-=Political Opinions=-

[jlem]

Originally posted by ka0z4allu
Also your government could easily give tax breaks to companies and consumers who chose to manufacture and purchase American made products!:thinking:
Companies could pay no taxes and it would still be a ton cheaper to produce goods overseas because of how little people are payed, litterally pennies to our dollars.

 

[tony detroit]

Originally posted by jlem
Companies could pay no taxes and it would still be a ton cheaper to produce goods overseas because of how little people are payed, litterally pennies to our dollars.
Taxes are the reason for the prices being higher. Our cost of living is higher. Have you ever payed 300 a week to pay your property taxes? Just your property taxes. Then another 150 a week for utlities? That is 450 a week you must net after taxes. I haven't even put food, transportation, gasoline, entertainment, maintenance expenses, luxury expenses, and savings into the picture. That is 450 after taxes, which would be you would have to gross around 600, maybe a little higher, JUST to pay your utilities and property taxes. There are single apartments in Chicago that start at 1000/month. Work is not a hobby, we go to make money. When I have 30,000 of my takehome dollars going to taxes, and you are claiming that if you cut tax cost that we would still not be cheaper I find that hard to believe. All of these taxes we pay, all of the government programs we are supporting are eating the citizens alive. What is happening right now Warren Buffet has stated is that the American Dollar is coming on par to being equal with the rest of the world, because our cost is so far out of control. Now this is fine and dandy if you can support yourself on 5 bucks a day like in other countries, but it is not getting it here.If I GAVE an Indian man this house he could not afford it, but if he makes 15K US currency in India he is the man, because of the difference in cost of living, directly related to all of the taxes your dollar incurs, before and after gross pay. I do not know why you cannot grasp this jlem, do you seriously not see how this works?

 

[ka0z4allu]

I agree with you Tony. I mean people still have to understand that money is only made of paper. Greed is what makes it valuable. We were quick to go to war over weapons of mass destruction which were never found, and this war has and still is costing us a tremendous amount of money. Financed by U.S. Taxpayers of whom have no choice as to help fund this war. We could have waged a war on poverty, which is clearly visible here in the United States (right under our noses). But clearly the decision makers of this country are not living in poverty so helping those in need only matter to them during election time.:nope:

 

[salty cheese]

Originally posted by Reef_Magic
but the point still stands....their roads their rules.
Don't you mean our roads, who paid for the roads? The infrastructure of this country was paid for by the taxes that you and I payout every year.

 

[ka0z4allu]

I agree cheese. By the way thats a killer avatar

 

[jlem]

Originally posted by tony detroit
Taxes are the reason for the prices being higher. Our cost of living is higher. Have you ever payed 300 a week to pay your property taxes?
Do you realize how much your house would have to be worth to pay that much in property taxes. It would be over a million dollars. If you could afford a million dollar house then you could afford the taxes. You are making this all up right Tony, I mean come on man you are becoming comical at best. You are giving my friends and I some humor to brighten up our day

 

[jlem]

Originally posted by ka0z4allu
We could have waged a war on poverty,
By making the Goverment a soup kitchen. that would be great for our countries future. All that would do is make our youth a bunch of bums when they grew up. I would quit my job in a heart beat if the Goverment wiped my but after I took a crap and spoon fed me gourmet food, but then again people like you and Tony would complain that it was not Charmin or double quilted. Their is no pleasing people like you because you never take resonsability for anything that pertains to you. It is always someone elses fault and :notsure:

 

[krowleey]

hahahaha :hilarious :hilarious :hilarious

 

[dicemanj]

Jlem - tony. I was just doing the math on the 300 weekly taxes, and was coming to the conclusion that the house is worth about 1,000,000, unless detroit has that much higher taxes as oppossed to Columbus, and I know that is not the case. If you don't have a 1,000,000 home, and are still paying 300 week in taxes, I would consult someone.
The jobs that are being outsourced to other countries to make Nikes, would be low paying jobs anyway. Are you telling me that people can't find a minimum wage job now? I thought everyone was complaining about walmart and all the low paying jobs they have, you want to bring more of these jobs now.
I think you are playing both sides of the fence on this one. Or maybe we should export all of the walmart greaters to other countries and conference them into large TV monitors as you walk in.

