new skimmer

[mr_x]

since my total water volume is much larger than when i decided on a skimmer in the very beginning, i have attempted an upgrade.
originally i opted for the ASM G4X. for a roughly 250-300 gallon total volume system, it was plenty. now my system is closer to 400 gallons. i'm not saying that the G4X wasn't doing the job, but i would empty the skimmer cup every 3 days or so, and i was itching for a new gadget anyway.
i decided to go with the MSX 300, due to all the threads i've been reading about what a value they are.
i received the skimmer in a timely manner and it was packaged nicely-

it was interesting to see the differences between the ASM and MSX skimmers. the ASM has a very simple design. the MSX is a bit more detailed.

the ASM uses the sedra 9000. in my opinion, a very good pump.
the MSX uses 2, much smaller sicce pumps that come already mesh wheel modded. they also include the needle wheels incase you don't like the mesh wheel mods.

i use a standard 125 gallon tank as a sump. i never thought to measure my sump for this skimmer, because my sump seemed plenty big for any skimmer.
i barely got it to fit. it's got a massive footprint, compared to the G4X.

ok. so far i've run into a couple things i dislike about the new skimmer.
1. the airline tubing it came with is very flimsy. if you look at it the wrong way, it kinks.

2. the modded pumps sometimes rattle like hell at startup, and you have to jiggle them a bit to get the mesh wheels to start turning. i haven't tried the needle wheels yet. i guess that's why they send them to you.
it started skimming right away once i got the pumps going. here is a picture from this morning. the skimmer has been running for about 10 hours-

 

[bang guy]

Christmas come early

Good review, thanks!

 

[veni vidi vici]

I have the MSX 160 and i dont like the airline tubing either but i havent had any problems with it either.As far as the start up issue,i had the same problem .Just trim back the Enkamat a bit and it solved it.There is a MSX owners thread on R C that has a lot of infverall its a great skimmer IMO.

 

[joncat24]

Congrats on your new purchase, you will be pleased. If you think it is skimming now, just wait a couple of weeks.
I have the msx 250, which is the same, just a 10" body. It took it a few days to really start performing well.
A couple of little pointers to ya
1. go to lowes and get some 3/8" id airline vinyl tubing for the airline. It is soooo much better to work with.
2. While you are there, get some plumbers grease, it makes removing the volute cover and the skimmer cup alot easier. Put a film of it on the neck of the cup or the o-ring inside the neck and the cup slides in and out very easy.
3. I personally like the mesh for the increase in air draw, but the pinwheels work alright too. I use three layers of mesh, with the flat side down on the impellar side and up on the top side. Trim it so that it is about 2mm past the impellar disk and tighten it down with fishing line or the small zip ties. I have no problem with my pumps starting like this.
any questions....ask away

 

[coral keeper]

Sweet skimmer!

 

[mr_x]

i stole a lubricant idea from Oceans Motions. it's a compound made by dow corning, called "111 valve lubricant & sealant".
http://207.250.200.229:8080/1/doc?id=45354
meanwhile, i'll try the thicker hoses, and trimming the mesh some. you don't feel funny that in order to get this skimmer the way you want it, you have to alter it?
i don't feel totally awesome about spending over 450 bucks plus shipping, and then having to head to home depot for parts.
as you said, it needs to break in. so far, the skimmate produced is not much different than what i have been getting out of the G4X.
i do like the construction of the skimmer, and it's size. i'm looking forward to seeing it do it's best.

 

[mr_x]

ok. i bought a few feet of hose, and installed it. much better. i don't understand why they use that other hose in the first place.

i also inspected the mesh wheels. they were a bit on the messy side.

 

[veni vidi vici]

Hows it running now after the trim?

 

[bnutz244]

ok now you have a new toy when can we work a deal on the old one mine crapped out and being out of work you are in a position to help me give me a holla if you want to unload your old one

 

[hammerhed7]

Looking forward to seeing how this does X, I may also be looking to upgrade form my G3, I am considering the MSX, but the footprint is a killer for me.
Oh, by the way, I never thought you would sell out and leave me as one of the last ASM guys out there

 

[bioneck47]

Yeah, my mesh wheel was a little messy as well. I actually remeshed mine with four layers of enkamat and it made a big difference. It is a little difficult to do, but well worth the trouble.

 

[mr_x]

well, i removed one of the mesh wheels and put the needle wheel in, because i couldn't get it to stop rattling. maybe re-meshing it will help, but i didn't feel like getting involved with that right now. the other mesh wheel is working ok.
i've also added some of the dow corning lubricant i mentioned above, to the movable/removable parts.
it really bothers me that i have to do anything with this , other than turn it on.
my ASM skimmer worked perfect right out of the box.
this skimmer has some fancy features, like a bubble plate, and the little air thing that the 2 air hoses hook to, but i don't think that those features enhance it's performance at all.
anyhow, it's skimming well at the moment. i'll shoot a picture of it's progress when the lights come on.
hammerhed, i'll never speak bad about ASM skimmers. they've served me well for years.

