Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban

socal57che

Active Member
Originally Posted by jp30338
http:///forum/post/2970180
So everyone that does not own a gun or dislikes them and wants peace over war is a coward?
Yes, you are right I am not willing to die for freedom, that is what we have a volunteer military for

The guys dying in your place, did, in fact do it of free will and clear conscience. I applaud them.
I own guns. I hate war, however, war is a necessity that keeps one person or group from taking over.
 

bionicarm

Active Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2970177
Wow... the Iraqi sun insult again... ouch. It hurt even worse this time... Bionic, any chance you'll ever participate in a civil discussion without trying to personally insult people?
You are wrong, btw.
Article 1, section 8 allowed Congress to provide Letters of Marques to "Privateers".
There are no restrictions listed as to how big of a warship the private citizen could maintain to perform as a Privateer. Thus, a private citizen could in fact have owned a Battleship and been employed by the Congress of the Founding Fathers.
It's not meant as an insult. It's just so far out there, it's just amazing you would make a statement like that.
Where are you coming up with these battleships? Where does it state in Article 1 that it allows private citizens to own battleships? Where are these unlimited restrictions you describe? I assume you're looking at the conditions of this Letter of Marque. You do realize that Congress would have to issue this letter to a 'Privateer' before that individual, or group of individuals, had the authority to operate a vessel under the conditions of the Letter of Marque. You make it sound like I could go commandeer the USS Enterprise and use against anyone I choose. CONGRESS has to give you the authority to own that battleship. The last time Congress used this since the War of 1812, was when they let a group of citizens operate the airship Resolute, to patrol the seas for submarines during the Second World War.
The Letters of Marque were intended as a measure for nations to retaliate against another foreign party that committed some offense under the laws of nations against the assets or citizens of the issuing nation, and has usually been used to authorize private parties to raid and capture merchant shipping of an enemy nation. Kind of a '--- for tat'. It allowed these 'mercenaries' to go beyond the borders of their enemies to search, seize, or destroy an enemy's vessel or fleet.
The Letters of Marque were intended to be used to avoid issuing a full declaration of war against an enemy or someone threatening our nation. Pretty extreme measure if you ask me. So your reasoning is if Congress would use some 'mercinary' to go play pirate for the US, they would certainly have no problem with Joe Citizen owning an AK-47 or Uzi? Our Founding Fathers probably never fathomed that something as deadly as an assault weapon could ever be built. It would be interesting to know what the Framers of the Constitution would've thought if they could see the type of destruction an assault weapon can cause on another human being. If they could, I imagine you'd have a totally different meaning to the phrase 'the right to bear arms'.
 

makorunner013

New Member
Why do civilians need Assault Weapons? BECAUSE IT'S OUR GOD GIVEN RIGHT. If a Woman can Abort a baby, Than I can own an Assault Weapon to protect my Family. The way things are going everyone should be self sufficent and Yes be able to take out a Deer or Two.
 

veni vidi vici

Active Member
Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/2970225
You do realize that Congress would have to issue this letter to a 'Privateer' before that individual, or group of individuals, had the authority to operate a vessel under the conditions of the Letter of Marque.
Kind of like how the architects of the US Constitution granted me The right to bear arms and the assurance that it shall not be infringed upon?
 

fishyfun2

Member
IMO, this all comes back to one simple thing:
Do you really want the government telling you they can make decisions for you because they think you cannot run your own life? The sports car was a good analogy. Also, someone mentioned "who NEEDS assault weapons?" Well, who NEEDS alcohol? Who needs cigarettes? Who needs fast food? All those things can kill not only you, but other people right? (Well, maybe not the fast food, unless you're eating in your car, and crash into someone).
But how far will they go before we have no choices anymore? Besides that, do you really expect the police always be able to save you? Do you know how long it takes them to respond in an emergency?
They take away our rights a little at a time by trying to tell us we are not safe. But if we ban this or stop doing that, they'll be able to take care of us better, yada yada yada.....It's not worth it.
Freedom isn't free.
 

turningtim

Active Member
Bush supporters arguing over Constitutional Law? Strict adherence to the Constitution

Now that's funny.
And whom I wonder could have set such a precedence for these unconstitutional actions?
Of course all in the interest of "Keeping us safe"
 

veni vidi vici

Active Member
Originally Posted by TurningTim
http:///forum/post/2970272
Bush supporters arguing over Constitutional Law? Strict adherence to the Constitution

Now that's funny.
And whom I wonder could have set such a precedence for these unconstitutional actions?
Of course all in the interest of "Keeping us safe"
The liberal losing an argument battle cry
"WELL WHAT ABOUT BUSH......."
 