 

[tony detroit]

Grosse Ile Michigan, 850,000.
A town with a population roughly over 11000, and a yearly budget over 21million.

 

[dicemanj]

I am cunfussed again, you complain about having to work to hard and to many hours, couldn't you work half the time and have a $425,000 house, I think that would still be a respectable house in a respectable neigborhood?
Do the people in other countries that work 30 hours, with 6 weeks vacation live in similar houses, with similar life style, cars, clothes, furniture, tvs, computeres? I doubt it.
I am not saying you don't deserve it, if you work hard and have a great job you most definately deserve it, but don't complain about working to hard, to long, and too much in property taxes.

 

[tony detroit]

That is not my house, it is my parent's house. It's about 4500 where I'm at yearly. I'm just pissed because if they were to die today and give me that house that I grew up in I would have a hard time affording it. The people that buy it are going to have to pay around 450 a week to make property taxes. That is what is pissing me off. People work their whole lives, retire and then the state seizes their house because their social security doesn't even put a dent in their bills. Meanwhile all the boys in congress, states, law enforcement, etc. and over 2 million government employees get a pension plan as good as when they were working. Some of them start drawing as early as 55 years old, even earlier sometimes.
Funny if your government actually cared about you, why would they put themselves on a totally seperate retirement pension fund, that you can not come anywhere close to?
I'm not whining about my life, like I said before, I live like a king, I have a problem with people that work their whole live and have to give up their house that that worked so dearly for.

 

[jlem]

Originally posted by tony detroit
The people that buy it are going to have to pay around 450 a week to make property taxes. That is what is pissing me off. People work their whole lives, retire and then the state seizes their house because their social security doesn't even put a dent in their bills.
You have got to be joking right. It pisses you off because the people who will pay 2 million dollars for your parents house will have to spend 24 thousand in taxes. The people probably will spend more money on fancy toilet paper. If someone is living off and counting on social security then I highly doubt that they will live in a million dollar home anyways. Your examples are just goofy dude. I love reading your views man, it really does make me smile

 

[tony detroit]

So are you saying if your parents GAVE you the house you grew up in and it bankrupted anybody making less than 125,000 a year payed off mind you, you do not see any problem with that?

 

[tony detroit]

Originally posted by jlem
Your examples are just goofy dude.
Right.
Your examples have included:
1. we work less than anybody else, not true
2. the feds care about the public, not true
3. things "magically" cost more in the U.S., true, but there is reason
---carry on professor I am very interested.

 

[ka0z4allu]

It is true that things cost more in the U.S.
And to me it sounds like jlem is a firm believer that there has to be poor and homeless people in america in order for the economy to run right. I disagree with that and can tell you that if the government would spend more time trying to better peoples lives instead of ruining someones entire life for smoking marijuana, then you would see a shift in the way people act and I think it would be for the better. And yes there are programs out there for people, but they are mostly in place to fatten the pockets of the "program heads". There is a reason that the U.S. has such a high crime rate and overcrowded jails and resolution comes from education not locking someone up over petty things. I am a young guy but I have already started to get a grip on this game we play here in our country. I have decided to play along with it for the sake of my family, but I do think there is a better way and I am going to try to make this a better place for my children, as well as the rest of these kids in america who have a grim future ahead of them, thanks to politics, corruption, and greed!:nope:

 

[jlem]

Originally posted by ka0z4allu
And to me it sounds like jlem is a firm believer that there has to be poor and homeless people in america in order for the economy to run right.
I believe that the Govt should not be a soup kitchen for people who have made bad decisions. You said that you have chosen to play the game so you suppport how the govt works. Your kids will see that you are a supporter and they will follow your example and embrace our goverment as well. You may not like the goverment but you obviously do not have strong enough convictions that will cause you to move anywhere else supposably better. I think is is funny that everyones convictions are so strong that they stand buy and watch.

