Experiment

babyb

Active Member
30 xtra hi, i dont think its really the same thing, mysid shrimp are substaining (sp?) a life, putting guppies in a jar is really surving no purpose imo because someone has already did it, they know the outcome, why kill more, ya its teaching but thats kind of needless to kill something, find another project where they dont have to die just my $.02
 

pappa d

Member
ok we've heard the "save the guppies" remarks more than we need to. thank you for being animal lovers, and thank you for your opinion. but the project isnt going to change and im sure there will be no harm done. and like stated before, that isnt the point of this thread. it is to learn how to set up an ecosystem so the DO survive. thanks everyone for the imput-
 

30-xtra high

Active Member
Originally Posted by Phixer
Are you kidding? Next to nitrogen gaseous O2 is the easiest gas to come by. Just visit any hospital for medical grade (more pure) 99.9% same as Aviators Breathing Oxygen or a welding supply store for industrial grade.
#1, no hospitals around me, #2 wtf is a breathing aviator?, #3, no welding supply stores near me,
Babyb, somebody has already fed fish mysis shrimp and we know what happens, just like someone has already put the guppis in the jar to see what happened, the shrimp die, the guppis.. might die.
pappa d, what are the EXACT regulations to this experiemnet, can the jar be sealed, then can you just drill holes in it?
 

reefkprz

Active Member
Originally Posted by 30-xtra high
#1, no hospitals around me,
No hospitals? where do people go for medical attention?
 

bang guy

Moderator
One Gallon is too small of a volume for a vertebrate to survive.
It just isn't going to work, sorry. Does it have to be Guppies? Is there an Invert you can experiment with like Daphnia or Scuds? Tubifex worms would actually be perfect.
 

reefreak29

Active Member
Originally Posted by reefreak29
put some algea in it.i did the same thing with daphnia.i put 10 daphnia in a seeled beaker and there still alive and reproducing after 3 years
daphnia works really well
 

pappa d

Member
Originally Posted by Bang Guy
One Gallon is too small of a volume for a vertebrate to survive.
It just isn't going to work, sorry. Does it have to be Guppies? Is there an Invert you can experiment with like Daphnia or Scuds? Tubifex worms would actually be perfect.
Once again, please stop saying that this is either cruel or not going to work. It is for a class experiment. it is not my choice, the teacher assigned it. it has worked before, and i guarentee it will work again. thanks for your concern though :notsure: . as for substrate any suggestions and im going to check into some simple plants. thanks everyone who helped
 

reefreak29

Active Member
Originally Posted by Pappa D
Once again, please stop saying that this is either cruel or not going to work. It is for a class experiment. it is not my choice, the teacher assigned it. it has worked before, and i guarentee it will work again. thanks for your concern though :notsure: . as for substrate any suggestions and im going to check into some simple plants. thanks everyone who helped
bang guy didnt say it was cruel in any way he just stated it wouldnt work
 

trippkid

Active Member
I have had a softball sized Eco Sphere for over 3 yrs, it is still going strong, it has 4 small shrimp, some sand, a piece of dead gorgonian, and some what looks like hair algae. I totally think your project should work, just need to find the right plants for the project. I don't know alot about FW plants, but I would go with something not very light dependent, and maybe a slower growing type of plant. You don't want too much light to get at it, you may end up with nothing but algae and the small volume of water will get too hot too quickly if left in the sun for long periods time. As far as the Eco Sphere, it just sits on my kitchen counter and gets ambient light all day and maybe a little more direct light from the sky lights for about an hour or so. Like I said it has been doing great for over 3 yrs. Good luck with you project. You may want to put a small magnet inside before you seal it up. This is how the Eco Spheres are done. There is a magnet on the inside and you have one for the outside. That way, if your jar or container gets too covered with algae, you can clean it off without sacrificing the seal. I hope this helps you a little.
 

