Pot Bellied Seahorses

novahobbies

novahobbies

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flower http:///t/391007/pot-bellied-seahorses#post_3465884
I did indeed find David...he has been so helpful. He has also made keeping pot belly horses sound like it's going to a fantastic fun thing to do. So I can get margarita snails, that's great to hear. If any other critters are useful please let me know...I really want to set this tank up right, I want as few bumps as possible. Seems cold water marine tanks are few and far between and not much information is on them. It took me a while to figure out what macros can grow in the cold.
I'm really glad you found some knowledgeable cold water people....I'm as much of a true coldwater newb as you...even more so, as you have already started your research. Let's face it, 72 degree tanks are hardly cold.....pretty much any tropical coral can handle these temps, albeit at slower metabolisms. I'm learning by example with your adventure here!
Sorry if I'm being quiet as well....this week is going to be another fun one. Just got home an hour ago, and I really don't have much energy to do much but sit in front of the boob tube and let my head cave in a little. I really need to go do a water change....
**edited because I realized I sounded like a jerk...**
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by novahobbies http:///t/391007/pot-bellied-seahorses/20#post_3465960
I'm really glad you found some knowledgeable cold water people....I'm as much of a true coldwater newb as you...even more so, as you have already started your research. Let's face it, 72 degree tanks are hardly cold.....pretty much any tropical coral can handle these temps, albeit at slower metabolisms. I'm learning by example with your adventure here!
Sorry if I'm being quiet as well....this week is going to be another fun one. Just got home an hour ago, and I really don't have much energy to do much but sit in front of the boob tube and let my head cave in a little. I really need to go do a water change....
**edited because I realized I sounded like a jerk...**
I so hear you...I am so tired and the kids did most of the work...LOL
The fish, coral and snails are re-homed at a nice LFS...now to scrape down the tank of the coraline on the sides and add freshwater to the rocks and sand. TOMORROW..I'm too tired to lift a toe. Mother went to the store so she didn't have to watch.
After I moved everything ...the tank was ocean green mud by the time I chased the fish down to catch, so when I get home from taking everythigf in...the water had cleared and there was a reef chromis I had missed, so I had to make an extra trip just for him. I must of miscounted, I thought I had 9 fish...I had 10. I still have some snails in there...I will just put them in the 56g...any stary hermits will have to die. We had a half gallon baggie full of shelled critters....every rock is loaded with coraline, even the lower tier...mostly that dark red. That's why the tank seemed so dark looking.
So the biggest hardest part is complete. I like setting new tanks up so that part will be fun. I'm wondering if I should make a spraybar return like I have on the other SH tank.
Going cold water is really no different than the tropical...just that I have to make sure everything I get is for the chillier temp. Margarita snails will do just fine, a CUC was a concern I hadn't considered until I started. I like to have a plan layed out and that kind of caught me off guard. I expect to not need them for a while, but I know where to get them...they need lots of algae from what I read.
I already have the macros ordered. I can put them in the 56g sump until the 90g is ready. When it comes to macros I have learned to get it while the getting is good. I waited nearly 6 months for botryocladia. That macro site sells them according to the season. when I first set up my SH tank it was for sale, but by the time I was ready to order a few weeks later...it was out of stock. Even right now most stuff is unavailable...Because of the time of year the Codium and Sargassum are in, and I got 3 of each, which should be plenty to get them started.
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Al&Burke http:///t/391007/pot-bellied-seahorses/20#post_3465987
You have been busy Flower how long before you get the PBSH
I have to wait for the tank to cycle and the rock and sand to cure. When it comes to that, only the tests can tell. Then the only place so far to get them is Hawaii, for $145.00 each and I want 4, I also want to add the horses all at one time. $580.00 plus shipping. LOL...I must be crazy....I'm hoping for May. I'm also still digging for where else to get CB horses. It would sure be nice for Seahorse source to get some in...they only want $70.00 per horse...They directed me to Hawaii, so I don't have my hopes up too much for that....but by May?????....
I have never cured live rock (I have always purchased locally already cured)...can I use tap water or do I use RO?
 
novahobbies

novahobbies

Well-Known Member
I would use RO. Too many "what-if's" in tap water. You're just using the fresh RO water to kill off the internal fauna, yes?
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by novahobbies http:///t/391007/pot-bellied-seahorses/20#post_3466054
I would use RO. Too many "what-if's" in tap water. You're just using the fresh RO water to kill off the internal fauna, yes?
Yes...LOL..I can't tell you how much it bothers me to kill live rock...$10.00 a pound and I'm going to kill it. I was thinking RO too...thanks. I have never had to cure rock. I have a power head to prevent it going stagnant. It really smells fishy this morning (out in a tub just dry) I want to move the tub to the back porch...I'm worried about skitter larva, should I be...what do you thnk?
 