 

[tony detroit]

Do you think that every man/woman should be able to work while their significant other stays at home with the kids and has plenty of spending money, retirement money, savings, and recreational money?
I am asking because this is very uncommon these days, and at the rate things are going, stay at home moms/dads are going to be unheard of. This frightens me.
As far as people making bad decisions goes, yes it happens. I am sure you have made bad decisions as well as have I and everybody else here. However I still believe children need a stay at home parent, regardless of decisioin making, a good funding for education, and good parenting/home life. Children are the future. The earlier years of their life are very important for many psychological factors that take place affecting the later years of their lives.
Regardless of what is going on with economy, energy, war, etc. Children need good parenting, and nowadays parents are having really hard times making ends meet, affording college tuition, etc. Only corporate America it seems is really making it.
Everybody else is having such a hard time breaking even. For them it sucks, and yes jlem you are right, mistakes do affect things down the road, but you should be able to get back on your feet financially. Once a guy has 2 kids, it's pretty much all over for him, he's most likely going to stay where he's at. Kaoz4allu is right, you pretty much have to play the game and win where you can.
my 2cents
have a good weekend guys

 

[cincyreefer]

Survival of the fittest.... It will happen whether we want it or not.

 

[tangman99]

I see this is still going pretty strong and everyone seems to have made some really good points. One thing that comes to mind that most people are missing is education. I don't mean formal school education, I mean the education you need to succeed financially that you won't get in a classroom.
Let me give you an example. I grew up in a very small town of less than 1000 people. My dad worked and my mom stayed home and I had no idea a private school even existed. I received what I needed, but there were not many extras. I followed the trend of my area and married young out of highschool and went into law enforcement in a much bigger town. I started at 19 and was making $15,000 a year. My wife worked as a clerk in the courthouse for around $10,000 a year. We got by ok, but like most of America we lived paycheck to paycheck for many years. I lived this life for over 10 years and managed to go to College and get a degree during this time also because I wanted more.
With hard work and some risks (you don't get anywhere without some level of risk) my life changed to another level. I have a new wife (law enforcement is really tough on a marriage) who works in a professional field with me. We both worked in a professional field and we made good money. However I noticed that the situation had not really changed. The house was bigger, the cars were nicer and the places we ate were fancier, but we still lived paycheck to paycheck.
I read some financial books and started looking at ways to improve my situation. The first thing I discovered is that wealth is not how much you make, it's how much you keep. The second discovery I made was you never get wealthy working for someone else and the last thing I learned was that there are others ways to make money other than employment.
Time for a huge risk. My wife has a great job with great benefits so my benefits were not really needed. Sure the 401k is attractive and the life insurance they provided, but you can do this yourself. I quit my job, formed my own company and went to work for myself. I did this in the heart of a bad economy and working in the computer consulting field so I did have some stretches without work. Instead of wasting the additonal money I made, I saved it and starting investing it in the stockmarket which is really not that hard to do and make money. The key was trying to keep the aquarium the same size as before.
Having my own company was the biggest education of all. You get tax allowances that you never knew existed. I still pay income taxes, but I get a lot more allowances for what I have to report. I only pay a very small percentage of the Social Security taxes and FICA that I would pay if I made the same money working for someone else. Is it right? In some ways it seems unfair, but in others it makes perfect sense. Either way, it's there and I take advantage of it as it is all perfectly legal.
My point is that I can look back on three levels of my life and at each level, I thought I was doing the best I could do until I put a little more thought into it and educated myself a little more. I had no advantages growing up and was not born into money. No one showed me the way to make money and said if you do this, you can do much better. I spent years improving my own situation by going to College at night while working a full time job and having the motivation to want to do more. Many were born to much more than I and have achieved much less and there are a few that were born to much less and have achieved much more.
Life is not fair and 90% of what you achieve in it is directly up to you and 10% is luck. Even if someone gives you all the opportunity in the world and handouts, unless you have the motiviation to keep in alive and move forward with it, it won't last.
So is the American Dream still alive? I guess that depends on where you are looking at it from. I believe it is very much alive, but it's not a gift to be handed to someone. It has to be earned. Not everyone will achieve it, but at least we live in a country where you have a chance to try at it as hard as you would like to achieve it.
My .02 cents.