darthtang aw

Active Member
Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/2970225
Where are you coming up with these battleships?
During the time, slave ships were the armed equivalent of today's battleships. They had to be to fight off pirates and such. Not to mention private competitors. These ships were owned by private citizens in the slave trade.
Also Private citizens built warships before the war of 1812. They owned them. Then during the war of 1812 these citizens gave the ships to the navy for use in the war. but prior to the need in the navy, the citizen owned these ships. 6 of the ships during their time were the equivalent to today's aircraft carrier in terms of fire power. 60-123 cannons were aboard such vessels.
two examples, the first may not be the best, but it proves the point.
 

chilwil84

Active Member
how does the patriot act become the start to losing freedoms that will snowball to worse loses in freedoms work for liberals but when it comes to guns the snowball effect doesnt apply but we have increased gun bans over time making them more broad as time has gone by
 

wattsupdoc

Active Member
Originally Posted by TurningTim
http:///forum/post/2970272
Bush supporters arguing over Constitutional Law? Strict adherence to the Constitution

Now that's funny.
And whom I wonder could have set such a precedence for these unconstitutional actions?
Of course all in the interest of "Keeping us safe"

I am not necessarily a Bush supporter. I just despise Obama..
As well, because I look at things with my eyes wide open, I look past Bush's lack of communication skills. Additionally I appreciate the position he took, and the bashing that came with it. Big ones has he...no? I imagine Yobama would cower under his pit bull wife's skirt under the same situation.
Additionally, I believe the patriot act is constitutional. Did not Obama agree that he would continue the tapping? I also believe that extreme measures may be taken on POW's in order to extract information. Water boarding is tough stuff....But if someone kidnapped your children and you new they knew where they were. You could get them back by water boarding them or listening in on a overseas conversation. They likely would die or be molested otherwise. WOULD YOU DO IT THEN? Or would you just sit there and hope they told you what you needed to know? Maybe if you ask r e a l
nice......
 

wattsupdoc

Active Member
Originally Posted by chilwil84
http:///forum/post/2970302
how does the patriot act become the start to losing freedoms that will snowball to worse loses in freedoms work for liberals but when it comes to guns the snowball effect doesnt apply but we have increased gun bans over time making them more broad as time has gone by
Hypocrites....that's how.
 

wattsupdoc

Active Member

Originally Posted by jp30338
http:///forum/post/2970180
So everyone that does not own a gun or dislikes them and wants peace over war is a coward?
I think everyone wants peace over war. I know I do. Unfortunately, when you leave LALA Land
you find that freedom can only come through war. It is an unfortunate but necessary evil.

Originally Posted by jp30338

http:///forum/post/2970180
Yes, you are right I am not willing to die for freedom, that is what we have a volunteer military for


You do not deserve the freedom you have.
It should be stripped from you. However, my family died by virtue of draft, volunteer
, and necessity to guarantee you have your freedom. The brave will fight for the cowards I suppose. Just cower there in your little corner and lash out every now and then....doesn't seem much like freedom to me.
 

kjr_trig

Active Member
I am the furthest thing from an Obama supporter there is on most subjects, but if a ban on assault weapons even saves one kid from getting shot in a school because "Timmy" brought Daddy's pistol for his school shooting instead of Daddy's M-4, I'm all for it.
 

wattsupdoc

Active Member
I have a few weapons. My 22 riffle holds 15 shots. Most crime related shootings occur with a 22 cal bullet. Many assualt rifles are of the same similar caliper. .223, .220 etc. Now theres more powder behind them, but a .22 mag is pretty close. I can fire 15 rounds off pretty dad gum quick with it. Same as with an assault rifle. Yes the AR holds more ammo but it's still very similar. Now my Barretta 9 mm is a semi auto also. I have 4 mags for it. I can drop a mag and reload in 2 seconds. The action remains locked open between mags and with a flip theres another in the chamber. FAST....I can purchase as many mags as I wish for this hand gun. It fires flawlessly and has never jammed on me once. I own 2, 10 round mags and 2 15 round mags. Under the ban, the 15 round mags are illegal, but the 10's are not. Why is that? What is the point in that? I can easily go buy 40 more 10 round mags if I want. Then be able to load and fire 400 rounds off with out a HITCH. I can also buy another if I like and then fire these simultanously. A couple good holsters and I can still load and reload while firing if need be. This is IMO more danger to anyone I may want to threaten than a weapon that will not allow one to carry another and fire simultaneously. So again I ask WHY? Whats the point?
An assault weapon IS NOT GENERALLY A FULLY AUTOMATIC WEAPON PEOPLE!
AKA a machine gun. These can and are from time to time used for hunting.
What about high powered weapons designed for shooting targets from extreme distances with precision...AKA Sniper rifles
....Why does anyone need one of those? Arent those a danger to us? Didnt we recently have a murdering spree using one of these? Killing at random? Maybe we should include that in the bill.
My 22.250 would be classified under this. It is an awesome lil gun. The bullet is sooo fast it will do nearly 3/4 of a mile in 1 SECOND. It's sooo flat shooting I can hit a tennis ball at 400 yards. What do I need it for?
 

