligent-design/220#post_3491149
The moon is moving away from Earth, so you can count on that having a big effect on our planet. Our big moon is the one thing that made planet earth what it is today---a breeding ground for countless forms of life.
Is it a coincidence that this little planet just happened to acquire the biggest moon in the solar system? The one thing that sets us apart from the other planets is that Earth can support an environment teaming with life? Thanks to our moon. Here is God miracle, and no hocus-pocus needed.
actually, our moon is the 5th largest in our system. The biggest moon belongs to Jupiter.
Just sayin'
 
darthtang aw

darthtang aw

Active Member
Perhaps already answered but
NO!!!!!!!!!!!
Again the basic differences between science and religion apply.  If you accept that things are/can be/were created that is religious.  If you accept that everything came from somethign else that is scientific.
still just my .02
Actual;ly, yes it can. Since there is a passage in the bible where gods states a day in the life of god can be as if 1000 days in the life of man. Basically a day to god is not measured in time as it is to man. Meaning evolution can be the process god used to mold and create everything. Religion and Science can be tied together.
 
D

dragonzim

Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beth http:///t/392782/evolution-vs-intelligent-design/220#post_3491149
The moon is moving away from Earth, so you can count on that having a big effect on our planet. Our big moon is the one thing that made planet earth what it is today---a breeding ground for countless forms of life.
Is it a coincidence that this little planet just happened to acquire the biggest moon in the solar system? The one thing that sets us apart from the other planets is that Earth can support an environment teaming with life? Thanks to our moon. Here is God miracle, and no hocus-pocus needed.
The Earth's moon is not the largest in the solar system
http://www.seasky.org/solar-system/earth-moon.html
 
beaslbob

beaslbob

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///t/392782/evolution-vs-intelligent-design/220#post_3491174
Actual;ly, yes it can. Since there is a passage in the bible where gods states a day in the life of god can be as if 1000 days in the life of man. Basically a day to god is not measured in time as it is to man. Meaning evolution can be the process god used to mold and create everything. Religion and Science can be tied together.
Yea you can say anything you want.
Do you accept that a basic defining assumption of science is that nothing is created or for that matter destroyed?
If not then what exactly defines science to you?
If you do accept, that then how it is possible to reconcill that defining assumption with the religious defining assumption that God created the universe?
As I stated before there is a basic difference between science and religion. It is illogical to tie the two together. Because they start with mutually exclusive assumptions.
 
darthtang aw

darthtang aw

Active Member
Yea you can say anything you want.
Do you accept that a basic defining assumption of science is that nothing is created or for that matter destroyed?
If not then what exactly defines science to you?
If you do accept, that then how it is possible to reconcill that defining assumption with the religious defining assumption that God created the universe?
As I stated before there is a basic difference between science and religion.  It is illogical to tie the two together.  Because they start with mutually exclusive assumptions.
If nothing is created then, how have scientists created particles out of nothing? How have they created light using quantum physics out of nothing?
 
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