pappa d

Member
Originally Posted by reefreak29
bang guy didnt say it was cruel in any way he just stated it wouldnt work
i understand he said it wouldnt work thats why i said people saying it wasnt going to work, it wasnt the point of the thread and the cruel was towards the other person who kept saying that
 

pappa d

Member
Originally Posted by trippkid
I have had a softball sized Eco Sphere for over 3 yrs, it is still going strong, it has 4 small shrimp, some sand, a piece of dead gorgonian, and some what looks like hair algae. I totally think your project should work, just need to find the right plants for the project. I don't know alot about FW plants, but I would go with something not very light dependent, and maybe a slower growing type of plant. You don't want too much light to get at it, you may end up with nothing but algae and the small volume of water will get too hot too quickly if left in the sun for long periods time. As far as the Eco Sphere, it just sits on my kitchen counter and gets ambient light all day and maybe a little more direct light from the sky lights for about an hour or so. Like I said it has been doing great for over 3 yrs. Good luck with you project. You may want to put a small magnet inside before you seal it up. This is how the Eco Spheres are done. There is a magnet on the inside and you have one for the outside. That way, if your jar or container gets too covered with algae, you can clean it off without sacrificing the seal. I hope this helps you a little.
yes it does, thanks
 

integral9

Member
Originally Posted by Pappa D
as for substrate any suggestions and im going to check into some simple plants. thanks everyone who helped
Get some substrate from a FW fish tank. Maybe your LFS has some to offer.
Good luck. We did crickets in my Life Science class... I cut the head off of one of mine by accident (the little bugger was trying to escape) and the other one... well he froze when the heat went out in the building one weekend.. oh well.
 

ophiura

Active Member
I think it is something that can be done. It is not easy, but it can be. there are instructions online. If this always failed, I am sure that it would not be part of the instructions. Some will succeed, and others will fail, and in comparing and discussing, it is how the class will learn.
I find this somewhat amusing. We are in a hobby where LOADS of fish die just getting to our door for nothing more than entertainment. Really nothing. If you say "oh no we can teach people about the reef ecosystem and protect it" then I will ask "so it is worth the collection pressure, the thousands upon thousands of fish that will die getting here and reefs impacted so you can teach someone?" Little bit backward, no?
How, exactly, is that different from here. I'll tell you: first, no ecosystem is damaged, second the animals are easy to grow and reproduce and it is a true, experimental, learning experience.
Here we have someone who is trying to learn about a delicate balance, who may in the future really be making a difference, and "oh no!" I don't get it at all. I really don't. Sorry.
They dissect cats - many of which were strays that were euthanized because they were unwanted. They dissect frogs, worms, crickets. This is all to learn about biology. They may very well dissect fish, etc. There is a benefit to learning what animals need, or don't. Frankly, what can kill them. I guarantee a lot of people would acclimate inverts if they did some of the basic experiments you do in marine biology to study osmoregulation.
Some animals may die, so that others may live...and that is especially true in the study of environmental science.
 

phixer

Active Member
Yeah that is a good way of putting it but Bacteria has rights too, we should ban all use of hand cleaner.
I know this has nothing to do with anything but I was just thinking. I you were the size of a mouse would your cat still respect you? I think the cat would tear you to shreds, a dog on the other hand would still remain loyal.
 

ophiura

Active Member
Pappa D - fundamentally in my mind you have one responsibility. It is to try and do the best you can with this...research, make an effort. If it doesn't work, learn from it, and remember it. But this is the cost of science, and it is not for everyone without a doubt.
 

jovial

Member
Originally Posted by Phixer
Yeah that is a good way of putting it but Bacteria has rights too, we should ban all use of hand cleaner.
I know this has nothing to do with anything but I was just thinking. I you were the size of a mouse would your cat still respect you? I think the cat would tear you to shreds, a dog on the other hand would still remain loyal.

I like cats but dogs are more loyal.
 

bigarn

Active Member
Originally Posted by ophiura
Pappa D - fundamentally in my mind you have one responsibility. It is to try and do the best you can with this...research, make an effort. If it doesn't work, learn from it, and remember it. But this is the cost of science, and it is not for everyone without a doubt.
I don't agree with Ophiura all the time, but she's right on here. IMO of course.
 

30-xtra high

Active Member
Originally Posted by reefkprZ
No hospitals? where do people go for medical attention?
all we have is doctor offices, just a place to make appointments, the actual hospitals are a couple cities away..
 
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