 

[mr_x]

update- i'm still not convinced these skimmers are a tremendous value. both pumps fail to restart when i unplug them to service the skimmer cup. i have to jiggle them around and listen to them rattle for about 1 to 2 minutes before they straighten themselves out and start pulling water and air.
to be perfectly honest, i don't care about power consumption. i'd rather have 2 sedra pumps on this thing instead. i never heard that crazy rattling issue with sedra pumps. they fired up immediately.
it's not the mesh wheel either, because i've replaced one of the mesh wheels with the supplied needle wheel and i still get the same issue.

 

[wattsupdoc]

I'm not so sure I'm hard core sold on the sicce pumps myself. I have the octo 3000 pump and the sicce pump. The octo never had a start up issue with the stock needle wheel. I cant vouch for the sicce NW, but my mesh modded one does rattle some and need some help starting from time to time. However, after breaking in for a few weeks it gets better. I have yet to find it not running from a power outage when I've been gone.

The skimmate I get from it though is sick...DARK near black stinky crap. Any mesh modded pump is likely to have start up issues. But to most the mesh is worth it. Why the NW impellers are having issues for you, I cant tell. Do you have the intake turned down? What water level is it setting in? I think I remember reading where start up issues were improved by turning the intake down, or sideways one I don't recall exactly. But try it.

 

[bioneck47]

Originally Posted by Mr_X
http:///forum/post/2862012
update- i'm still not convinced these skimmers are a tremendous value. both pumps fail to restart when i unplug them to service the skimmer cup. i have to jiggle them around and listen to them rattle for about 1 to 2 minutes before they straighten themselves out and start pulling water and air.
to be perfectly honest, i don't care about power consumption. i'd rather have 2 sedra pumps on this thing instead. i never heard that crazy rattling issue with sedra pumps. they fired up immediately.
it's not the mesh wheel either, because i've replaced one of the mesh wheels with the supplied needle wheel and i still get the same issue.
hmm, mine does the same thing but I thought it was only because I have 4 layers of mesh. I'd have to admit that it is very annoying. Now I don't even turn off the skimmer when I take the collection cup off. After hearing your claim, I probably wouldn't recommend this skimmer to a friend. My ASM pulls out just as much gunk than the msx.

 

[mr_x]

Originally Posted by bioneck47
http:///forum/post/2862458
hmm, mine does the same thing but I thought it was only because I have 4 layers of mesh. I'd have to admit that it is very annoying. Now I don't even turn off the skimmer when I take the collection cup off. After hearing your claim, I probably wouldn't recommend this skimmer to a friend. My ASM pulls out just as much gunk than the msx.
i was considering attaching the supplied drain hose to the bottom of the collection cup, and just emptying the collection cup that way, instead of shutting the pumps down, but apparently, the plug only fits the collection cup. it doesn't fit that piece of hose. maybe i'll look for a plug that will work on that hose, so i don't have to remove the collection cup at all.

 

[reefkprz]

unfortunatly relying on the drain hose will decrease skimmer performance overall, washing the cup, when you remove it to dump it, removes the sludge from the lift tube. the sludge is pretty much concentrated skimmate, the longer you leave that in there the more it breaks down and releases dissolved waste back into the water column.

 

[joncat24]

Mr X-- when I empty the cup on my 250, I just take of the cup and clean it while the skimmer is still running. Or, you could lower the water level a bit while cleaning and then adjust it back up when finished.
One other thing you might try---the volutes on the pumps are very tight , you could trun it a 1/4 turn loose and see if you still have start up issues. Also the pumps will quiet down after a couple of weeks as they settle in.

 

[mr_x]

joncat- that doesn't bother you that these pumps do this? since you and MS are in ohio, and only 45 minutes apart, i can't help but wonder if your posts are one of a concerned, informative reefkeeper, or a store employee/owner, trying to make sales.
btw- i just called the toll free help line, and no one answered. maybe they are too busy making posts about their skimmers to answer.

 

[joncat24]

Originally Posted by Mr_X
http:///forum/post/2862580
joncat- that doesn't bother you that these pumps do this? since you and MS are in ohio, and only 45 minutes apart, i can't help but wonder if your posts are one of a concerned, informative reefkeeper, or a store employee/owner, trying to make sales.
btw- i just called the toll free help line, and no one answered. maybe they are too busy making posts about their skimmers to answer.

nope...dont work or own it....just trying to help
I will keep my mouth shut then