S

saxman

Guest
FWIW, I don't agree with David's opinion of killing off LR unless there's a problem with it.
 
novahobbies

novahobbies

Well-Known Member
skitter larvae?? OH......SKEETER larvae. Yes, they can grow in salt water just as easily as fresh, so it would be something to be concerned about.
Maybe I'm dense, but I don't know why the LR killing MUST be done. What critters do you have in there? Bristle worms? Very hardy, not bad for the system, and the few that may die off will probably just be eaten by the rest....they're not picky. Pods.....well, you want them anyway, and Tisbe pods can live in a variety of temps and salinities. Heck, sonce you're in the low 60's, you can probably try some tigger pods in the sump and see how the populations grows. Same goes for most every kind of isopod and amphi that we keep. You'll have SOME die-off, but not a whole lot.
If you were worried about the possibility of pathogen transfer, that would be one thing....but you'd have to fully boil and bleach the rock in the sun in that case anyway. I dunno. I'm a newb with this, but I just don't see the "logical" reason to kill the LR.
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by novahobbies http:///t/391007/pot-bellied-seahorses/20#post_3466139
skitter larvae?? OH......SKEETER larvae. Yes, they can grow in salt water just as easily as fresh, so it would be something to be concerned about.
Maybe I'm dense, but I don't know why the LR killing MUST be done. What critters do you have in there? Bristle worms? Very hardy, not bad for the system, and the few that may die off will probably just be eaten by the rest....they're not picky. Pods.....well, you want them anyway, and Tisbe pods can live in a variety of temps and salinities. Heck, sonce you're in the low 60's, you can probably try some tigger pods in the sump and see how the populations grows. Same goes for most every kind of isopod and amphi that we keep. You'll have SOME die-off, but not a whole lot.
If you were worried about the possibility of pathogen transfer, that would be one thing....but you'd have to fully boil and bleach the rock in the sun in that case anyway. I dunno. I'm a newb with this, but I just don't see the "logical" reason to kill the LR.

LOL..Mosquito ...looked like for some reason should be spelled skitter...my spell check likes skitter, but skeeter it red flagged...it's a made up word for what I used it for, so who cares????

I put the tub outside wioth a cloth cover so it can breath but not allow bugs in.
Concerning die off....To be perfectly honest I have to kind of agree with you, being on this site I have picked up the same mind-frame. HOWEVER, if you ask for help, and not take the advice from he who is an expert..... why bother the poor fellow? I hate when new folks on this site do that to people.
Originally my guru kept wanting me to go get "new" rock. I told him my rock if I killed it was just as "new" He eventually relented and accepted my argument. He also does not want me to use the dead on the rock to create my cycle nor a dead chunk of shrimp. He wants me to go to the grocery store and get some ammonia and then get some liquid bacteria and cycle the tank that way.
I have pods in the refugium, which right now has a bubble line to it...it is offline. I haven't decided my line of action yet on that. The bristle worms in that section won't hurt the horses...but do bristle worm larva travel? I am going to look it up to see...if not then I don't think it would be so bad to keep the refugium off line and aerated until I am ready for it....then let it run when the system is up.
I just looked it up...yep the larva travel. so the refugium can't be salvaged either. So I have tonights chore....I'm glad the grandkids are here to do the running for me, to dump the water out of the bucket.
The chiller arrived today. it's still in the box. I'm still filling the rock tub with fresh RO water.
 
novahobbies

novahobbies

Well-Known Member
That's because "skitter" is a word. As in,
"The foul, nameless thing detached itself from the shadows behind the door. It skittered quickly across the floor on dirty, cracked claws that jutted out from its body at unnatural angles. The clicking sounds its talons made against the cold tile invaded her dreams, making her toss uneasily in her bed. Slowly the thing pulled its ponderous bulk up the side of the bed, ripping into the sheets as it gained purchase. Mismatched eyes peered down at the sleeping form, and broken tusks clacked together in anticipation as it reached one spindly leg out to prod the morsel awake....."
OK. You get the idea. Sleep tight tonight.
 
novahobbies

novahobbies

Well-Known Member
He's basically telling you to start with a completely 100% sterile system, like you would with dwarf horses. I've read about the ammonia cycling trick from Theresa (AFTER I cycled my tank with a dead frozen fish) and it sounds as valid as any cycle routine. Keep postin'!
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by novahobbies http:///t/391007/pot-bellied-seahorses/20#post_3466173
That's because "skitter" is a word. As in,
"The foul, nameless thing detached itself from the shadows behind the door. It skittered quickly across the floor on dirty, cracked claws that jutted out from its body at unnatural angles. The clicking sounds its talons made against the cold tile invaded her dreams, making her toss uneasily in her bed. Slowly the thing pulled its ponderous bulk up the side of the bed, ripping into the sheets as it gained purchase. Mismatched eyes peered down at the sleeping form, and broken tusks clacked together in anticipation as it reached one spindly leg out to prod the morsel awake....."
OK. You get the idea. Sleep tight tonight.