wattsupdoc

Active Member
Originally Posted by kjr_trig
http:///forum/post/2970415
I am the furthest thing from an Obama supporter there is on most subjects, but if a ban on assault weapons even saves one kid from getting shot in a school because "Timmy" brought Daddy's pistol for his school shooting instead of Daddy's M-4, I'm all for it.
Wouldnt it be better if "Timmy's" teacher shot and killed Timmy before he was able to kill anyone?
 

bionicarm

Active Member
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW
http:///forum/post/2970287
During the time, slave ships were the armed equivalent of today's battleships. They had to be to fight off pirates and such. Not to mention private competitors. These ships were owned by private citizens in the slave trade.
Also Private citizens built warships before the war of 1812. They owned them. Then during the war of 1812 these citizens gave the ships to the navy for use in the war. but prior to the need in the navy, the citizen owned these ships. 6 of the ships during their time were the equivalent to today's aircraft carrier in terms of fire power. 60-123 cannons were aboard such vessels.
two examples, the first may not be the best, but it proves the point.
That's well and good for that period of time. Journey's talking like you or I could go out tomorrow, rig up a boat with 50mm cannons, and legally run around the Gulf or ocean in the thing ready to shoot anything and everything in site.
 

bionicarm

Active Member

Originally Posted by wattsupdoc
http:///forum/post/2970455
I have a few weapons. My 22 riffle holds 15 shots. Most crime related shootings occur with a 22 cal bullet. Many assualt rifles are of the same similar caliper. .223, .220 etc. Now theres more powder behind them, but a .22 mag is pretty close. I can fire 15 rounds off pretty dad gum quick with it. Same as with an assault rifle. Yes the AR holds more ammo but it's still very similar. Now my Barretta 9 mm is a semi auto also. I have 4 mags for it. I can drop a mag and reload in 2 seconds. The action remains locked open between mags and with a flip theres another in the chamber. FAST....I can purchase as many mags as I wish for this hand gun. It fires flawlessly and has never jammed on me once. I own 2, 10 round mags and 2 15 round mags. Under the ban, the 15 round mags are illegal, but the 10's are not. Why is that? What is the point in that? I can easily go buy 40 more 10 round mags if I want. Then be able to load and fire 400 rounds off with out a HITCH. I can also buy another if I like and then fire these simultanously. A couple good holsters and I can still load and reload while firing if need be. This is IMO more danger to anyone I may want to threaten than a weapon that will not allow one to carry another and fire simultaneously. So again I ask WHY? Whats the point?

An assault weapon IS NOT GENERALLY A FULLY AUTOMATIC WEAPON PEOPLE!
AKA a machine gun. These can and are from time to time used for hunting.
What about high powered weapons designed for shooting targets from extreme distances with precision...AKA Sniper rifles
....Why does anyone need one of those? Arent those a danger to us? Didnt we recently have a murdering spree using one of these? Killing at random? Maybe we should include that in the bill.
My 22.250 would be classified under this. It is an awesome lil gun. The bullet is sooo fast it will do nearly 3/4 of a mile in 1 SECOND. It's sooo flat shooting I can hit a tennis ball at 400 yards. What do I need it for?

The ban is realted to SPECIFIC weapons. Look up the list to see which one's they are. It would be difficult if not impossible for Congress to ban all semi-automatic weapons.
Do you have a problem with them banning 'cop killer' bullets?
 

socal57che

Active Member
Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/2970578
The ban is realted to SPECIFIC weapons. Look up the list to see which one's they are. It would be difficult if not impossible for Congress to ban all semi-automatic weapons.
Do you have a problem with them banning 'cop killer' bullets?
Whoa!!! You mean some bullets just bounce off?!! Someone should tell the cops that body armor is now obsolete!
"cop killer"??? Come on. That's absurd.
Why ban them at all? Bans don't work, unless you are trying to disarm law abiding citizens.
I have never ambushed people from the bushes at McDonalds drive through with my black rifle. Taking my black rifle from me WILL NOT SAVE ANY LIVES. PERIOD!
Heres an article written by a POLICE OFFICER regarding supposed cop killer ammo...
http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcgvcopk.html
"Despite the facts that "KTW" ammunition had never been available to the general public and that no police officer has ever been killed by a handgun bullet penetrating their body armor, the media incorrectly reported that the Teflon coated bullets were designed to defeat the body armor that law enforcement officers were beginning to use. The myth of "Cop-killer" bullets was born."
 
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