Did you make that up!...I want the rest of the story! LOL...I love that kind of stuff. Maybe we can make a game of it and let folks add to it...
In MY version the "I" in Skitter is a long "E" sound, but now that you explained the meaning I get it...
Yes David wants no surprises living in the tank with the horses.
I have been doing my homework too....The shock of salt, then fresh, then salt should kill absolutly everything, including bacteria since you rinse the salt bacteria colonies away with freshwater, then before the freshwater colonies can take hold you bombard the system with saltwater again...nothing can live thru that....it will cleanse the system entirely. The dead decaying critters still have to break down so I have to cure the rock and sand.
I have my pumps all sitting in vinegar water after a good freshwater scrub with a brush. I will rinse them super good and resoak in clear water and then let them dry real good and give them a test before adding them back to the tank. We took a scraper to the coraline on the sides and back of the tank...I'm afraid those purple and red concreate spots are there to stay.
Going from reef temps to cold temps won't kill everything, however the cold will cause bacteria to grow really slow. I want to do what I read on Wet Web Media to start the new cold water marine tank...allow the colony to develope in room temp water, so the bacteria can take hold and get going. Once the colony is begun (a full cycle after adding ammonia)...to drop the temp a degree each day so everything adapts to the cold unharmed. The tank will then be good and stable for life to be added.
I also have been thinking of the decor...I was looking at some big branch type fake resin thing at PetSmart...I want to use it upside down like I have the picture...a couple of these in the rocks, I think would look pretty good and give some height and something for the horses to hitch to...what do you think? I have seen a few different versions of this.
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Okay...I have the ammonia. A half gallon of it, and I have no idea how much to use for what I want to do. There are no instructions on the back for how to kick start a fish tank cycle....LOL...So how much to kick start the cycle on a 90g tank with a 24g sump?
I have been looking at this chiller, and it too says to use a filter before the water goes into it. I think I may use a canister for that purpose. Since the very life of the pots depend on the chiller, I think I should take all procautions I can to keep it up and running according to the instructions.
I have the 24g sump...I could take only the 18g refugium out, but leave the hose...just use the valve to keep it off line so the hose is still in place. (I hate to break up my sump set, and that way I can re-add it at any time) and put the canister there and the Chiller outside of the stand beside the tank. The only thing I will run in the canister will be the white filiment to filter out all the big stuff before going to the chiller and I have a nice spraybar that will work good up top.
That way at least I still have the sump for my skimmer, ATO and other items I want out of sight....I really hate to lose that extra 18g of water and the refugium. However pros and cons, the canister will serve me better for now. I will keep my eyes peeled for a stand I can set next to the tank to house the canister and chiller...then I can re-attach my refugium. I wish I was handy like you Nova, then I could make myself something.
I am removing my rock from the fresh RO water tub and setting it out to dry. I will only cure the pieces I need, and store the rest.
 
S

saxman

Guest
You want to add the ammonia until you have a 0.1 ppm reading. Dan and a few others use this method, so you can ask him about how much to use.
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by saxman http:///t/391007/pot-bellied-seahorses/20#post_3466270
You want to add the ammonia until you have a 0.1 ppm reading. Dan and a few others use this method, so you can ask him about how much to use.
I did and I'm waiting for an answer, David made it sound like he wanted me to do it all at once...add a certain amount of ammonia and biozyme at the same time. Problem is I found the dry biozyme not the liquid and he said he had trouble with the dry working for him. The only liquid bacteria I can find is that cycle stuff, I wonder if that will work. I may be able to order some from Aquaripure...he has liquid bacteria he sells for the filters.
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Main tank is cleaned up..I'm off to Walmart for jugs of water to refill it, I'm going to mix the saltwater in the tank this time around. I have my daughter and her kids here (teens) and they can do all the heavy lifting for me. I'm going to swing by the pet store and see about those resin branches. I put the macros that arrived today into the 56g for now. The codium looks awesome...real dark green with branches. The tank is 73 degrees (the warmest it can stand) but it should be fine in there until I am ready to transfer it to the 90g.
I found a cycling section on Seahorse.org with instructions on how to use the ammonia so I should be good to go on that. I'm looking for the liquid bacteria too. That section also says to use my rock and the decay will begin the cycle and it says to kick start and get good bacteria by using some sand from another tank along with the ammonia... The same thing we do on this site....I was surprised to see that.
I'm beginning to think using my rock and sand is no big deal as long as I make sure it's dead with no bad creatures in and on it....bacteria is bacteria.
 
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